Frenzy Barb! Patch Notes!

[DieHarder-11668]

@Rage-13139

Hey DH, I’m not sure what you mean. Are you talking about Azurewrath? And what do you mean by AoE? Do you mean Area Damage? If so, then AD is a primary stat, and freeze chance is secondary, so they don’t compete…

Anyway, I think 25% freeze from AZ is plenty, so you don’t need it anywhere else. If you weren’t using AZ and were trying to accumulate some hard CC in the places you could roll it, you could get 2.6% on each weapon, 5.1% on a belt, and 5.1% on gloves, which works out to about a 14.6% stun/freeze chance. But, those are all tough rolls to get.

Thx for the response. I wrote AoE, but I meant AD. I should have been clearer. If one is using a Oathkeeper with Sankis (or any other alternative apart from AZ), which roll would be most beneficial, AD or Freeze%. If you could only choose one or the other.

[Rage-13139]

AD. Freeze on a weapon is a very low %. But: let me say again that those rolls don’t conflict at all. You could have freeze and AD.

What’s on your mind?

[Jrkwrks-1508]

Thank you for the move. I had recalled reading something earlier that led me to believe bastion was only affected by AD by up to about 39% which led me to believe it was moot to stack. I sincerely apologize if I led anyone astray.

I did a little bit of reading to figure out where I got that notion & instead of reading all of the ptr feedback (again) I found what I think I had misconstrued early on:

From Free in the PTR feedback initial analysis:

In addition, the “chaining” effect definitely procs both Bloodshed and Swords to Ploughshares. **For Bloodshed, the result (assuming you’ve got optimal CHC + CHD rolls) is that Bloodshed procs deal about 37% of the total damage you’ve dealt via Frenzy, as an AOE.

My bad. That completely changes things. In that case, with the https://ptr.d3planner.com/655377009 setup switch AD from all resist on shoulders and roll AD on weapons over Str. The loss of Str on the weapons is huge, but has the possibility to scale better dependent on the other multipliers present. Though despite that rushed band aid on that idea, in the little pockets of time I took over the last couple days to type this out, I had some thoughts in mind regarding DPS but need more time to go through numbers and looking at different setups before going into detail on the offensive front. Below is on defense.

I have been messing around with the planner as far as mitigation trying to deduce if a greater gain from armor & all resist could make up for the lack of DR affixes. With the more items needed to keep damage up, it’s hard to get beyond the constant 92% DR from BoM & HK90 (up 96% with EW when moving, or 93.2%/95.24% elites with Aughilds, 96.6%/97.62% elites with both factored)

Where I’m getting at is given Wotb is not as stable as ww/rend to go higher than that, with constant BoM (80%), SGiant (50%), 2pc (50%), CC (28%) = 96.4% DR. This allows ww/rend the flexibility to not worry too much on the all resist, leaving it in the range to be sparing of at best almost 1200 AR, if less for 75-77% DR. It would never gain over time with paragon. Running numbers, here is what I found…mind you this is not with EW as it’s DR does not account when still, aka attacking. The goal is to see how much AR would be needed to accommodate the loss of the extra 50% DR modifier (wotb) along with 15% from AA & 60% H90 in comparison to 50% (WW) with CC’s 28%.

Using these variables:
Combined DR from WW/CC & HK’s setups - Wastes DR: 96.4%, H90 DR: 92%, H90A (aughilds) DR: 93.2%, H90AE (aug’s vs elite) DR: 95.24
Resist values - 1108 AR DR: 76%, 1984 AR DR: 85%, 2400 AR DR 87.23%

Combining armor, AR & DR:

armor—Wastes 76%–H 85%–HA 85%–HAE 85%

• 15k—99.837-----99.773—99.807—99.865
• 20k—.871--------.821-------.848-------.894
• 25k—.894--------.853-------.875-------.912
• 30k—.91----------.875-------.893-------.925
• 40k—.931--------.903-------.918-------.943
• 50k—.944--------.922-------.933-------.953
• 60k—.952--------.934-------.944-------.961
• 70k—.959--------.943-------.951-------.966
• 80k—.964--------.95---------.957-------.97
• 90k—.968--------.955-------.962-------.973
• 100k–.971-------.959-------.966-------.976

1894 All resist is a reasonable number to reach with a priority spread to all resist & impunity for H90, but as you can see H90 alone underperforms by a decent margin when compared to Wastes. However with aughilds the difference from without it is about half on either side of wastes; .005% under against normal mobs and .005% above for elites…at 100k armor. Before that the ratio is large going from .008-.014% below & above.

For normal mobs to be mitigated just the same as Wastes (and I mean just the exact same scaling) with H90 w/ AA, you need 2400 AR. Doable, but you would have to lose several rolls of vitality or DPS rolls to achieve it. Not worth it.

If you decide to go the dodge route with lower resists, you’re going to need another DR modifier, be it sankis, EW while in motion (which is not reliable when dealing dmg shortly after moving again), unity, IP or another. With a dps focused slot being used instead, you have to account elsewhere, ie resists. Though with the dodge route let me ask this: if facing a reflect Elite/minion, is the reflected damage element the same as yours or simply physical?

[Rage-13139]

A few notes:

1. Yep, WW is better than H90. That’s a given.

2. But:

@Jrkwrks-1508

ww/rend to go higher than that, with constant BoM (80%), SGiant (50%), 2pc (50%), CC (28%) = 96.4% DR.

Keep in mind the highest pushes with WW don’t use BoM, and not many players use both BoM and CC.

3. And:

@Jrkwrks-1508

If you decide to go the dodge route with lower resists, you’re going to need another DR modifier

People are currently using Azurewrath with APDs, which adds a considerable amount of toughness in density.

@Jrkwrks-1508

Though with the dodge route let me ask this: if facing a reflect Elite/minion, is the reflected damage element the same as yours or simply physical?

I believe reflect is always physical.

[Meteorblade-2266]

@Rage-13139

You might want to give some thought to trying out the Aughild setup (swap CoE for RoRG, wear Aughild Bracer + Shoulder).

Oh, joy. Time to farm some more bounties I guess.

[Rage-13139]

Haha, I hear you, bro!

I only play SSF and bounties are painful.

[DieHarder-11668]

@Rage-13139

What’s on your mind?

I have something up my sleeve, but want to do some testing before I bring it to light. I’m still shy a few pieces. It’s definitely unorthodox.

[Meteorblade-2266]

You’re going to dual-wield Witch Doctors?

[Rage-13139]

Ok, well, so if you’re looking for hard CC, then you want to get a good freeze roll on belt, and a good stun roll on gloves. Don’t worry about the weapons.

[Aleas-1169]

@Meteorblade-2266

Struggling to get a GR122 done. Not been lucky with map / pylons yet. Issue is still mainly survivability rather than the damage.

Try replacing Charge with Leap - Iron Impact. Good for low paragon survivability.

[DieHarder-11668]

Does the freeze and stun combination minutely off set or reset each other? Or delays the hard cc effect?

[Rage-13139]

As far as I know, Freeze and Stun can keep layering on top of each other. And the way CC resist builds up is kind of weird. The resistance increases over time (they get more resistant for each second they are under hard CC), and not for each instance of hard CC applied. However, old instances aren’t effected by the CC reduction, but new ones are.

For instance, let’s say you have a freeze and a stun that both last 5 seconds. At second 0, you stun a mob. After 1 second, he has 10% CC resist. If you freeze him then, that freeze only lasts for 0.9 * 5 seconds = 4.5 seconds. After 2 seconds, he has 20% cc resist. If you stun him again then, he’ll only be stunned for 0.8 * 5 = 4 seconds. But, I think your initial stun, applied at second 0, will stay in place for all 5 seconds, because at the point you applied it, that mob had 0% cc resist.

I’d have to double check to be sure, but I think that’s how it works.

[Meteorblade-2266]

@Aleas-1169

Good for low paragon survivability.

Just under 3700 paragon and I’m still low paragon.
I has a sad.

[DieHarder-11668]

@Rage-13139

What’s on your mind?

So this is what I have in mind, using Frozen Deflection shield with TS: Demoralized to taunt &freeze mobs and create a greater area of damage.

https://ptr.d3planner.com/765906979

[RuneThor-2201]

@DieHarder-11668

https://ptr.d3planner.com/765906979

I was actually wondering why my build works so well. I have Smite Rune on Frenzy and use Echoing fury that applies fear. Enemies don’t get the time to build up so much resistance. If we could get freeze in there somehow this might actually work.

https://www.diablofans.com/builds/106789-savages-gr-push-120

[Roxtar-1858]

I was hoping they would give us perma WoTB (or Untill you die!) so its not the same as the other Barb builds. Then in doing so would add DPS to the build and a easier time gear hunting since you wont need CDR.

[MeganeSenpai-1314]

@Roxtar-1858

they would give us perma WoTB (or Untill you die!) so its not the same as the other Barb builds

Nope. If they gave us perma wraith it will be the same as at least 2 other barb set/builds: WW-Rend and IK builds. I think it’s a good idea that they gave us a new build/set that isn’t (very) wraith-depended.
I think since the release of Mortik, people have been overuse Wraith too much. Since it’s only one of 3 barb’s ultimates (6 if you count passives), there must be a room for others to shine.

[Arnosega-2784]

I understand you point of view but if it is to be broken it is better to remain conservative. I’m a little shocked when devs release this set with such 2p and 4p bonus. I tell myself that they do not master the game. In addition, I don’t see the renewal in the gameplay, it’s just a LON Frenzy or Hota with another set/skill without cc immunity and more fragile.

[Stedia-2687]

Oooooh, or a WD and a crusader.

[Roxtar-1858]

Not really its still geared around CDR just like WW, Raek, and LQ??. IK is the only one that’s different. I’m just giving feedback like they asked. Alot of people were saying its under preforming. Just making that little change would mean not having CDR on gear at all, there for making the build different then the rest by far.