They made single player just for you!
2 Likes
They got gheed, and cain, and akara.
There is no game on the planet where there is no player with any sort of boost/RMT/whatever the next thing is you want to complain about going on. Literally zero games. So, you’re going to have to settle for SP or realize that your own character is legit and stop worrying about it.
It doesn’t matter that the ladder isn’t competitive. Ultimately, the conditions for competition have been set by the players rather than by Blizzard, and you’re not going to fix that without removing the multiplayer from bnet D2. Just look at D3, they had to turn ladders into GR seasons, then striate the leaderboards by class and group size 1-4. Even then, the players willing to endlessly bot for +5 main stat, and use the only the most meta 4 man group ever have a shot at doing the highest rift each season.
Look at all these hoops you’d have players jump through just to play the game:
No. That’d be a reason to stop playing bnet altogether.
You can already do this.
Using what, Blizzard’s magic “ban wave” button that bans only bots without pouring through hours of game data for every player to scrutinize who is botting?
The game in general should allow the use of /players command because it will change nothing about how people choose to farm. Some midwit will jump in and talk about “it supports the lobby when I tele to baal and then leave to solo clear the TZ”. It’s the same “anti-social” gameplay as a private game.
I have to wonder what lobby they’re talking about, because the ladder lobby is a ghost town with all group play being in private games organized on discord servers. It’s nothing more than gatekeeping to force everyone to play the game how they believe it should be played.
1 Like
lol does the op REALLY think he can make ladder competitive??? rofl
your idea does nothing… streamers still have the most hours in the day to stream
bots still can play 24/7
d2 is NEVER going to be competitive.
deal with it.
ladder isnt a measure of who is cheating damage or getting free stuff… ladder is a measure of exp… aka time.
your idea will not change that… you would also need to make the game kick that account off after like 4 hours of play per day… which is what any normal adult who has a job can manage.
and that of course will NEVER be done… so you can NEVEr have competitive ladder… also… this game is rng based… you cant compete if someone else your competing with wins the rng lottery even if all other things remain the same
A discussion with Tohki-1314
Given our previous discussion regarding D2 botting, I would suggest that you review the subject of automation.
Derailment, speculation on whether or not Blizzard can review their own data or the cost of them doing so is tangent to the conversation. Let’s give them the benefit of the doubt and say that they can figure it out. What objection do you have to a multiplayer option with these restrictions:
Characters may not be
- Purchased
- Rushed
- Boosted
…
And Rewards
- Ladder specific seasonal item
- /players command as it functions in SP
Tohki, please review the subject of automation. From previous discussions it is obvious that you were not involved in the D2 Botting scene or even have a rudimentary understanding of how they worked or what they were capable of decades ago. Counter-measures can be employed, let’s give Blizzard the benefit of the doubt here. We can agree that you do not believe they can.
What objection do you have to a multiplayer option with these Restrictions:
Characters may not be
- Purchased
- Rushed
- Boosted
…
And Rewards
- Ladder specific seasonal item
- /players command as it functions in SP
An argument of semantics from a D2 neophyte I’m afraid. Rushing and Boosting are very different but do both run counter to the spirit of my proposed optional ladder.
Sir, you have not understood me. I want a ladder where the user is prohibited from purchasing items, rushes, leveling services, etc. I am not advocating for nor alluding to wholesale character accounts.
Yes typically the proprietor of competitive events maintains control of the competition in question.
Not forces, this would be a new optional ladder mode that runs in tandem with the existing mode. Options. Keep the existing ‘Cooperative Ladder’ as it is, and add a ‘Competitive Ladder’ as described. Win, win.
I guess you haven’t been reading, they simply are not the same. Good luck to you, sir.
Is this not a valid goal? Rather a lofty one, but what objections to it do you have?
I’m having some trouble empathizing with your views here, on the one hand its an idealized impossible pipe dream, but on the other it’s exactly the same as what we have now to you. You clearly have ideas, so I will encourage you to create a topic about the ideal ladder mode for you. Or if you would change nothing, then one about your experience on the ladder thus far. Good day to you sir.
Obviously, but that has nothing to do with my proposed ladder except for the fact that you will not be able to get rushed because it is a competitive, rather than cooperative ladder.
Okay let me explain to you the difference in the traditional D2 nomenclature:
- A Rush refers to clearing all acts in a single difficulty rapidly using an existing character for the benefit of a new character. This is Act 1 through Act 5, Normal, NM, or Hell Rush.
- A Rush+/Q/uest/S/kills/S/tats/WP/ refers to completing side quests that confer bonuses in the forms of open portals, waypoints, items, skill points, and stat points.
- A GRush or Glitch-Rush is any combination of the above rushes using the Ball Quest Glitch to gate fresh characters directly from Normal into Hell difficulty.
- Boosting refers to leveling services such as Chaos Runs / Baal Runs / Experience Shrine hunting / Boss last hitting
Only in your doomsday scenario where Blizzard cannot run a competition.
If you have a suggestion for a means to make the ladder system more competitive feel free to post it here or create your own topic about an idealized ladder option you would like to see. Many people would like to see a 1.08,1.09, 1.13 ladder mode. I would be interested to read it.
Sir, I’ve been responding to you, alas my time is limited. I do not know which path I can point you to that will make you believe that Blizzard is capable of running a competition. I would encourage you to look into another Blizzard IP called Starcraft.
Despite your assertion that your lack of faith and trust in Blizzard is a derailment to the conversation topic, it in fact is one.
I’m merely trying to maintain forum readability by condensing this off-topic conversation as much as possible. All quotes to your direct responses are unedited and linkable for anyone who is interested to read.
Sir, I have diligently responded to you in this very thread even to subjects which are decidedly off-topic. You however have merely doubled down on your theory of a paradox where my suggested rules are both exactly the same as what exists and also impossible to implement.
A heavily populated ghost town, where the bots are ghosts… very spooky place, every time a new ghost or … HUMAN … arrives, eerie chants begin … ‘~- best d2r item store fast delivery 24/7-~’ Legend tells of one hero who attempted to seal all the ghosts away using the power of the mythic Report System, but alas the evil curse of the Block List Full rendered this relic incapable of silencing the ghosts’ wretched screams and the hero was never heard from again.
Thank you for your contribution.
You can pretend to understand what it takes to ban bots without catching humans in the crossfire. There is no magic “ban wave” button that Blizzard can hit every week. To do weekly banwaves would require hundreds of manhours each week just to scrutinize between bots and human grinders.
Your mind lives in this dimension where bots are so sophisticated that they outperform human reactions to dynamically changing environments, but are also so obvious that Blizzard can easily ban waves of them every week for an entire ladder season.
ya like i’d be higher than 94 right now if i didn’t wanna sleep and do real life stuff. the race is a race if you want it to be a race but it doesn’t have to be if you don’t want it to be, and if you do want to race and you’re losing and complaining well, get gud… got it ?
Derailment, speculation on whether or not Blizzard can review their own data or the cost of them doing so is tangent to the conversation. Let’s give them the benefit of the doubt and say that they can figure it out. What objection do you have to a multiplayer option with these restrictions:
Characters may not be
- Purchased
- Rushed
- Boosted
…
And Rewards
- Ladder specific seasonal item
- /players command as it functions in SP
No game has successfully banned and prevented all manipulators. It is not possible. Not even to mention Blizz loves botters more than they care about you playing the game. In fact if you quit they’d think of it as a benefit. One less user who we already have their money not taking up server space.
Nobody is against conceptually what you’re talking about. Though I don’t care about RMT users/Rushed users/ Leveled users cuz it doesn’t make sense to spend too much time having nightmares about what other’s do in a video game, but you’ll never be able to manage that.
Even beyond that why do you care if someone gets a grush, levels up in chaos? RMT I can at least somewhat understand, but the others are things in the game. Or are you assuming grushes and level services are always bought and paid for?
It’s not derailment. What you’ve done is tantamount to declaring that world peace and ending world hunger should be the goal, but then when anyone asks “well, how are you going to accomplish that using real world methods”, you call it a derailment.
Ideals are great, but they’re not entire arguments. They’re not full plans. They’re nothing but a desired outcome, and if you’re going to ignore that ideals require realistic plans of action, then you may as well say nothing.
Tohki, please review the subject of automation. From previous discussions it is obvious that you were not involved in the D2 Botting scene or even have a rudimentary understanding of how they worked or what they were capable of decades ago. Counter-measures can be employed, let’s give Blizzard the benefit of the doubt here. We can agree that you do not believe they can.
What objection do you have to a multiplayer option with these Restrictions:
Characters may not be
- Purchased
- Rushed
- Boosted
…
And Rewards
- Ladder specific seasonal item
- /players command as it functions in SP
Rushed and boosted are the same thing, and has been a staple of D2 forever. Everyone already knows you’re not meant to purchase characters. In the context of a competitive ladder, none of these things matter.
The implication of a boost, rush, or purchasing a character is that someone is already ahead of you on the ladder race. A higher level character has to boost/rush a lower level character. A purchased character comes pre leveled and has no relevance to competing on the ladder for the first 99.
So it’s not so much an objection as it is apathy to irrelevant details. If you want a competitive ladder season, then Blizzard would have to take back control of competitive conditions away from the players. You’ve already seen an example of this in D3. D3 has no real multiplayer outside of parallel play to do a 2-4 man GR. There’s no boosting, there’s no rushing, there’s no trading. Even these groups at the top of those GR leaderboards spend the bulk of their time botting for +5 main stat and fishing rifts.
So you need to rethink what the problem is with the D2 ladder and come up with a solution that forces players to follow different competitive conditions from the current group funneling strategies, where a full team funnels progress into one person’s character.
A discussion with Tohki-1314
An argument of semantics from a D2 neophyte I’m afraid. Rushing and Boosting are very different but do both run counter to the spirit of my proposed optional ladder.
Sir, you have not understood me. I want a ladder where the user is prohibited from purchasing items, rushes, leveling services, etc. I am not advocating for nor alluding to wholesale character accounts.
Yes typically the proprietor of competitive events maintains control of the competition in question.
Not forces, this would be a new optional ladder mode that runs in tandem with the existing mode. Options. Keep the existing ‘Cooperative Ladder’ as it is, and add a ‘Competitive Ladder’ as described. Win, win.
I guess you haven’t been reading, they simply are not the same. Good luck to you, sir.
Is this not a valid goal? Rather a lofty one, but what objections to it do you have?
I’m having some trouble empathizing with your views here, on the one hand its an idealized impossible pipe dream, but on the other it’s exactly the same as what we have now to you. You clearly have ideas, so I will encourage you to create a topic about the ideal ladder mode for you. Or if you would change nothing, then one about your experience on the ladder thus far. Good day to you sir.
Obviously, but that has nothing to do with my proposed ladder except for the fact that you will not be able to get rushed because it is a competitive, rather than cooperative ladder.
Okay let me explain to you the difference in the traditional D2 nomenclature:
- A Rush refers to clearing all acts in a single difficulty rapidly using an existing character for the benefit of a new character. This is Act 1 through Act 5, Normal, NM, or Hell Rush.
- A Rush+/Q/uest/S/kills/S/tats/WP/ refers to completing side quests that confer bonuses in the forms of open portals, waypoints, items, skill points, and stat points.
- A GRush or Glitch-Rush is any combination of the above rushes using the Ball Quest Glitch to gate fresh characters directly from Normal into Hell difficulty.
- Boosting refers to leveling services such as Chaos Runs / Baal Runs / Experience Shrine hunting / Boss last hitting
Only in your doomsday scenario where Blizzard cannot run a competition.
If you have a suggestion for a means to make the ladder system more competitive feel free to post it here or create your own topic about an idealized ladder option you would like to see. Many people would like to see a 1.08,1.09, 1.13 ladder mode. I would be interested to read it.
Sir, I’ve been responding to you, alas my time is limited. I do not know which path I can point you to that will make you believe that Blizzard is capable of running a competition. I would encourage you to look into another Blizzard IP called Starcraft.
Despite your assertion that your lack of faith and trust in Blizzard is a derailment to the conversation topic, it in fact is one.
I’m merely trying to maintain forum readability by condensing this off-topic conversation as much as possible. All quotes to your direct responses are unedited and linkable for anyone who is interested to read.
Sir, I have diligently responded to you in this very thread even to subjects which are decidedly off-topic. You however have merely doubled down on your theory of a paradox where my suggested rules are both exactly the same as what exists and also impossible to implement.
Thank you for your contribution.
They’re exactly the same thing, and the next response should probably address the rest of what I said instead of trying to force this into a useless, semantic argument.
You don’t seem to understand your own talking points. If someone can rush or boost or sell you items, they’re already ahead of you on the ladder. This does nothing to the “competition” of a ladder season because the competition, the leaderboard, is first to 99.
You haven’t explained how a boost and a rush are different other than to assert that they are different. So I can just assert that they are the same thing. Do you see how that works? Dunce.
You cut off the relevant bit about “actionable plans”. Ideals accomplish nothing. Having goals accomplishes nothing. You need to concoct a course of action which achieves the goal. Are you an adult?
Because you haven’t identified the real problem that prevents the ladder from being competitive. It’s another chunk which you’ve omitted from what I posted, because it shuts down this entirely useless thread:
Respond to this, or finally admit that you have no idea how to “fix ladder competition” in D2.
tohki, i’m sorry but you’ve already lost if you’re willing to converse with turlok lol.
Yeah. He’s editing responses to new posts into an older post in this thread, which is baffling. He doesn’t know how to make or respond to a point.
ya that’s what i mean, there’s really no point in conversing with someone like that, especially if you’re trying to prove a point because the goal posts always move.
A discussion with SwiftKitten-1452
I believe that if you follow my easily implementable steps then the resulting ladder will be much more competitive than what we have today. It would be a stark change of pace for sure.
Streamers would be free and welcome to compete on this ‘competitive ladder’, or keep on playing the ‘cooperative ladder’ as it already exists and would not be changed. Encouraged, even! But they would probably prefer to remain in the cooperative mode where they can maximize viewer interaction. My suggestion for a so-called ‘competitive ladder’ is not designed to appeal to streamers or stream consumers in general.
If after faithful execution of the steps described above, the resulting ladder is not deemed ‘competitive’ then we can rename this optional mode to ‘at least we tried ladder’ or anything else you can come up with.
Getting free stuff, like fully completed runeword gear on day 1 absolutely matters. As you said about the level race ‘It’s a measure of exp… aka time’ ; having a fully kitted character makes your time far more efficient than a legitimately self found character.
There are many contributing factors, and pure RNG luck is one of them. I believe competition is possible in an event where RNG is a factor, but only when the RNG element is applied equally. /players command solves for RNG as much as possible.
No, there is no reason to do that and it is thus not included in my postings. Do not restrict the use time on a purchased product, that is unacceptable.
We can agree about how you lack confidence in Blizzard to be able to facilitate an actual competition.
Thank you for your contribution.
Here we go again…
The /p8 begging. 