The Faith GMB is always better man. It literally equates to higher on-screen character screen damage AND fires faster at 7fpa. The Faith GMB actually has A LOT higher DPS than the WF setup.
Not sure who ran that test/competition but something was faulty there. Maybe someone ran their Faith GMB setup incorrectly or they were inexperienced, or maybe the guy running the WF rolled an easier Chaos clear than the person using Faith, or maybe when the guy who used Faith ran through River, he took a couple bad turns got blocked by dead end bridges and kept having to run back, I donāt know. But 100% guarantee you that whatever happened there was faulty if WF was coming out on top.
Also, I ran the math on the 8fpa 60/160 WF vs. 9fpa WF/Fort, and you were right on one thing. The 9fpa WF/Fort very slightly out DPSes the 8fpa 60/160, but it isnāt by much at all. The gain from Fortitude is about 10% DPS and the loss of DPS in dropping from 8fpa to 9fpa is about 9%. They virtually deal the same DPS output, but the 9fpa is gaining like 1% to 2% more over the 8fpa.
And I did catch your point made about āWF fires 2-3 multi and moves on when GMB Faith fires 3-4 multi to move onā but I think maybe you misunderstood my original post on these numbers. The Faith GMB is not dealing more damage because it is faster. The Faith GMB actually has more raw sheer damage than WF regardless of IAS, and in addition to that also fires a lot faster. So really no matter how you look at it, the Faith GMB will hit just as hard on average with a single multi shot as any 8fpa or 9fpa WF setup, but the GMB Faith can fire 3-4 multis in the time it takes WF to fire 2-3 multis.
Sorry, I hope this makes my stated numbers clear.
Not trying to argue, just trying to be helpful.
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No, I really do appreciate your input. Not trying to argue as well, just trying to get at the truth. Apologies for my confusion, but I canāt get the numbers you are getting for damage per shot. Iām not aware of the policy here re: posting links, but if you have time, would you mind looking at this maxroll character profile for GMB Faith/Pride vs. WF/Pride?: h t t p s://d2.maxroll.gg/d2planner/g70106do#2. I tried to optimize the equipment around the IAS breakpoints. The adjusted per shot MS damage on the Faith setup is 1215-6866; itās 694-9632 for the WF setup (i.e., 4040.5 average vs. 5163 average). The single target MS DPS is slightly higher for the Faith setup (23,668 vs. 22,387).
That aside, my overall preferred PvM setup is Diamond/Shadow Faith w/ Giant Skull. I can easily hit the 7fpa bp without appreciably compromising DPS compared to GMB while getting KB, a large str bonus and some CB for javaside boss killing. This setup also allows flexibility around using Razortail vs. Nos. Versus WF, personally, itās Faithās QoL improvements (resistance bonus, skellies for diverting attacks from ranged, and more damaging/survivable merc) that push it over the edge as opposed to what Iāve observed in terms of damage/clear speed.
faith on ama is indeed much better.
Might aura is a given, but we can actually argue which weapon to put on a merc in different settings.
I had a pride with a 20 con aura and I really didnāt like it very much.
In /p1 settings, I really didnāt need the extra dmg, I honestly didnāt even notice any difference in dmg. Merc still does decent dmg but the biggest issue with pride is that it has no crushing blow.
Amazon is great vs hordes of monsters, but really is terrible against bosses. pride doesnāt do jack for bosses and bowazon is weak against baal for example.
So when I was doing baal runs on my bowazon, I actually swapped pride to infinity. Reapers toll might be an option (never tested that one).
Donāt know on higher difficulties, I guess bowazon is kinda weak on /p8 anyways
Finally I just say that I was disappointed by pride.
But no matter what, everything is better than a faith merc. If we get in the future another fana runeword, it maybe would make WF more viable, but even then you might need to socked a Jah rune into it :}
I switched my Amazon to a Bowazon recently and Iām loving it. I appreciate the discussion I just read through. I decided to go with the act 2 might merc, and for his weapon of choice, I went with eth reapers toll. It is great quality of life having the merc decrepify everything. Not only does it greatly enhance my damage, it is also great for dealing with physical immunes. I also roll a gm faith bow +15 fanat (lucky roll). Strafe is my attack of choice and there isnāt an area in the game I have any issues with. I maxed Valk and strafe, guided arrow, and penetrate.
try mutlishot, it is much better than strafe anyways and way more fun.
on p1 everything already is dying offscreen. valk is maybe only useful for bosses.
i guess reapers, infinity or obedience is fine, especially for bosses. Pride is good for trash but didnt notice any difference on p1
I use multistot on large areas like cows. It has its uses in wide open areas. It is certainly a great 1 pt or 3 pt wonder depending on how many +skill you have.
IĀ“ve found a jah rune and I want to start a bowa too. I have also a wf in stash. IĀ“m not rich so I have just 1 try to reach at least lvl13 at gmb. Or should I donĀ“t risk it and use a shadow? The shadow faith is also better than the wf, isbt it?
shadow is safer if you are not rich, good for resale as well if you want to switchā¦ GMB resale is just sad if you have a low roll, depends if you want to gamble. Afterall, the game is about taking risk.
I will definitely roll on GMB, haha.
trade the jah for a +1/13 gmb and you will be happy enough.
You just need +13 and with that roll the gmb lost so much value already that you probably can get one for jah or jah vex at most.
For whatever reason, faith has the habbit to roll 1/12 or 2/12 very often :\
shadow bow, well is okish but certainly not the best. advantage obviously is that a merc can use it as well
Just did that yesterday.
Found a SoJ and traded it along with a Sur for a Jah. Took the risk and it backfired 
As Iām usually only playing around players 1-3 casually itās fine nontheless, still lacking Pride on my merc anyway and finding that will take me another couple of months.
Does anybody else have weird sound bugs when firing multishots into a lot of enemies? The only sound left is a rapid āclickingā sound until the arrows are gone.
yes the sounds bugs sometimes with multishot
cannot recommend pride very much.
I even had a lvl 20 pride eth thresher and didnāt feel any difference on p1. The problem was that on bosses, pride is really crap and bowazon really struggles with bosses.
I switched to obedience instead and works quite well. Infinity was also quite fine but obviously totally wasted. Reapers toll MIGHT be the best option, but donāt have one to test
Thatās my choice currently, but a non eth version. In my long years of D2 I never found a rune above Sur (and that SoJ yesterday also was my first ever) so Iām here for the long run.
I donĀ“t use a merc with faith, because the ranger sucks. But I could use it on other chars. I think a druid summorer with faith should be fun 
Actuallyā¦ I just went toying around and if maxroll isnāt wrong then it isā¦ not. I am just about to revolutionise PvM for ultrarich bowas 
. With Saracen chance and IG from beast, WF can hit 7 FPA with LoH, Forti, WT, and 15/40 Jewel in WFā¦
The level 9 Fanat on Beast will make you require 105%ias to be able to hit 7fpa with the WF.
Btw, you mean Metal Grid, not Saracenās ^^
But you know what? I think you might actually be right. If you ACTUALLY did this and could reliably keep that IG alive, that setup would definitely be heavier pvm damage.
But losing that IG is an awfully expensive risk. Not gonna lie. And it hurts that you donāt have tele to reposition him.
If you really go this route, I advise well learning the technique of quickly pushing ESC/Save & Quite when necessary, HC style.
I am not planning to do it (and yeah meant metal grid not saracen- I always mix those 2 for some reason) - specifically mentioned ultra reach bowas (If I remember correctly IG without hard points in it disappear between games, dunno though about D2RE) It was more of a curiosity find really.
Mastered Esc/Save in D1 - had all scratched disc resulting in naked char upon death .
Edit: Shouldnāt have found this setup, now canāt stop thinking about it, and it is not something I can afford 
To clearify my issue with the faith base. When Iām unlucky and roll the lvl12 fana. Is the 7 fps shadow stronger when the 8 fps gmb and if it is, how much?
Honestly I am not sure about damage output and I somewhat biased in the fact that I really donāt like GMB Faith, but because of:
I would consider Shadow/Diamond over GMB, just because of value. Shadow/Diamond (for some reason people seem to prefer Shadow) will keep their value and you still can farm perfectly fine + you get bonus Ammy/Belt slots. If you really want GMB, then you can roll another and if fail, just keep farming for next one.
Also if you get a hold on 15ed Shadow and make Faith in it I donāt think you will have much problem trading it for 13 Fana GMB (maybe wrong on that, but I did trade 15ed 4 os Shadow for Ber recently, so it seems to add up).
Edit: If you however planning to use it on other characters I would go with Diamond as it is 188 vs 132 Dex.
Thats a good point. Iāve found a 4 socket shadow already, but Iām still looking for ke of them with +ed
Diamond would be great.
If youāre building if for pvp you want Diamond.
The Diamond has lower DEX req, which allows you to add more VITA that you would be able to do with a Shadow.
Diamond is only .5 average damage less than Shadow, which is a negligent damage difference.
Diamonds & Shadows deal about 15% less average damage than a GMB btw, in case you were wondering.
You want to use GMB if itās pvm but Diamond is just better for pvp. With Diamond you can wear Clegs & Dungo, still have 65%ias 7fpa. Those Clegs are important now in pvp.
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