My 2.4 Runeword that Fixes Mana Burn Bug

The heated debate on several threads on how to fix this game breaking Mana burn bug gave me a brilliant idea.

Just like there are “Cannot be frozen” mods on items or runewords. Just introduce some new 2.4 Runewords or Items that has the mod “Cannot be Mana burned” As well as adding in finally Mana Burn Resist/Absorb gear. This way we can play our builds and run in and sustain our Mana as intended against Mana burn packs.

The main issue with Mana burn is making it so it can be COUNTERED. There needs to be a counter just like you equip resistance gear and Tgods to counter the elements. There has to be a way to sit there and take Mana burn hits with a lot of builds. The only issues are in order to have proper counters that would require a lot of coding to add in Mana resistance gear, Mana absorb gear etc.

Tada!! We fixed Mana burn well at least a good work around the bug and the best 2.4 change I can think of to address something that has killed build diversity for too long.

Mana Burn was clearly designed to function like other elements. Just add in the Resist/Absorb gear and Cannot Be Mana Burned so it finally functions like the other Elements and how you counter them. You can’t argue these facts. Lets fix the devastating bugs and improve the game to work as it was intended.

Or. And hear me out here. They could fix the bug that makes mana burn 256x more powerful than it should be?

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This solution is the exact one that lowered the quality of the game so much. Spirit Runeword was a fix-it solution. Where a runeword solves a problem, and now every one is using that runeword and nothing else. Spirit Runeword solved “every problem”, easy starting item, 55 fhr for tele to baal, what else you need put it on the starter item.

No, not a one-item-fixes it, instead Mana burn is a drain over 2 or 3 seconds, a real fix.

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Well there is 2 bugs that bug then the one in Hell where it gives you -100 Mana resistance even though there isn’t any gear that can give you Mana resistance.

I’ve proposed valid changes to address both bugs such as a new damage formula, mana resistance gear as well as Mana absorb. However to have Mana burn countered properly just like the other elements and redoing the damage formula might prove to be a lot of coding and work. Would it be better? Sure.

So I came up with the idea to just treat it as a mod on gear, since there should be some gear that counters Mana burn. Which “Cannot be Mana Burned” works just fine and doesn’t require all this coding to fix both bugs easily.

There needs to be a counter to where you can Tank hits from Mana burn and sustain your Mana. Which I believe could be done with a new damage formula or Mana burn resistance gear etc as mentioned above and in the other threads. However again that’s a lot of coding to provide a decent fix and these fixes have been heavily debated.

In the end we just want Mana burn fixed. I doesn’t matter how we get there, if they remove Mana burn from the game to fix it or add an item that fixes it. In the end removing the Mana burn bug issue nets only positives, where game play improves for a lot of builds. Where build diversity can be enjoyed without this game breaking bug.

I would say your suggestion could work if the Mana drain is small enough so gear can counter it. Which means Mana leech or Mana regeneration could counter the drain over time so you can charge into and Tank Mana Burn packs as intended. The true fix is having gear be able to “counter” the mechanic of Mana burn. Just as elemental resist counters the elements.

Nah, let’s just take this line of thinking to its logical conclusion and have the El rune grant “Cannot die” mod. It’ll increase build diversity when nobody can die. Especially in HC!

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Nonsense … its not game breaking, its just mana burn. Deal with it. If it would be proccesed like by you - sure delete immune monsters for greater variability of builds(lol?) or do runeword which have ignore monster immunities. I hope Blizzard will not read topics like this. Do not try to make game easier, it´ll destroy the whole game.

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It’s a bug. This isn’t a case of the game being designed hard & people wanting it to be easier. It’s a case of someone making a mistake where the math is done in the wrong order, so it doesn’t work how the documentation says it should. Moreover, it’s a bug that mostly affects melee characters in a game where intentional design already favors casters.

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That Mana burn has 2 game breaking bugs which is unintentional. So that is the issue that needs to be fixed and I proposed a viable way to deal with these 2 bugs.

Right and fixing this bug would help out a lot of builds and build diversity. If they are looking at buffing Melee, start here and fix the Mana burn bug that ruins gameplay.

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I’m extremely non-depending on Mana, with my Zealot. But with JUST 3% leech, I recover from Mana burn in a snap.

Isn’t that a reasonable solution? Keeps those monsters dangerous, as it should. But it helps compensate a lot, with just one small and easy mod. And you have plenty more ways to recharge fast. And they all stack.

I’m very ignorant on casters. Just sayin’.

It’s never been about Monsters remaining dangerous in Diablo and aren’t in most ARPGs. Dangerous monsters are countered by gear. That is why we have gear progression. They are dangerous till the adequate gear is acquired.

The problem is there is no Mana Burn resist gear or Mana burn absorb to counter it like there is other Elements. So just like you put on Light resist gear and T gods to make lighting not dangerous anymore. The same should happen for Mana burn. That is how good mechanics in game design work. You have dangers then counters to eliminate the dangers.

The problem is they do 512 times more mana burn than intended. 256 in normal then in hell you have -100 Mana resist and you can’t get Mana resist gear. If I could slap on 200 Mana resist gear and Mana absorb the bug would be less obnoxious. ( I’m not sure if they want to code in the correct way to fix the bug though, which is why I came up with this idea)

So when you Mana goes instantly to 0 many builds are just dead or can’t be played. Which only hurts game design and the health of the game if a build can’t be played due to the Mana burn bug.

There needs to be a way to maintain your Mana and not have it go to Zero especially in builds where their Mana is their HP. Imagine a mob that HP burns all your health because of a bug. That isn’t fun.

All that matters is we fix this gamebreaking bug so the game can be enjoyed by more builds and not ruined by mechanics that can’t be countered. So I don’t care how we get there as long as we do.

I described a counter. Literally Mana leech.

Just because it’s not a straightforward, overtly simplistic resist, doesn’t mean it’s not a counter.

I think it’s actually nicer than a simple resist, because it challenges you to adapt. Just like you learn to balance your life recovery needs with a mix of potions, leeching, regeneration, skills and so.

I get that it’s a bug. Yes. Because it’s way stronger than officially declared. That alone, justifies fixing it.

I just don’t see how casters cannot compensate, and find it a deal-breaker. I compensate nicely with just that small leech, in NM. Getting larger leech is easy, and there are plenty more mods to use. I also have mana regen and dam goes to mana, now. And I wasn’t even looking for those, nor am I equipping that gear for those mods.

Yeh il just slap a mana leach ring and make sure to slap the monsters with my orb to gain mana and hope i get enough leach to tele out :face_with_raised_eyebrow::face_with_raised_eyebrow:.

I dont think you understand.

Mana burn is broken.
When the main champion boss has mana burn, and you kill him. His minions continue to have mana burn on them.

Never mind an item to counter it, just make it like how poison dmge works.
That way your not going from 2.8k mana to 0 just by having the monsters breath on you.

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It isn’t a counter though because it doesn’t fix the 2 bugs. Not everyone uses Mana leech. Some builds use Mana as HP. We want to fix the bugs so builds can be played.

If you can’t sustain your mana in mana burn packs without having your mana reach zero then it’s not a counter. We need to fix the bugs and get it to a reasonable level. Or just remove Mana burn from the game either works.

Because their Mana goes to Zero and some builds require their Mana to stay above 50% to live. If it reaches zero they die. We want to fix this gamebreaking issue so these builds can be played and enjoyed. Just like they are enjoyed in PvP but can’t be played in PvM. The reason is because PvP doesn’t have Mana burn. Maybe PvM shouldn’t have it either if it can’t be fixed.

The game instantly becomes better when Mana burn is gone. More builds can finally be enjoyed as intended. This mod of “Cannot be Mana Burned” gets us there. Lets have fun and fix this issue.

Doesn’t work because of how it’s calculated and you aren’t seeing the problem. None of your suggestion help or fix the issue. The issue is sustaining mana and having a counter so it isn’t burned.

Ok. I didn’t know, that touching zero Mana or even coming close to it would be such a danger. Sorry.

I still see it as a counter for the mana loss itself, but I can see how that’s not nearly enough for people that are THAT dependant on mana. And indeed, it’s not literally a bug-fixer and I didn’t claim it was. And again, it’s a bug because it doesn’t work as intended and I agreed to that.

Me, I just recover the mana from Mana Burn almost as fast as it’s being burned. But I do go really low, or even touch zero for an instant. It just doesn’t make that big a difference for me, but I get that it does for you.

I honestly thought you’d have way better ways to compensate for mana drain of all sorts, as part of caster builds. Just for the sheer need the builds have, even before factoring Mana Burn in.

I still don’t think a new mod would be good, unless it’s common enough that it doesn’t force everyone and their dog to chase after 2-3 items.

I’m frankly tired of how so many builds and strategies act like they’re awesome, then rely on very very very specific uniques and runewords. Like, only 3-4 items in the ENTIRE GAME, and spectacularly uncommon ones at that, will do the trick.

Also, totally bypassing the Mana Burn sounds cheap. The game should always have at least one or two kinds of enemies that make it a lot tougher for you all of a sudden (without it being an actual bug). It makes sense, that turning your hero into a “super effective or downright PERFECT against ALL POSSIBLE THREATS” should be impossible, or nearly so. Perfection is BORING, and unchallenging. Unless reaching it is incredibly difficult.

BUT there’s a massive difference between “difficult” and “unlikely.” If you NEED to rely on super-uncommon drops, it’s not challenging so much as just improbable. Chance-driven, thus hardly related to your effort. By sheer mathematical probability, your hunt for that coveted item will most likely be either too easy or too hard.

I DO understand and agree, with the fact that just adding a mod that denies mana burn entirely would be the simplest and easiest solution coding-wise. The least likely to break anything, and so.

How about this? Just put a simple, hard cap on how low Mana Burn can take you. Like, no lower than 50%. Sure, it cripples you but in a “I’m being challenged” way. Not in a “I’ll be dead before I can do anything about it.” I often try to see what abilities a unique brings, but the heat of the battle may not let me. And of course, maybe the minion does it to you and you haven’t even had a mathematical chance to check on the unique to find out. And you probably don’t wanna rush ahead to learn, because you’ll draw a lot of attention fast.

Maybe that Mana Burn cap can be based on character level, or Energy score. So it still relies on how strong you’ve made your character, but not in a way that has to bring a lot of new considerations or extra mechanics.

I’ve often said, Attributes should play a bigger role. Str and Dex are quite useless beyond equipping gear, even for physical melee builds. That is, considering how difficult it is to increase those scores substantially and permanently.

For one thing, Str doesn’t affect actual damage nearly enough. I’ve had massive (25%+) boosts to it from items all of a sudden, to find out the dam increased only ike 3%. And that the +% to damage wouldn’t even work on that small base increase…

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It’s cool. The main one is ES builds where 95% of your damage taken goes to Mana instead of HP. (basically your low life builds in PoE where you have no HP) So all points are invested in Energy and you wear Mana gear. Then you take Telekinesis to reduce the damage your Mana takes. The reason why you need points in Mana too is because resist don’t effect damage that goes to Mana so you need a big Mana pool. So if something Mana burns you to 0 you are dead.

Furthermore some of the more interesting builds like Melee sorcs can’t use ES to be tanky because of this bug. Furthermore life leech and mana leech doesn’t work on elemental damage.

They key to the build is sustaining your mana because it is your HP. Mana burn is effectively just like HP burn. So it hurts build diversity and prevents some cool melee builds from being really viable.

I’m all for build diversity and would like to see this bug addressed. Especially when people make Mana builds for PvP since there is no mana burn they are very effective. However it sucks to not be able to play your build in PvM and only PvP. So this addresses a big gameplay issue in PvM.

It could be a rare roll too so you can get on rings, ammy, circlets etc. The goal is fixing the bug so builds can be played. Would be really cool to finally play some of these build as intended if the bug wasn’t here or Mana burn could be nullified.

Edit:
So you can see a version of the ES in action where it’s typically used in PvP. You can see that he has 1 HP but is tanking a WW Barb and all the damage goes to mana and no damage goes to HP. It’s one of the more fascinating builds in Diablo, just a shame it can’t be played in PvM. It’s these types of builds that would be fun to enjoy if the bug didn’t exist. Fun video though since you never seen the build.

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He really only want an easy way out of anything that could kill his character.

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Even tho i don’t agree with a Full mana burn removal, Some idea that was brought in the others topic were kinda interesting, I did like the suggestion to make Manaburn deal damage just like poison and the one to change the value to flat damage to mana… but a straight mod on item that does ‘Cannot be mana drain’ seem a bit to strong.

To play devils advocate is the “Cannot Be Frozen” mod bad for the game? Even though it removes being frozen. Arguably most would say it’s essential in some builds and makes more builds playable.

No idea why we can’t have “Cannot Be Mana Burned” so more builds are playable just like “Cannot Be Frozen” helped builds be playable. I just think it’s an adequate counter and increases build diversity.

Yea a new formula can be done as well.

Norm - 50 mana burn
Nightmare - 75 mana burn
Hell - 100 mana burn per hit

This makes it to where you can gear and counter the mechanic. This should be implemented too. However just like there is a “Half Freeze Duration” which helps against the frozen mod you can also still get “Cannot Be Frozen” So why not do both in regards to Mana burn? Why not fix the 2 bugs and also have a way to fully counter Mana burn which coincides with other mechanics that can be fully countered in game?

Just don’t see the problem when other things have ways to half remove it then also fully remove it but when it comes to Mana burn it’s off the table. Every mechanic in game has a great counter and Mana burn is the only exception at this time.

I have Bowazon, Javazon, and Druid unplayable in Hell because there’s not only mana burn bug but “You can’t use mana at all” bug. All have mana steal but that’s not working at all too. Really sad.

I have played just about every class and spec, and I have to say mana burn has never made the game unplayable for me. It sounds like OP just wants an unkillable character.

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