Why don’t you buy 8 copies and solo TZ all on your own in this case ?
People can’t always find games with good ping. You won’t die to disconnect or lag when you go with other people. Anything can happen on hardcore when people are careless
You don’t need to do all hard works, each player only throw 1 skill is enough to kill a pack so it is less boring and less tiring.
People can have the same progress when killing mobs together. Some people might lose their spots due to kill mobs faster/slower than the host.
This is such an obtuse way of thinking, lets give streamers / people who have 7 friends an even easier way to level 99, making the discrepancy between party play and p1 even bigger. The way it works right now (that you get more exp while solo farming in a game with more than 1 player) is a compromise for people who don’t have fans to literally carry them to 99.
MrLlama is one of the worst diablo 2 I have ever genuinely seen, the guy doesn’t understand half of the game mechanics and is given free loot on a regular basis, having fans giving him baal minions on a tray. Would you argue he deserves the #1 on the ladder?
If anything, party bonuses should go away COMPLETELY. That would encourage fair competition. I mean, other arpgs split the experience gained in party because you have an easier time killing stuff, which is intuitive if you think about it. In diablo 2, it works completely the opposite.
After all, why should I get more experience in a party that kills stuff faster than a single person? It doesn’t make sense and it forces party play in order to get to 99 the fastest.
People who argue for more party bonuses are just bad at the game and expect other players to kill stuff for them faster than they can kill themselves.
Admit I can’t read OP because Ignored content but obviously it’s talking about a common design flaw of D2 where the fix is ploot and /player x command.
People are less competitive nowadays. There used to be no way to be #1 without playing 24/7 and bunch of helpers who TP Baal for you while you are running chaos.
In my opinion, the party bonus should only apply when more than half of the party members are on the same map. This will encourage people to play together. Otherwise there is no point to play with other people, I will just buy 8 copies and solo my own 8p.
Paying hundreds of bucks to play optimally is pay to win, don’t you think? Even if you don’t consider it pay to win, you’d have to manually enter the game with 8 different characters, which takes forever and it’s not efficient. If you automate it, then you get banned for botting. Great solution you got there buddy.
I personally dont care about what streamers and their crew are doing
Thats why i think allowing players to set player count at game creation is a good thing but this topic isnt about p8
99 is not that important
Its nice to have but far away from being a “must”
Have to mention again that players should not be rewarded for antisocial behavior, this is pure bad game design
SSF is the answer here
partied play is very inefficient loot wise compared to solo play
unless we implemente instanced p1 loot, i cant be behind this idea
if we do, yeah, i agree
look how mp scailing is designed
do you think 50% bonus hp per player is balanced?
i have to refer to my first post:
i just dont play with others, like never, MP is too crap in this game to be attractive for me if thats what you implying
I never said it’s a must, but it’s literally everything the ladder is about. Some people like the race, it’s not my fault you’re not competitive.
The vast majority of arpg players like playing those games alone because everyone has a different pace and diablo 2 also happens to be one of those arpgs that doesn’t have personal loot. Justifying your stance by saying it’s ‘antisocial behavior’ is ridiculous. I don’t know about you, but I have a full life outside of this game and I don’t mind playing it alone.
I 100% agree with this, we should have a separate ladder for ssf.
Yes, but you can bypass this by farming a separate area while in a p8 game. Which is where all the grievances are born from.
oh i am, alot, but d2r race is pretty dumb imo
also, i have made suggestion to improve the ladder with more boards like:
trash killed in hell
elites killed in hell
act bosses killed in hell
ubers killed
thats why we need to change that
i dont think so
MP was designed as a tool of player interation so using it for solo play is basically a misuse of the functionality and a big mistake from the dev team for letting this happen, aka bad design
oh no, dont get me wrong
im not saying group should be better than solo in order to “force” people to socialize
it needs to be equal in loot, bc its worst
it needs to be equal in xp, bc its much better
so playing with others can become just a matter of choice/preference, without any “missing out” feeling
and yeah, i too dont play d2r to make friends and i respect anyone doing the same
not only ladder, SSF can be a project for years and years so we should have a SSF mode for NL too
not really unless youre farming exclusively cows or ghosts
you may endup with more loot from trash, but they have a very high chance of rolling junkTC.
on the other hand you gonna end with less loot from elites as their drop chance is already fixed at 100% and you just gonna take more time to kill them
i think the game is far from perfect, for both solo and group and there are some things we need to improve
Not even remotely close, P8/1 is a gigantic difference. This is why botters, cheaters, streamers, and discord groups are fighting so vehemently against /players online. They know they are generating an advantage for themselves over people who just want to play a bit of D2 when they get home from LIFE. Even though by the stated design philosophy of D2R, they are ‘working around’ this and already doing P8[Shared stash anyone? Cow King, remember that guy? Etc.]
I can empathize with the desire for this, but it does not belong in D2/D2R. Griefing and PKing has always been integral to the era and culture of this game, and full banning players is a solid no. However, what they’ve done with their wretched new chat system is make it WAY HARDER to actually ditch griefers. We need back the old system which provided adequate recourse, but did not delete PK from the game.
Strongly disagree with you on all points and reasoning here.
By the way, I’ve seen this line of reasoning in a lot of logic leading to the most toxic and lame mechanics, behavior, and net results for this game. Not just from you, but from many posters on this forum. Let me point out that what you’re doing is making a derogatory moral judgement against players who are technically suggesting a more level playing field. P8 multiplayer exists and the workarounds are methods which would be considered a sort of organized cheating in other sorts of competition. Then again, it’s a giant joke to literally everyone that Ladder is supposed to be referred to as ‘competitive’.
Putting an emphasis on vindicating your sense of morality is not a philosophy that is going to generate good game design. Especially when we’re talking about a remaster of a monster of a classic like Diablo II which began an era. Literally still marketed as ‘Classic gameplay—the same Diablo II you know and love, preserved.’ Then again, they didn’t bother to implement the basic chat features which existed 20 years ago before they started changing a lot of other things.
sry, your reference is streamers?
im a regular player and i have no intend to make a living of d2r
ofc it does and there is no reason to think otherwise
if you like the thrill of being griefed
just dont use it
those who dont, well, is it so bad that people have more options?
d2 lod servers are up and running and i always tell myself that if i dont like the way d2r is going i can always go back
and i think this aplies to everyone
no problem
i want a game a little bit harder and you want the opposite
examples?
ok, if i may ask
whats your suggestion to even this playing field?
what changes whould you make to the game? if any
thats not what im trying to acomplish here
i dont think im better than those who play solo p8
as i said before, im not in d2r to make friends and i have no problem with anyone doing the same
what im trying to do here is to make a MP that is attractive to me, a average player bc now, the way MP is designed, it has no appeal
propaganda, never trust it
you have to think of d2r and d2lod as two completely different things
thats why d2lod servers are running and no one was forced into d2r version
all i can say is that i knew what i was buying and that changes were coming and will come to the game
I read it again, your assertion here is completely false.
No, read again.
Yes because what your suggesting is actually deleting options from other players, you just don’t acknowledge that because of reasons I’ve already said and you ignored.
Disingenuous BS. They exist if you want your cdkey and ipaddress flagged and timed out after ~5 minutes of mf runs. If you like that then you can play with literally no one but public bots on those wonderful servers.
You want to force group play on all content which is easier. You want to remove any remaining incentives for individuals to solo which are already very few. Again your assertion here is false and I suspect disingenuous.
A clear indication that you are merely typing responses filled with false information and not even reading or processing the posts you are responding to. I think our interaction here is coming to a close.
Because your statement is NOT TRUE. VERY SIMPLE. P1 IS WORST. P3/1 > P1. P5/1 > P1. P7/1 > P1. ETC. You are WRONG. I’m sorry that you have no idea what you are talking about. These mechanics have been explained.
I’m sorry that you have failed to read the posts you are responding to, it has been explained. Your suggestions not only attempt to force group play, delete incentive for solo play, but also DELETE PK FROM THE GAME.
You are an outright liar. Again. Completely ignorant or flagrant liar. I suspect the latter.
YOU need to read.
I’m sorry that this incredibly simple conversation is above your head. I’m sorry you lack an elementary level of reading comprehension. I’m sorry that you are likely a troll.
it is now clear that your knowledge of the game is limited to its first layer
im gonna try to educate you a little more
no drop decrease from increasing player count only aplies to trash mobs, containers, act bosses and one Sunique
trash mobs have the worst chance to upgrade qualities and a high chance to roll junkTC, making necessary 8-16 trash mobs at p8/8 to be worth one single unique monster in p1 when it comes to rares, uniques and set items
for runes, travincal at p1 with a horker is the best and easiest way to find them and trade for the one you want
you are completely hysterical
you sound just like a little kid who refuses the truth
but i read, much more than eurogamer and pcgamer guides like you
you already proved that theres nothing incredible about you son
the only one trolling here is the one refusing that d2lod dont run on any system
the funniest part here is that Celestialray keep liking your posts dispite you being blatantly ignorant about this game
this just shows how far people go to have support to their cause, to not feel alone in plain ignorance
anyway, try to calm down, im not your enemy
he lies inside your own head
Are you seriously making an argument that p1 is the best for… what, farming uniques in pit? And yes, p1 trav is the best for runes (actually, p3, because loot caps on p3 for non horked bodies), but it’s insanely boring.
A lightning sorc / javazon farming p8 cows or really any extremely high density terror zone (e.g. flayer dungeon, tal rasha tombs) can get better items than a p1 horker ever will. Your assertion that 16 trash mobs are needed to be killed in order to be worth one single unique monster makes me think you personally cannot kill them quick enough, because a good farmer (e.g. sorc or javazon) will kill both trash and rares extremely quickly. In those situations, you won’t get only runes or uniques, but you are rained with charms, the possibility of high TC items in TZ, crafting mats, decent rare items etc. I got most of my high runes from farming extremely good terror zones like flayer dungeon and tal rasha tombs and got a 5 ber rare ring, plenty of great skillers, baal charms that each went for pul+ a few weeks ago, insane amount of 71-70 sunder charms which I made bank from etc.
And there’s absolutely no contest that p8 is significantly better than lower player count for experience. You haven’t thought that players may go for experience as well, did you?
I wouldn’t mind p1 being equal in exp and loot to p8, in fact that would be pretty amazing because a lot of classes synergize extremely well, but it would be insanely difficult to balance sp and mp because there are so many factors at play. Consider the fact that a 2p party that has a barb and a dps will have more loot than any other combo due to item find, so how do you balance item find then?
no, for uniques you should go pindle, p1 with a horker
cap?
council no drop scales up to p7 but the decrease in no drop is not worth the extra time to kill
see, im not telling what you should be doing
im telling whats the best
i can play trav for hours and hours and not be bored
each with what works best for him
thats also not true, there is a reason a zerker is the best MF char in the game
no amount of gear and spd can beat +75% loot from hork
“quickly” is relative, yeah some builds can farm p7 at very high spd but this doesnt change the fact that its much faster to farm elites in p1
have to mention again that with p7, trash mobs drop more loot but you will get less from elites bc of the hp increase and the cap of 1 item, in the end youre basically trading elites for trash and thats not a good deal
if you want anything from the goodsTC(jewels, charms, gems and runes), its travincal you should be farming
about good rares, i think that pindle is the best
both with a horker ofc
if you all you do is TZs ofc all the good loot you get will come from them
what i mean is that the game is old and the numbers have been done so many times that we can categorize it as “general knowledge”
and i dont do trav or pindle all the time
im not contesting that
but this is why i said that players should be able to set player count at game creation
i didnt think it would be that hard
we can easily calculate the amount of gear and xp/hour a solo player and a team will get at any farm route
as you mentioned, FI is OP
and i think there are 2 ways of balancing it
nerfing it, but this would be a nail at barbs coffin
making a RW that would give FI oskill, this one i would put in helm and make use of a rune like sur to increase its value
i think the 2nd is the best, barb would still be the best MFer bc of FP synergy but not by a large margin
“but if everyone gets FI no one is gonna play it”
barb sucks bc melee sucks and and FI is just masking this fact by making people playing it to be able to find more loot
The time it takes you to save and exit and enter the zone again, you’re better off farming pits or a high rare density area of 85+.
The difference between p1 and p3 is about 50%, the difference between p3 and p5 is negligible, that’s what I mean.
You definitely didn’t play a lightning sorc in flayer dungeon or tal rasha tomb or even cows.
You don’t understand, some builds that have extremely good gear kill elites as if they were on p1.
Everything adds up. I played this game for more than 15 years and I have tested pretty much anything. I have farmed trav with a decked out barb and cows / good density TZ (as of recently) with sorc and the fact is that I made much more currency at the end of the day farming high density areas with certain builds. If you trade most stuff you find, you’ll afford a griffon’s eye or whatever much sooner than you would if you farmed trav with a horker, especially now with sunder charms which sell like crazy.
I wouldn’t be against that if game was actually balanced. If this was the case, casters would blow anything out of the water because melee clear speed is completely garbage right now.
A meta will always rise and people will always choose one or the other, it’s literally impossible to have perfect balance.
That’s why they need to improve class balance first, give barb and other melee classes some sort of aoe, more single target damage (since you’re melee, it should be more rewarding) etc.
youre not
remember that pindle drops 2 items and with a horker that almost doubles
thats why its not worth the time to play travincal with anything but a barb
a barb gets +75% at p1 while any other class needs p3 (+100% mob hp) to get +50%
ofc i did, as i said, i dont spend all my time betwen trav and pindle
the only worth mentioning is cows bc of how their TC favors goodsTC drops
but for cows to be almost as efficient as trav, it needs to be at p7 and the run cant take more than 200 sec, not to mention that a p7 cow farmer lite sorc is going o be very expensive if compared to a horker for travincal
about flayer jungle and tal’s tomb, they are not worth bc of how bad the TC of their mobs is
there are no builds that can run p7 at the same run time than p1
a hdin for example 1 shots a dark archer in pits@p1
on p7 hes going to need 3 shots to kill it
its even worst in cows bc cows have much more base HP
the same
i dont like basing simple mathematics on personal experience
as i said, the drop rates are know and the number have been crunched many times over these 2 decades
yeah, melee needs improvements
perfect balance is ofc impossible but a 10% variation betwen play styles/farm routes is achievable
You are in no position to ‘educate’ anybody, so please don’t make the attempt.
Ad hominem attacks are not arguments, and close to 100% of data you have presented is in some way faulty.
Please, you go back and play legacy. Have fun with that,
Actually, you are.
I’ve finally figured out your personality, for a long time I believed you were just trolling me … but that assessment was giving you far too much credit. What you are is a sociopath who only plays a horker barb with the bulk of his points in support skills and geared for mf. So because FOR YOUR ONE CASE, P1 IS MORE EFFICIENT (ONLY BECAUSE YOU HAVE CHOSEN A PLAYSTYLE SUITED FOR BOTS AND CANNOT KILL P8 EFFICIENTLY), and because you are a sociopath, you are in a technical sort of way making an honest assertion that P1 is the best. But P1 is not the best, it is only best for you. Not the best, actually in most cases, the worst.