We killed the Butcher in Diablo; he comes back in D3. We kill the Countess in D2 she comes back in D:I. We kill the Skelton King in Diablo; he comes back in D:3 and D:I. This does not even include the prime and lesser evils that keep reappearing. How does the Eternal conflict ever end?
Well…Eternal things don’t end…that is the whole point of Eternity…
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If 90% of "humanity was killed off by RoS and the same demons keep reappearing, it would appear that at some point the demons will win because they do not die for eternity.
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Is it certain the D3 butcher is the same one as in D:I, and just not a “profession” kind of thing within Hell?
D:I seemed like bad fan fiction in how it just throws a bunch of known characters all over the place. Not sure it could even be considered relevant for the lore.
Against humans sure, not against angels.
If they can destroy the Crystal Arch, won’t it be game over?
The conflict is between Angels and Demons, who never die. That fight will never be over even if all the humans are gone. Humans are just unlucky to be caught in the center of it.
Iirc d3 cains book said Butchers are built
Against Nephalim? Not even close.
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Lore wise yes but I have yet to see any of the Angels reborn.
Anyways, what you cant kill you can imprison, or transform into something else.
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The demons definitely seem to have a much better track record of corrupting angels, than angels have of corrupting demons. So I guess that is how it ends.
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Well evidently the butcher that we killed in D1 and D3 are actually different butchers. Despite the name: “The Butcher”, there’s actually many of them according to the lore book you get when you kill the butcher in D3:
“The truth about the Butcher demon was more startling than I ever anticipated. Evidently, there are many of them within the Burning Hells, though they used to be solely under Diablo’s command. The butchers are stitched together from the parts of other demons to combine their strengths, then given life through wicked magic.”
As for the Countess, well apparently she had died even before the events of D2, as she was buried alive and the tower that we fought her at served as her tomb, and going by what I’ve heard thus far in D:I, yes she can apparently return also. Leoric’s mind was pretty much broken due to Diablo’s influence, and as such the corruption had left him a vengeful ghost, so yeah, he can technically return as well.
Honestly it probably won’t. The only real way of ending the Eternal Conflict, would be if either the High Heavens or the Burning Hell (or both) were actually truly destroyed or purified out of existence (in the case of the Burning Hells) or corrupted beyond redemption (in the case of the High Heavens). We saw that the core of the High Heavens is the Crystal Arch, if that’s either destroyed and/or corrupted, then the High Heavens will fall alongside it. The Burning Hells likely have something similar, imo it might be the entirety of the Burning Hells.
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Does this happen before or after the Nephelim kick the Angels caboose for trying to destroy Santuary?
So … the Nephelim just have to Spawn Camp those areas and the war is over (for now)???
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I could be totally wrong, but I understood the angels to be beings of light and sound, which would indicate that the High Heavens are some type of “spirt” relm. If that is the case how are demons who are made of flesh and blood able to gain access to a non “physical” plain of existence? This would also go for the Nephilim.
If the demons could destroy the Crystal Arich, it is game over. Do the burning hells have something like the Arch that can be destroyed? Or do the demons just reappear anyplace in hell?
That would certainly halt Hell’s advancement. Sadly only for a short period of time. Fighting the forces of Hell for long durations of time increases the chance that the person, no matter how mighty, has a greater chance of falling to corruption and joining Hell’s ranks. Going by lore, very few people are incorruptible, and even the ones who happen to be are still suceptible to aging and thus growing weaker. It’d be another case if we were like the 1st generation of Nephalems who could seemingly live until they are killed, or performed some ritual on ourselves to turn us immortal like Zoltun Kulle had.
You are correct, angels are indeed beings of light and sound, and thus are akin to spiritual beings. However, and this is mostly speculation on my part, I don’t believe that’s enough to prevent any non-angelic being from physically interacting with angels. We’ve seen in gameplay, books, and cinematics that most spiritual beings, like angels, ghosts, wraiths, etc, can still harm and in turn be harmed by physical beings like humans and demons. One would have to shroud themselves with the power of death (like Malthael did) in order to prevent anyone (who hadn’t done the same thing) from touching them.
I believe the Burning Hells do indeed have that. It is either the entirety of Hell itself (which means that Hell would have to be completely annihilated), or some object deep within the Black Abyss, the place where nearly all of demonkind (including the Great Evils) came from and revive within. As far as we know, no human or even angel had ever made it to the Black Abyss. So if there is an object that serves as the pinnacle of the Burning Hells, then I imagine it would be deep within the Black Abyss.
Nehaplems wont kick anyone around, they seem fairly useless. Just a matter of time before Sanctuary is emptied.
Is there any evidence that makes it obvious the same Butcher, Countess, Skeletor return and it is not merely a title? Even if it is the “same” one, that merely means the soul was not destroyed and being a lesser servitor-type, a more powerful being can simply call them forth, and seeing that base myth requires 1001 days that’s barely 3 years (not actually) and these stories are separated more than that.
Truly, the only ones that should be permanently killed, based on some folklore and old demonology, are the ones killed in Hell/their home. Being in Sanctuary is not their permanent plane so technically more of a reflection than their actual being.
There’s evidence that the Countess and Leoric (Skeleton King) are indeed the same ones. However, there’s no evidence to suggest the same for the Butcher, instead it’s been stated that there are many butchers in Hell.
Pretty much.
Can’t we just create a soul stone to bind them in and destroy that?.
Oh wait. We tried that and some self righteous angel stole it and tried to destroy Sanctuary.
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The description for “The Butcher” from Deckard Cain would seem to indicate there are many such demons. “…stitched together from parts of other demons then given life thru wicked magic”.
But even for unique angels and demons it’s rare for them to be truly killed. In mythology we see this as a common theme. The current body “dies” but the essence can find a new body and come back. Tolkien uses this multiple times with figures like Sauron, Glorfindel, and Gandalf.
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Yep, and that’s how we wound up in D4. That said, honestly I don’t even know if destroying the Black Soulstone would’ve been enough to permanently banish the great evils to the Black Abyss, even if it was done at the Hellforge. According to Itherael, since the Black Soulstone was made by humans rather than angels, there could’ve been some unforeseen consequences that may had happened if it was destroyed even at the Hellforge.