[2.6.10 PTR] Necromancer Feedback

PTR Feedback
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Hello fellow Necromancers! :zombie: Feel free to comment here with feedback relating to the [2.6.10] Necromancer related changes, or with feedback for Necromancer in general. I will list my own feedback below.

Multiplier Balance

As to the level of multiplier, I’ve only tested solo GR Speed thus far, but it feels fairly on point for Non-seasonal compared to the DH’s GoD build. Was able to complete a GR108 in 3 minutes with medium effort (~2kp / ~18k INT, pretty good rift).

The push build Loses 7 GRs from the Trag’oul’s Corroded Fang Fix (bug report related to this fix noted here).

However, the new multiplier, currently on Gelmindor’s Marrow Guards, provide 11.4 GRs. This is an overall increase of 4.4 GRs if you use the same weapons, or ~7.25 GRs if you swap into Scythe of the Cycle.

Speed builds that don’t use Fang get the full 11.4 GRs, which feels amazing!

EDIT (10/16/2020): Solo push testing, completed a GR135 on the PTR at ~8.5k INT in ~14m. Expected GR140 clear at ~2k paragon, fully augmented.

https://ptr.d3planner.com/141299391

Notably, this GR140 value is only due to the ~9.29 GRs given by the 4th cube slot (Reilena’s Shadowhook) this season.

If you take that away, this build isn’t quite as powerful. This is why I’m thinking at the very least:

It’s in a pretty good spot.

I do worry that after this is removed it may be still too weak compared to many other builds, but I suppose we can rebalance if that turns out to be the case.

Flavorless Item

While I’m glad bone spear is seeing some damage multiplier increases…

This item is Flavorless. Why tack a multiplier on to a new item that previously had an open slot with varied options?

Recommendation: Why not merge the multiplier into Maltorious’ Petrified Spike instead?

This would accomplish the same thing without wasting a bracer slot.

One of the things I loved about Necro was the open choice in bracer. Taking it up with a required multiplier that has zero interaction with any of the class mechanics, and is only tied to one skill, is not my idea of a fun item.

A defensive bracer was more in line with what I was thinking would be interesting, since Necromancer still has issues with toughness for many builds.

DR, life% based leech recovery, shielding, LPS, health globes; any of these can these interact with other core class mechanics such as:

  • Essence
  • Pets
  • Curses
  • Generators
  • Spenders
  • Etc.

to make an interesting and beneficial item. Nems and APDs could compete with this type of item. Nems can’t compete with a 6x multiplier!

Please make this item interact with the core class mechanics.

Offensive bracers like the below would also be more interesting:

Suggestions for Future Item Enhancements:

Nayr’s Black Death:

Issue: the item only works for stacking same skill poison abilities. Cold and Physcial are left out.

Recommendation: Redesign this item to include any element, similar to below:

To be clear, this item would activate separate stackable buffs for Poison, Cold, or Physical depending on the rune of the skill activated.

Iron Rose:

Issue: Iron Rose currently does not assume the rune of death nova you place on your skill bar. It’s always Blood nova.

Recommendation: Allow this item to assume the rune of Death nova that you place on your skill bar. This would allow Necromancers to run channeled poison nova.

Sets

Would also love to see Necromancer sets revised, in particular:

Inarius Bone Storm mechanic: Bare minimum, make it LARGER, a radius of 30-40 yards would be a good start.

Trag’ouls: Needs a rework so it’s not directly competing with LoD. More interesting interactions with Life spending abilities perhaps?

Rathma: Needs a rework of some kind. LoD is flat out better for pet builds.

My background: I’m fairly knowledgeable when it comes to mechanics, however I have only recently started putting more hours into Necromancer, largely due to the changes with Razeth’s Volition and Haunted Visions that occured in [2.6.9].

Since I’m not a longtime Necromancer, I’m excited to hear from other players, perhaps even those who have been with the class since the beginning.

Thank you!

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I agree with the change to Nayr’s Black Death.

I would also like to see a buff to Trag’ouls Corroded Fang, granting the Cursed Scythe rune for Grim Scythe so you can choose a second rune (like the Cold Rune). This would then synergize well with the potential Nayr’s change and allow for a multi-cold-skill build utilizing TCF.

The Masquerade of Burning Carnival is a bit dull. It reminds me of the Aegis of Valor set’s first iteration that only juiced Fist of the Heavens. The second iteration added the empowering interaction for Heaven’s Fury and made the set more interesting.
I would like to see a change to the 6 piece bonus of the new Masquerade of Burning Carnival set. I would like to see it work similar to the Crusader’s Aegis of Valor set, similar to how Fist of the Heavens is used to empower Heaven’s Fury, I would like Bone Spear to empower Death Nova (or possibly even Bone Spirit). This would make the set more interesting and finally make a Death Nova or Bone Spirit build viable for T16 or GR pushing. Also I would like to see an addition to the 4 piece bonus that would refund all or a portion of the essence cost of Bone Spear so that a generator is no longer required (also similar to the AoV set).

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I know nothing about necromancer. Just feelsbadman to see you Cratic theorycrafting other classes than Wizard. I mean, can’t blame you, seems like a super exciting class compared to what wiz has become.

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I enjoy the “new” set. I already played it a lot this season so there was no learning curve. My only complaint is that it’s tied into scythe of the cycle. I don’t like having the bone armor penalized. You can either wait for poison in COE or die sometimes. Also, why does Maltorious’ Petrified Spike DOUBLE the resource cost to use the skill? Every other item reduces it. That does not make sense to me.

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I wish lornelle’s sunstone bonus would be added to Trag’Oul 4 pieces.

Also Bloodtide blade have a stackable mechanic. I am godlike against high density and a sitting duck against the GR guardian.

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would be nice if enforcer worked with simulacrums also

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Love this idea! would be really cool to have. Even though it isn’t that great of a pull, i’ve always wanted to try out Dual Scythes for a grouping mechanic, or run the health return per target hit rune.

Reminds me of the issue where Cursed Scythe isn’t applying Cursed form. Would love to see that fixed too.

Good point, it is a bit high, I could do with 30 essence at most… 40 is a bit high. I find I have to allocate extra RCR just to feel like I’m functioning normally.

Attack speed seems LESS valuable because you’re limited on essence anyway. Really feels bad.

I agree. Would like to see Scent of Blood, etc. added as well, but I’m also split on this. Running Trapped + Enforcer is some boring gem itemization. All flat multipliers.

Definitely significantly lacking in Single target DPS, this build is. I had to have two pylons, incuding a power, and an illusionist pack spawned via nemesis bracer to clear my GR130 vs STRG. Zero base damage, but amazing scaling potential.

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if you use aughild and a bane of the powerful. the fight against the RG or single target elites is very satisfactory.

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I love it when Cratic strokes my (already considerable) ego. :stuck_out_tongue: This was one of my better ideas for the Necromancer class.

PS: You still aren’t forgiven for abandoning Wizard. I made a motion to change your name from Cratic to Craven :stuck_out_tongue:

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@Cratic, I am looking forward to your new videos on youtube. I really appreciate that you’ve started to play with necromancer.

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You can’t have him. He’s mine.

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I wish they would just buff the sets already. Seems like they are doing everything but what they actually should be.

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I would badly like for that not to happen. The playstyle of AoV (using one spender to buff another, resulting in mindless spam of all 6 skills) is awful, whereas the current playstyle of MOBC is pretty awesome. Bone Spear is an old-school favorite, and your idea of turning it into an enabler is really very terrible.

In fact, I would like no other set or build to resemble AoV Fury (either the blocking or the active build).

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I like some of your ideas kind sir, but I think asking them to stack 4-digit bonuses on one legendary item is unlikely. The way the game works (multiplicative buffs), getting a 400% boost on a Bracer and a 300% boost on an off-hand is far more likely than one 2000% buff on an item.

Given that the fix on Tragouls Fang’s interaction with Simulacrum seems to cost us alot of the same damage than Gelmindor’s is giving us, the more likely request is a Bone Spear offhand that buffs damage around 250% and adds resource recovery or mitigation.

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I see your point about it being a throwback to an old school favorite, but what I’m suggesting wouldn’t change anything about the current Bone Spear builds. Just like the AoV set can still be used to make FotH builds, the MoBC set could still be used to make Bone Spear builds. I just want the set to have more options and not be limited to such a narrow application. Allowing the set to juice at least 1 more skill could only add more build diversity and make the set more enjoyable for everyone and not just those who prefer to experience nostalgia.

I disagree with your characterization of the AoV set as one which encourages “mindless spam of all 6 skills”. We’re all entitled to our own opinion, however, I don’t see how you couldn’t make this generalization about virtually any build in Diablo 3, including MoBC Bone Spear. Everyone has their preferred playstyle, and what you might think is awful or terrible others might love and enjoy. That’s the beauty of having a multitude of options. As they say, variety is the spice of life.

Thanks for commenting and GLHF in Season 22.

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Your reply was thoughtful, so I will make one in kind.

AoV is not like any other build I played, in that you will die if any of AC, Iron Skin, Laws of Valor, or the 50-stacks of mitigation from the 4-piece fall off. Furthermore, you only deal damage if you recently cast 3 Fists of the Heavens, and your enemies are disabled during your Holy CoE cycle. You are therefore following 7 or so different timings, of which only 1 is an actually timing, and the rest need to be up at all times.

Bone Lancer is a build almost nobody wants back. It revolves around LOTD, because corpse-based skills are far from dynamic in a game with such high scaling as D3’s Greater Rifts.

It is also very hard to classify how they added Heaven’s Fury to AoV a “success.” The set was initially a FOTH set, and after the PTR, and without testing, they added a 20,000% and 800% bonus to Heaven’s Fury. It ruined multiple seasons with its dominance.

Bone Spear is a spammable spell, while Corpse Lance is a high-damage, single-target corpse skill. Adding “just one more skill” which happens to be utterly different and warp the build is a terrible idea. Truly, a ghastly idea in fact. Furthermore, Simulacrums are build around casting your Secondary Skills, of which there are 3: Bone Spear, Death Nova, and Skeletal Mage. So, if you would add one more build to the set, make it Death Nova. Absolutely NOT Corpse Lance.

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New Item* Gelmindor’s Marrow Guards: Bone Spear cast from Simulacrums deal 400-500% 300-400% increased damage.

Developer’s Note: We see how strong this is performing. We would like to tweak it back a little for now.

I disagree with this move to reduce the multiplier, even though it’s not much of a reduction.

Damage for Bone Spear in seasonal is only propped up by 4th cube at the moment. If you remove Reilena’s, Bone spear will be even weaker than a lot of other builds. Would love to see the level of multiplier revisited after the season.

My feedback on merging the multiplier to Maltorious’ still stands.

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While i can actually agree with the nerf even for ns (since they build might’ve been able to reach 150 solo in extreme cases in ns) i am very confused to why they only nerf bonespear and not God too since there are like 50+ 150 clears in ns and it currently makes playing any other set than God for solo exp farming irrelevant.

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maybe that is already a hint for a permanent 4th slot after this season for everyone… So im kinda okay with this now.

If the 4th slot isnt permed after we need to talk about a buff anyways even if it stayed at 500%.

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I agree it seems likely based on actions taken.

If indeed they are testing the waters for 4th cube permanent, communication on that would have been great to know for testing and framing our opinions.