In general, the majority are pretty fair. Any time a nerf is requested due to the perception that a class is overpowered, a subset of people who play that class will complain as well as the “only buff, never nerf” posters.
If the build is OP, then the response to nerf suggestions will be somewhat quiet (see bazooka wizards, AoV crusaders, and now WD). I think that the only time that there was huge negative fallout was when the lamentation belt did not go live with the rend damage modifier. A large percent of the posters including myself thought that the complete removal of the damage modifier was overzealous and should be returned although there was a debate as to the extent.
No. It does make it so that people who prefer to play other classes won’t feel weak in comparison to an OP build. Maximize fun for all not a single OP class.
My thoughts about the current state of wd and other builds that got intruduced in 2.6.8 is that the set for hydra wiz needs a buff (LoD seems to be in a ok spot) the barb set is actually in a very good spot since it is the currently 2nd best bosskiller ingame and the 2nd best solo barb build.
The 2 current builds that it loses to are currently still quite a bit over the suggested powerlevel blizzard wants (139-143 clear at 10k) so it might shine if these builds get changed a bit.
The new wd set is to strong in solo (150 for sure doable ) and ok in groups (sub 5 min clear possible in 4 man). If i would suggest a change it would be nerfing the current 6p flat percentage and adding more power back into the mana reg.
Just out of fun i tried how long it would take me to clear a 130 solo on wd with 20k mainstat (which is roughly 2k paragon with full 100 augs on non jewlery slots).
I got the clear on the first key
Hi Micro My understanding of the balance metric from the balance blog was the average player can hit GR130 at 5kp, non-seasonal for the build being referenced.
While the following is a guess, I kind of feel like the average player would not spend more than 100 keys pushing, and would not be gearing or playing as perfectly as the leaderboard toppers who are at the forefront of pushing the limits of a build.
The balance blog post also specifically mentions just sets, not LoD or builds in general - and as already aforemented by other commenters, it’s missing clarification on gems / augment levels.
Perhaps my understanding is misplaced, but that’s how I read it initially (and even after just now rereading).
I know this is a side tangent to the OP’s discussion of Witch doctor, but you are right, it’s worth bringing up.
All this talk of ‘fairness’ and ‘balance’ is nothing but smoke and mirrors. Unless every player has the exact same gear, with exact same stats, exact same paragons and exact same build, it will never be ‘balanced’. And let’s face it, even then, some players are just better at the game than others We’ve all seen it. Ever been in a group where an elite pack is killed and the impending explosion is building up to detonate? Smart players hang back and wait, but you can bet, there is going to be that one player who runs right into the blast to get those progress globes. No amount of ‘fairness’ or ‘balance’ will ever fix that, I don’t care what class you choose to play.
I made a response to some barb player who “gloated” about having successfully called the nerf to Chantodo in his post. I couldn’t care less what happened to Barbs, but he was making a show out of it so when WW got nerfed I felt petty.
Blizzard’s idea is that they take a cross-section of the leaderboard. As such it not the average player per se, but presumably top 1000 per region. Their process method has never been explicitly stated but it seems to involve taking each leaderboard, scaling/transforming the data to 5K paragon, and then taking an average. Then average the data for all regions per class in non-season.
As long as there are not significant differences in the distribution of players given their skills/pushing between classes, the noise in the data “cancels” each other out when comparing class-specific making averages. What I mean is that the more skilled/pushing players do not flock preferentially to a subset of classes.
This is an assumption though that there are not difference in average player skill/desire to push which there may well be.
As an aside about balance:
When the game producer Matthew Cederquist was initially posting about balance, he mentioned tha their first goal was to get the top build of each class more on par. Afterward, they would try to take on within class balance. The justification for the order was the sheer volume of sets.
If you replace “WD” with “Barbs” this sounds very similar to the argument the Barbs presented about WW/Rend around 3-4 months ago. Yeah, look how that turned out. Barbs still got nerfed. I suspect WDs might too.
“A common misconception is that we balance solely around 4-man groups. While we certainly take it into account, group play is not our only focus because not all players enjoy playing in groups.”
If they have to nerf the damage they should buff at least the toughness of the set.
That being said I don’t think a nerf is needed here. If you don’t like to play WD that is okay, play something else, but don’t cry for nerfs the second WD is on the top end of clears. This wasn’t the case for a long time and the WD mains are glad they have a spot in the meta now.
People care about what matters to them. Group play is more important to Blizzard for purely economic reasons. Treating gamers like second class customers unless they play in groups is a massive faux pas. They’re a stubborn lot. It’s like complaining about casuals. There’s a much larger number of casuals simply because it is easier to be one. If you don’t market to them you’re leaving a lot of money on the table.
My understanding of the balance metric from the balance blog was the average player can hit GR130 at 5kp, non-seasonal for the build being referenced.