I think the nerf is welcoming. The fact that wizard is 10+ GRs ahead of everything else is just bonkers…and it’s not like 10 GRs at GR100, the jump from 130 to 140 is astronomical. It was broken the way it was and the only reason this change is so unwelcoming to many is because it was left alone all last season. Welcome back to planet earth Wizards!
9 Likes
On the current seasonal ladder, Wizards are 9-10 levels above every other class except Necro. Many would say, that is what’s ridiculous.
If Wizards dropped 5-8 levels, that is just what the devs hoped to achieve. In fact, the Wizard class would still be overpowered based on the current seasonal ladder (Americas).
Having said that, I know this sucks for people who are accustomed to playing the Wizard. But that class is just too overpowered right now.
2 Likes
I’ve been a wizard main (as well as fan of archon) since Diablo 3 launch, and I’m of the belief that the chantodo nerf was necessary. As someone had said before, blizzard shouldn’t had taken this long to nerf it.
5 Likes
I hope more peeps will try out LoD meteor, am quite positive that once I get full augs (got 0 atm) and an ancient squirts necklace, I will be able to go 120+. I did 107 with 7m left with only 960 paragon, and I never die in 110-120 4m while not losing any damage whatsoever. Obv harder to gear for (as in getting near perfect roll for legendary powers on mainhand, offhand and boots as all boost meteor damage), but easy to start off with (was doing 650B crits with 4 ancients and lvl 60 LoD, 125% CD and 25% CHC at 360ish paragon) and only 3 slots where you need great rolls.
Plus you can swap between 2 gems depending on group setup and if you kill density or just hunt elite packs - BoTrapped for density, Stricken for elite packs. Mobility ain’t bad at all since any mob attacking you when moving will refresh teleport CD (as you get your toughness from channeling and getting hit).
1 Like
If it does 20% of it’s old damage now, that’s about 10 GRs worth of loss. Considering Wizards are about 10 GRs above the rest of the classes, I don’t see how this is a problem.
As a reference, for DH you need to clear a GR110 to get in the top 1000 whereas for a Wizard you need to clear a GR120 to get in the top 1000. If you want to compare the rank 1 clears, #1 DH is 128 and #1 Wizard is 138 in season, so that’s also a 10 GR disparity.
The other classes also are ~10 GRs behind Wizard too for solo, so I don’t think this is a problem and should stay this way.
5 Likes
too much nerf
Before : 116
now :110 !!!
-6 gr for me
4 Likes
Even thought i wouldnt care seeing all classes one day approaching the 150 solo (considering some 8-9k+ have performed the 144-145 so it is absolutely not representative for the normal gamers performances), i think that a good first step would be to keep chantodo strong enough to alternate with ratruns and lower its abilities to perform that high in solo… i have no technical solutions to offer…
Agree with you bro.You are absolutely right point on the 'fun’translates to ‘op’.
You guys are basing this far too much on what GR level this build is capable of at its max, instead of looking at what can be done to bring all classes to around the GR140 lvl. This was only nerfed because GR150 solo would have been accomplished this season, and we all know it. Reducing AS bonus, however they did it, was just an excuse to nerf, and nothing more. Now if you want the Chant’s set damage for Wave of Force effect nerfed, and instead have the Vyr’s set boosted so it does the primary part of the damage, there’s an argument for that, because it opens up other weapon ideas, etc. I could actually buy that argument. But this nonsense that its op because the other builds can’t do the same exact Gr level is ridiculous - - that’s been the going rate in this game since GR’s were introduced.
I think pretty much every single build doesn’t have near enough damage, output, and they are all garbage on toughness. Seriously, instead of asking them to boost the other builds, ya’all just request that they nerf this one? I honestly don’t get you guys and your mindset. They are buffing Barb to bring it up to new standards…why not the rest? They could do one or two classes each season, and everyone - basically every popular build - would be within parity, or close to it.
Because this creates (already did) a huge discrepancy in power for all players. If you’re not rolling yourself a vyr’s + chantodo this season, you won’t be able to do even GR 100 for quite a while (speaking from start of season) as your other class / build needs better items and more paragon to even sneeze into 90’s, and while you struggle to level your gems, get more items for your build, level paragon slowly, the players playing the vyr’s chantodo will already be running speed GR110-120, maxing gems, getting tons of paragons and way more items.
So damn if you do, damn if you don’t. If you wanted to play something else than a wizard this season, tough luck. If you do play one to stay in the game, means you won’t actually get to play the class or build you wanted.
It was a very good move to tune it down. It’s not nerfed into ground, losing couple GR’s in terms of power is nothing compared to what the kit still provides (as in being miles above rest of builds in both survival and damage). We need diversity, peeps not getting kicked out of public games at T16 GR if they are not a chantodo wiz or support barb / monk, some peeps are fine doing 90-110 speeds, not everyone is elitist and looking down on anything else not on same level of power.
3 Likes
Nah - you’re flat wrong, Impale, Multishot, IK6R4, HoTA, WoL, Condemn, (not to mention necro builds and WD builds that can also do it) will all do Gr100 by 800 para, and do it in a timely manner (5 minute range), or less. I’ve done all of them over the seasons, and know better. People not knowing how to optomize and having to fight the uphill battle of RNjeeezus, is a bigger issue than builds being ‘op’, because NONE are.
Gotta fish for decent gear and get the right stats, but that’s every build.
Not all of them can do GR100 in 3 minutes or so, but that’s also a paragon problem as well, not a build issue. This idea that you HAVE to play the most powerful build or you can’t play is flat out ridiculous as well.
What player says: ‘oh…well the build I like can’t do GR100 in 3 minutes, so I’m not gonna play’ - ‘my build can’t do GRXXX as fast as that build so I’m switching right now’?? Seriously answer me that. And if they are that petty, why would we want them to play?
It’s not just being tuned down as you put it. In worst case scenario’s, this build will lose 5-10 GR’s depending on what the rng of the rift brings to bear. In ‘good’ rifts it may not lose much at all. All in all, It will be seated behind Necro once again, and the pay to win model will be back in full scale. It might even fall behind WD and Barb this season. We’ll have to wait and see.
1 Like
I think this Nerf is working exactly as intended. Vyrtodos is no longer waaaay out performing other sets. Yes, it sucks being nerfed… But people complaining that they’re now 5-7 GRs behind where they were: that’s literally the point. Having basically god like invulnerability while in archon mode which you are 90% of the time on top of huge damage is the definition of OP. I hopped on my wiz in ptr and yeah the Nerf was definitely there and it feels bad, but it was out performing other classes so much that this is warranted. It’s still most likely the most powerful set combo around ( most top tier builds utilize LoN for other classes).
The Nerf is good. Invulnerability plus huge damage = broken.
Necros are losing solo thorns build which was literally the only top tier build they had. Minus thorns builds necros are not OP on the leader boards at all. The thorn Nerf hurts necro way more than this hurts wizard ( I’m betting necros lose 8 gr’s - that’s how much better thorns was than lon mages or lon lancer). Almost everybody, including necro mains, are happy with the Nerf because we all realize it was OP. Vrytodos is way OP. It’s not a hard build to play. It’s literally invulnerable for 90% of the rift, it’s easy to gear for, and it does too much damage. By comparison, necros do great damage but die constantly and arguably have a higher learning curve. With no thorns the wizard will still be higher in leader boards than the necro, guaranteed.
Literally the point of a Nerf.
Am amazed at peeps defending the power of vyr’s chantodo pre-nerf. You realize you had near invulnerability and highest AoE dmg in game with insane mobility?
Let’s look at other high dps builds for other int based classes:
LoD mages and Zuni DoD. Not AoE dmg, but still high damage. What about toughness? If something sneezes in their direction they vaporize. Period.
Outside of zDPS monks & barb, nothing can survive in high GR’s like a vyr’s chantodo. Closest would be LoD meteor shower channeling non stop to maintain the defensive buffs while also running stone gauntlets and aquilla’s.
Everyone else trying to solo push needs unity (and that to not just vaporize as soon as they enter the rift, they won’t be able to tank ground effects or mobs / elites etc). How many vyr’s chantodo run unity?
Plus you have the transform effect with archon which rends you completely immune to all CC, unlike WD and Necro that have none.
2 Likes
Vyr isn’t immune to death or dying, it was not ‘invulnerable’. That’s a ridiculous way of putting it because its simply untrue. You have to move around and be smart with it or you will die. You have to use Karini to get the big damage reduction, or you’re basically glass cannon. Literally glass cannon. The recent iteration of the build probably won’t have room for Karini or Squirts, or maybe even COE. Two of the three will be gone, and it will be back to Wiz having garbage for toughness.
It’s also unfortunate that they nerfed the thorns necro, imo. I like watching that build, but I didn’t play it. Oh well. I also never said it was OP. I’ve stated time and again that NO build, NOT ONE is OP.
We’ve all stated our op’s and gave reasons, its up to the devs. But, honestly…Vry/Chants was the last build I was enjoying playing. That was because I could actually push my gems up solo and do it without fishing 100+ gr’s just to get the next GR higher, maybe two.
If they take that away now…I really have no reason to play anymore. If this is going to be the going rate for future Diablo games, I am simply not interested.
1 Like
Do what I do? Play LoD Meteor shower. Solo 107 at 900ish paragon no augments… Group 110-120. Level gems, get paragon.
Do speeds as LoD Meteor as you can run nemesis in cube np (did 105-110 speeds w/o any vyr wiz, barb, LoD BS, me and impale DH).
I don’t care for that build, and its shiddy toughness when not in a group.
The other option to NOT doing what someone else does, is to STOP NERFING BUILDS.
1 Like
Excuse me? It’s the most chill build you can play, literally all you do is channel and teleport around.
Toughness is 7.5-8b SOLO w/o any barb / monk in group. I can literally eat 3 explosions and stay in 4 arcane beams (or plague / molten w/e) in 110 just channeling. In 115 I also teleport in place (safe passage) to eat same explosions or arcane beams.
And dmg wise? Was doing 650B crits at 300ish paragon with only 125% Crit Dmg, no CoE or power circles (10 stacks of rank 60 taeguk + mantle of channeling).
I can face tank the golem RG in 110-120 without moving out of his charge or melee swings (and this is one of the hardest melee hitters of all RG’s).
My sheet dmg at 10 stacks is 4.5m with no augs, and not even 75% close to perfect gear (amulet non ancient etc).