D3 is different story. Don’t expect to see made much of what we request for it.
Man, I am the last person on Earth not wanting daily feedback and discussions with the D4 devs. I even suggested them they make the blog posts monthly, but this is something even the devs themselves might not be able to enforce. It’s a big company with many levels of hierarchy.
To ignore is to refuse to show that you see or hear something or to do nothing in response to those events.
They are reading all the feedback, don’t worry. They asked themselves many times for it.
Frankly, we haven’t even seen all the skills… We don’t need a clutter, we just need meaningful choices each with an exclusive pro and con… Having a clutter often leads to redundancy and frankly that’s not what anyone would ask for tbh
Kinda slightly torn on this but think it’s not a must-have though… It’s also easier to balance if not having the Offline mode… They surely would need to introduce some sort of DC resistance though
Good move. Frankly don’t like when the critiques goes into details to “next level” and not being able to recognize important from less important issues. This is quite frankly one of them tbh
Some “pros” think it’s good to be forced to not be able to carry everything that drops… I could see why they imagine it as a feature/resource. There are other ways (probably better even) to do Economy management within the game
Things like that. People just stick wayyy too much to what they “already know”… It’s called “Curse of knowlede” and frankly I don’t like that obstacle being a part of the feedback overall
You have not full information… Frankly I don’t like the “overall power” either but it’s I guess… whatever
The important part is that you have the “trinode” balance between Angelic, Demonic, and Ancestral… WAAAAAY WAAAY BETTER than Str/Dex/Int ever was… OR, at least looked like that with the potential it has and the choices offered rather than pigeonholling classes into a certain direction they can’t get out of…
Oh definatly, if they did not ask specifically to post feedback (like everyone is doing) on the general section of the forum.
I took this from this post on the Diablo 3 website:
https://news.blizzard.com/en-gb/diablo4/23232022/system-design-in-diablo-iv-part-i
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Where does this say, write in the sticky post? The only reference i could find to that is towards the Quarterly Update from February that has just been posted a few days ago and that is for that specific update, there is overlap of feedback already posted on the general forum and in that thread about Diablo 4.
To clarify further: I would love it if we had a Diablo 4 forum or subsection where we can discuss the upcoming installment, but there isn’t one.
In the Sticky post. Also in all the Blue comments from the day of the Blog post where they kept locking the threads.
Your issue seems to be that the Blog post does not contain information yet about topics you are interested in. Feedback about what else you want to see covered in the Blog posts for future releases would go there.
You will not get any answers to those questions you have, here on the D3 forums. The CM will simply make sure the D4 team sees it. Many of your questions are either answered already - as far as they can - or will need to wait until the game is farther along.
We would all love that, including our CM. Having it all here makes it harder to follow and does not accurately reflect player engagement numbers. The only good part about using this forum is that you need a D3 license to post so it avoids some of the spam and trolling open forums come with.
You never played Diablo 3? I mean, if you do, then you know what is the function of “DETAILS” in that picture.
Here is some idea on how “DETAILS” does in D3.
https://i.imgur.com/NGFEfef.png
Some people here are trying to turn the game into D2 or POE. That’s not “better”. I really hope this kind of feedback gets ignored and they make a game that is fun to play and not bloated.
And many of your items did get responded (offline mode, silly stash tetris), just not the way you personally like it.
Firstly i want to apologize, but i feel as though we are not communicating well here: [quote=“MissCheetah-1661, post:13, topic:13323”]
In the Sticky post. Also in all the Blue comments from the day of the Blog post where they kept locking the threads.
[/quote]
I know that. I even said that just after that quote. Also i gave a example about how its misleading now and you disregarded that.
Look, why would you just assume that? I’m simply stating that is what i read on the forums and i collected some of the largest ones.
Maybe, maybe not. I get it, the CM passes along the information to the devs, i am not blaming anyone here, in fact i really like our community manager too. Many of the answers have not in fact been answered that is the exact reason people are still discussing about it and or are not content with the solution provided at the moment. (This is also feedback.)
I did play Diablo 3 and Diablo 2 and Diablo 1 etc. I’m talking about the stats (Strength, Dexterity, Intelligence and Vitality) not being there anymore and are consolidated into Attack/Defense/Life. If you look closely on the Diablo 3 screen you see ‘Damage, Toughness and Recovery.’ I consider those 3 stats to be the same as Attack, Defense, Life hence the Stat points of your actual character are missing. And this has been removed from items also. I’m pretty sure that is what all the fuss is about.
They don’t want a exact copy of Diablo 2 or POE. They would play those games if they wanted that. They are simply saying a lot of features from those games were really populair back in the day and it would be nice to see some of those features back in Diablo 4. This does not make the game bloated, unless you consider Diablo 2 bloated or POE bloated.
Can you clarify which? I will remove those.
Who knows, maybe the stats were in the DETAILS or the stats were replaced with Angelic/Demonic things? It is pretty premature to assume that they simplified the stats when we know very little on them.
I really doubt there is an overwhelming desire for that. But that quote kinda is the response. People who disagree should continue to voice their opinion of course, if they want to.
Now that is one of the major topics I want to hear more about too.
It looks really bad right now.
Likewise here. Well, we already know there will be a bunch of stats. So that is not really the worry imo. But we should learn more about which stats there are, and what the design philosophy is around them.
And it would be great to get responses to all the concerns people have with the three Angelic etc. stats. The current design sounds insanely problematic, even if the basic idea seems good.
Really looking forward to more about these as well.
Others have certainly voiced their opinion that cooldowns is a good thing on its own (and what matters is the implementation)
Overall, I wish they would be quicker with more information. If they actually do care about feedback, it should be extremely important to get that feedback sooner rather than later. Too much cant be changed when there is less than a year left to release.
Now is the time for feedback.
In D3’s case, lack of responses, for a good 5 years straight, or truthful responses, does mean that our feedback wasn’t cared for, listened to or not.
F/e, "d3’s got all these problems, why did this happen, what can we do?’
Response “hey folks, look what we have in store it’s a necromancer! that’s right folks, im going to talk for like a huge page about this new add on, instead of talking about the problems with this game”.
Make sense, refresh your memory a bit?
I know i’ll never forget that necro-post day, it was like totally off topic to everything the forums were talking about for years, and by nature, is insulting to the max if like 95 percent of the forums is like help with x, help with y, d3’s got all these shallow shortcomings, and the response is “look at the necro yo!”.
It was totally a sign that we weren’t cared for for that half decade, which eventually led to the on-stage aggressive defense of D immort.
They get so wrapped up in their new add on content, or new IP nobody cares about, that they don’t TLC the game they have going on, or ask us about it, or care.
D4’s case is different, and its a fantastic first-step.
Why is this?
New people in charge.
New people who (so far) have shown they care.
Unfortunately, they haven’t been involving us from the get-go, pre-art.
F/e, they went ahead and made the art all earthy, all brown, all grey, and its a BIG deal, its super subjective, and they went ahead and rogued it, and its not turning out great.
The art style in D4 isn’t good, it looks extremely bland.
Who said “dull” is a keyword to attach to?
“medieval” is, “gothic” is, “dark” is, but so is “color involving” and “Brightness”.
F/e, D2 had bright colors, D3 had A LOT of bright colors, D4 has 0 bright colors.
In other words, D4 is dull looking, which is really bad.
Once again, they don’t get it, the whole D4 art style looks like an xbox game or PS2 game from 2005, with less colors, and more sand and dullness and greys and beige and light brown.
I think D4’s color inspiration was a garden pot, including the stone pot.
Lets make everything grey, brown, and beige, that color tone, all game long, as dull as it looks, which isn’t “dark” its dull.
First off, as stated before, just because feedback is not addressed or changes are not made does not mean feedback is being ignored. All feedback is collected, summarized, and given to the dev team.
With that, all feedback is not equal nor useful. Much of the feedback is complaints with no reason other than I like this over this. Where reasons why feature x worked for me over feature y is better. So, once that is weeded out, the feedback pool is much smaller.
Next, devs are not obligated to make changed just because players suggest feedback, even high quality feedback. Imce again that does not mean it is being ignored. There are certain design philosophies devs have for a game that are unchangeable despite what players want.
Also, players are not entitled to changes they ask for. Too often players feel they have an absolute right to guide game development just because there is communication between players and devs. All that does is allow devs to get a feel for the room. As mentioned above, they still have a philosophy for what they want, and if feedback contradicts it they are unlikely to change.
Specific to D4, the game is not being designed for offline play, so no matter what some say, ask for, protest against, no matter how well thought out and present ted, it will not happen. Thi gs like stats, item qualities, crafting, endgame, are things they will consider. But too often, players are quick to bash devs for not listening or ignoring because they are not implementing or commenting on feedback. Players are not entitled but sure feel and act like it.
Things are not always what they seem.
You’re too quick to jump to that conclusion when you don’t know for sure what really is going on.
Perhaps you are right. We will see what the future holds for these and other topics and if i jumped to conclusions. Either way, if they do listen to the feedback and show it we get a even better game and i will be more then happy to go back here or on record on diablo 4 forums to say i was wrong… Until that happens however it is really hard to say that, since they really have the benefit of the doubt against them for made past mistakes and/or previous releases.
Look i really do not get why i’m being ‘attacked’ for asking the hard questions here. All i am trying to do is and im sure you are too, is trying to help and make Diablo 4 a great game. (Be that with or without this feedback.)
I can tell you what sort of bothered me about your tone, if you want to hear?
It was that you made the assumption that feedback or questions are being ignored. You also seemed to expect a response here in the D3 forum. You accuse them of not caring if you don’t hear about the topics you want - and you want to hear NOW.
Diablo 4 was announced in Nov 2019. It is now Feb 2020. They said it was VERY early in development still and that it would be a long time before the game came out. We are talking years here. They agreed to do Quarterly news updates - the first of which came out a few days ago.
You seem to want answers to EVERYTHING you care about right now…in the very first update, or you are being “ignored”.
It just seems very very unrealistic to expect update 1 to have all the things you want to have in it. Many of the decisions about the game have not even been made yet, and those that have, will have to get through lots and lots of internal iteration before they tell us what the final form will be. Everyone has questions - but most people understand it will take time before they are answered and it is not some sort of insult to the player base.
While I agree that we cant expect everything at once, we kinda want to get the information before the “final form”, since that would be too late to give feedback.
I understand that, but they meant it would take years. Alpha is a good time to get a better feel for it. Beta even more so. By then though they will have told us what the major decisions/features are. Some things, like crafting, or in-game systems, may still iterate during Beta, but stuff like the existence of PVP, the online/offline mode, trade, MTX, etc will all be settled. Most of those already are decided to be honest. IF they decide to change them, they will do it in one of the Blog posts. Example - Torchlight Frontiers (Max Schaffer of the Diablo team) was a F2P microtransaction game that was considered pay to win. A few weeks ago during Alpha, they scrapped the whole model, went single payment model, got rid of MTX, and revised leveling and such. They re-named it Torchlight 3. So, Alpha does not mean the end of the road for everything, in all cases.
Beta would be quite late to talk more about these things. Even if Blizzard surely does iterate a lot even closer to release, the framework for the major systems will be locked down at that point.
Getting to know their design philosophies, the goals, the methods, is important, when it comes to skills, passive talents, itemization, angelic/demonic/etc. stats, respeccing, death penalties, lvling, post-lvling/paragon, key dungeons, other end-game activities, trade, pvp etc.
Stuff like MTX, online/offline etc. are less interesting to hear more about. Since those are mostly just “either/or”. The important topics are the game systems.
Im sorry that you feel that way, and I’m sorry if I come across like that. I’m simply trying to invoke a response and engage in a meaningful discussion about core topics for their upcoming game. While the game is far out and I know that things take a long time to build this does not mean we can’t have a discussion or talk about it. It’s just very hard to have a good brain storm or talk when the person you are trying to do that with is being very silent about stuff, it’s not that we are trying to force this their way or anything like people have said before. There is just people that wanna know how the devs feel about these topics. To me it makes no sense to stay quiet about things that potentially can help you make a better game. They are actively asking for our feedback and I’m actively asking for a response on that feedback, I don’t think that is being unreasonable at all?
In addition i would add they actively ask in their quarterly update that they would like to know what we want to hear about next. Well there’s a bunch of stuff above I would like to hear about?