I see PVP as the end-game. It’s the activity for players to do when they’ve finished their builds and still want to have fun when the rest of the PVE experience left to them is grinding/work. Blizz needs to get this right. Set up a broken PK/PKK/hostility system like in D2 and they’ll miss a big opportunity.
I love the idea of formalizing battles with matched teams: 1v1, 4v4, etc. Allowing teams to work together in combat vs the FFA system they’ve described so far is a good thing. Tournaments are fun. The key thing they need to do with those is make organizing the teams easy and create interesting maps to fight on.
I’m also ok with the PVP-only items. If there’s no incentive, people won’t try it. After all, Diablo players approach with a looting hunting mentality. The question is what kind of loot. If it’s cosmetics, it may not be enough of a draw. If it’s PVP-oriented gear like what WoW has, we’ll end up with a huge barrier to entry for players who want to try, but don’t have to gear or the skills (yet), and have to get farmed many times by people with numerical advantage as well as their inherent experience from PVPing a long time. I’ll be watching this closely for specifics.
The thing that really worries me above all else is mechanics. Things that work in PVE can absolutely break PVP. Rogue hypermobility is screaming at me right now. It sounds cool vs AI-controlled mobs, but in PVP, you’re looking at a character that bounces all over the screen, attacks from range, can use whole-screen AoE abilities, multiple teleports, and disappear into a shadow realm to reposition at will. That’s a nightmare in PVP. The only way to stop this kind of a character is 100-0% stun and kill. Insta-kill mechanics where you have no control over your character are terribly unfun to play against because there is no counter play. This is a much longer discussion, honestly, but I think it’s the most critical for devs. I’m hoping pulling in one of the HotS devs (AZJackson) is going to help.
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There are lots of games with arenas. Diablo is not suited to arenas. The pvp designed for D4 fits in with the game. If they add arenas later it will most definately have no effect in game. They already said there will not be pvp gear specifically but there will be cosmetics from the Fields Of Hatred. These will only be obtainable by entering the zone.
Why not? And, if the D4 team was open to it, would you argue against it?
No but i wouldn’t participate. And if it gave extras to participents that aren’t available in game then there would be uproar. Im in Diablo to do what was meant to be done… fight the prime evils. There isn’t time for quarrels with other heroes.
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It should be based on options you should get nothing from pvp to help pvm pvp can drop pvp items so the people who dont want to go pvp wont miss anything at all… !!
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Then it would effect pve players in the Fields Of Hatred… like i said it doesn’t fit. If you want arenas go play a different game until it gets added to D4. Just don’t expect pvp gear.
Not if there pvming in not in the pvp area or arena…
Options: pvp or pvm
hell maybe make 2 servers one for pvm/pvp on for just pvm
either way its done Pvp needs to implemented in a better way then there current content…
I doubt they’d do that. If they’ll limit the FFA PVP rewards, certainly they’d do the same for any type of organized PVP.
I think arenas are a good option. They formalize the combat and set basic rules that create an even playing field. Imagine the idea of a medieval joust, just without the horses. One of the most off-putting parts of FFA is ganking. You’re not ready for a fight. You’re happily farming, then get jumped. It’s not fun. But if you’re set up for a fair fight, more people might try it.
I also think Blizz will be heavily supporting clans and social game play. Games are more fun with friends, after all. BlizzcOnline had a lot of language about trying to create fun places for people to game. So, what does a clan do once you form one? Formalized PVP is a great option to offer. Maybe it’s arenas, maybe it wholesale pitched battles. I very fondly remember Tarren Mill/Southshore battles in Classic WoW with hundreds of players. I think there’s a place for that kind of thing as a solid, long-term, end-game activity outside of simply grinding another rift like in D3 or making another Baal run like in D2.
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The minute you add pvp gear to a pve game is when it starts to crumble. They are adding pvp to D4 with pve gear as this is what fits with the game. If they add arenas and pvp gear then i just hope the two are seperate to the game. Pvp gear in FOH would certainly complicate things.
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Gankers will be ganked as soon as the whole of FOH are alerted to their presence. Stop comparing D4 to other games. I most certainly hope they don’t try to make D4 anything other than a Diablo game.
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your opinion if you want no pvp go play d3 now that we have are opinions out the way lets look at facts people want pvp there is a base that wants it just like you who does not want it cant make everyone happy.
But you can make server A for Snowflakes who do not want pvp. Server B for those who want more than another d3 pvm grind…
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I do want pvp. I just want fair pvp (with the element of uh ohh). All i have said makes sense you are just upset that i disagree with you. I know it won’t always be fair the way it is set out, however the style designed fits in with the game.
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Look at d2 there is no special gear in pvp kept the game alive for many years there is still people doing tourneys in pvp content
no need for special gear they made normal gear work in d2 because the community developed in implemented pvp rules same can be done in d4… !!
No but there’s dupers and people who p2w in D2.
I’m not a fan of PVP-specific gear.
It does solve some specific problems. It lets you separate PVP and PVE mechanics and balance the numbers differently in each realm. Each system can be uniquely “broken,” as it were. It gives players a sense of progression they’re used to from PVE, and incentives are always good. But the problem is that they also create a big barrier to entry for the casual player who just wants to try it out for an afternoon with his buddies.
Cosmetics is fine. Love the ears! But I think the gear is better earned from killing monsters and balanced with both PVE and PVP in mind.
Ganking is one of the most toxic behaviors in PVP and explicitly a reason why I refuse to play it in D1 or D2. I compare it to other games because other games have figured out how to make PVP fun and balanced, whereas Diablo devs never have. If the D4 team is going to add PVP (which I support), they need to do it right, and that means opening their mind to what works and getting rid of the toxic stuff that discourages players from participating.
D4 is being designed for a solo experience from the get go. Grouping is an end game option. Nothing to stop casually playing except ganking. Which i’m sorry fits in with the D4 pvp idea. I’m not promoting ganking but the option is there. At least there is no pvp gear to give pk’ers the upper hand other than the need to gank.
If blizzard does its part there will be no cheaters dupers bots… !!
Open trade games will always have a P2w aspect
there is no open trade in d3 but people pay people for bounties or pay for carries or they run paid for botting programs or Multibox multiple accounts in one game to give there loot to main acct meaning there buying multiple accounts to pay to win…
Wont stop it they cant sadly so were stuck with it one way or another…
But if blizzard sticks to banning for the legit player base we wont have as many problems … !!
There will be limited trade in D4. They already said they don’t want p2w and minimalised botting.
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Probably just me, but I actually like the current pvp idea in Diablo 4.
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I think I should clarify here. Ganking is part of PVP. If you’re out of position and exposed, the enemy picks you off. Situational awareness matters. I have no problem with it if: 1) engaging is consensual (ie you flag for PVP in some way), 2) the actual mechanics allow for counter-play (ie no 100-0% hits, or combinations that achieve the same while you’re stunned and have no control of your character). These are the kind of basic rules I think need to be in place for PVP.
From the sounds of it, D4 will flag you hostile in certain parts of the map. Fine. Good. You walk in, you consent to PVP. Welcome to open-world PVP.
I also think they should have more formalized combat in addition: arenas, pitched battles, etc because those offer the chance to form teams of various sizes which is fun too.
As long as they keep the mechanics under control, cool. This is the elephant in the room of course. How do you do this while also wanting fun, flashy abilities for PVE? It’s a much longer discussion for another thread.
Edit: formatting