Community Feedback for Improving Itemization

General Discussion
1408

hey thanks for the replies and for keeping the thread alive.

i just want to clarify a few things, mostly the reasoning behind my thinking.

If items or runes which have a low chance of dropping are too common because of bots, it is in no way the fault of the game. The bots are the issue. Everything I wrote here was under the assumption of a clean game, and I don’t think you can design around bots, unless you want to make the most common items BIS and put the bots out of business that way.

Secondly, regarding FRW. There are only 2 things that can compete with Enigma and Teleport. First is another source of Teleport. The other is enough movement speed, especially on classes that do not have good FCR frames or on builds that do not reach them. From this perspective, there aren’t enough (or strong enough) Faster Run/Walk items in the game. The more FRW, the better.

Thirdly, regarding Act3 Merc budget options. There are none and none can ever exist. As long as Prayer Merc + Insight exists (which is as budget as you can get), there really isn’t anything that can compete for other mercs on the “budget” tier. Perhaps the Vigor Bow for A1 mercs, but not even that.

Furthermore, I don’t see any reason for going through the trouble of redesigning items unless you’re going to make them somewhat BIS for certain builds/classes (outside of perhaps well rolled rares and blue exceptions).
People really do not care about what they get as placeholders. It’s all about the endgame and about getting BIS items, that’s where the chase really is.
So changing items for the reason of “it would be a budget alternative to x” is probably more trouble than it’s worth.

A small mention about TG with +2 lightning skills. yes it makes light sosos stronger, IF they can afford the 20FCR from arach. There is a tradeoff.

About the Zod/Cham changes. Yes, they would be powerful, exceptionally so. Yes, it would lead to power creep. It would also lead to people staying in the game longer. That 4 socket Steel Carapace that I proposed, you’re concerned it would be too strong with 4 Zods in it? I’m sure it would be. But the time investment required for such an item would be vastly increased, over an Enigma or Infinity, which have been BIS/Required for years now.
Furthermore, with Facets in the game, +1 to all skills may not be stronger for all builds. With Sunder charms, lots of sockets and facets, the requirement for having Infinity would be diminished, or at least you could try something else.
Regarding the items you mentioned that already have sockets and would be OP with Zods in them…great. if someone can actually legitimately invest so much in such low items, I don’t see the problem.

1409

Absolutely true, but thats what we´ve to deal with. In a perfect world we would not have this conversation. But we´re not in a perfect world. So :man_shrugging:

Again true! As said, I could see some TP itmes cautiously added. FRW is important as well. But I think the solution should not be adding al lot of FRW on a very rare item (so not only shadow dancer). On the other hand nerfing Enigma would help a lot, since that would create a tradeoff currently not there (since enigma has both).

I think there are some good Act 5 options now. But true, A3 is only something if you want to do something different. I still havent give up on seeing some buffs to Act 3 to come. A1 can be viable (maybe not really good, but for sure viable) with the changes indroduced (>cold with decent CC). But nevertheless. That doesn´t mean, that we not should supporting players who want something “different”. So Djinn Slayer is an option (certainly not the best, but now it has not a singel use case tbh).

Thats for sure! I spent probably almost 100h on this thread. Will it be worthless? Most robably! But I´m still hoping to see at least a fraction :slight_smile:

This is true, somehow. But with the proposed changes this item would be viable (at least for early late game), SSF for sure online al lot of times as well (this is all I want). It would not lift power levels at all, but then you could consider using it. At least until you´re hunt for something better was successful. And I think that is ok. We have over 500 uniques on the list. Given the different rarety they can´t all be BIS and a lot will not be viable if not found early. But not 480/550 wil remain just plain useless.
I played all the meta builds and now try to enjoy less frequent builds with a strong desire to not use only meta BIS Items. If we would see only some of that changes that would extend the years I enjoy the game by a lot without getting even more easy to play…thats all I want :slight_smile:

But thats might be only my point of view!

1410

i think the best ways to extend the years are to make new builds viable, and make existing builds stronger. this may sound bad because of power creep, but as long as this extra power is difficult to obtain, I have no problem with it.

For new builds becoming viable, we have Mosaic as an example. Some think it is OP, maybe it is, maybe it isn’t. I don’t think it is, not compared to what’s already in game. But what is undeniable is that many players never experienced that playstyle and were attracted back to the game because of the ability to create such a build.

For existing builds becoming more powerful, consider how some mods did it. They introduced the POE corruption system. Frankly, I am not a fan of it, but it did add an extra layer, a further “chase”.
I have an issue with such a system because it is not consistent.
Some items in the game are already very rare. When they drop, a low roll on them just feels bad. Take Tyrael’s for example, rare as it is, I’d like the joy of getting it to not be diminished by realizing it’s not a perfect roll. Same with Corruptions, you get a rare item, but you don’t get the corruption you want on it, makes you feel bad.

Variance is great for items that are not exceedingly rare, but for the ones that are already once in a lifetime, it’s just extra anxiety.

Hence my suggestion for Zod and +1 all skills. The rarest rune we have currently is almost useless. Making it be a goal, or making more than 1 or 5 Zods be the goal adds an almost endless chase for certain builds. As would Cham.

If the issue is that it would make builds like hammerdins more powerful, i submit to you that builds like hammerdins are already too powerful, which is perhaps what should be addressed. In other words, you can lower their baseline, but allow for them to scale, with massive investment, to higher levels.

Truth is the game is so complex that you can’t really buff an item and expect not to affect even the most currently powerful builds in the game

1411

Figure I’d comment on your Unique item suggestions.

  1. Tyreal’s doesn’t need +All Skills to be dominant. Fortitude is a prime example of that but for the sake of argument, why stop at +2 and not go +3 or heck +4? Amplify Damage on Striking is intriguing but that’s something it doesn’t entirely need given that Amplify Damage wands exist. Your idea on Salvation aura granting Elemental Damage boost doesn’t fit with the theme of it being a Defensive Aura(Elemental Absorption would however). I think a flat Resistance with the opportunity to increase it via 4 Sockets is the prudent way to go.

I got a new TM idea, see below…

New Tyreal Might Idea

Tyrael’s Might
Sacred Armor
Defense: 1803
Req Level: 84
Req Strength: None
200% Enhanced Defense
+1 Burst of Speed
Damage Reduced by 50
Enemy Monster Level Reduced by 20
Cannot Be Cursed
Cannot Be Frozen
Requirements -100%
Slain Monsters Rest in Peace
Indestructible
Sockets(4)

Enhanced Defense buffed to 200% for 1803 Defense(nothing stronger save for Ethereal Armor). Instead of Faster Run/Walk, I opted to add Burst of Speed as an OSkill. I did Teleport last time but I think Burst of Speed would be way better here as this would make Tyreal’s quite godly for Physical Builds since it not only provides a massive boost in Faster Run/Walk but also Skill IAS that you can’t get anywhere else save for the relatively new Hustle runeword(and even then its level 1 and a 5% Chance to Cast…).

I then removed All Resistance and added Damage Reduced by 50. It’s nothing new for Body Armor but not at this amount and given that Damage Reduced by X is applied before Absorption/Resistance, it can completely negate incoming physical damage if you get enough of it. Considering normal Monsters deal anywhere from 50 to 200 Damage on Hell Difficulty, it’s nothing to scoff at.

Enemy Monster Level Reduced by 20 is a new attribute that, to my knowledge, doesn’t exist anywhere. The Chance to Hit formula is affected by two factors: Attack Rating/Defense Rating and Character Level/Monster Level. We can easily affect the first factor but the latter factor has a much bigger impact and by reducing Enemy Monster Level by 20 makes it easier to hit the enemy and makes it harder for the Enemy to hit you. The biggest impact is on Ubers where their Monster Level is set to 110. With this attribute, they’d be set to 90, making it way easier to hit them with moves that don’t ignore the hit check.

Can Not Be Cursed is another new and frankly godly attribute that on its own would put Tyreal’s squarely at the top of the mountain for all Classes. Being immune to not only Amplify Damage, Decrepify and Lower Resistance but also Blood Mana for those Sorceress’ that use Energy Shield would be invaluable to have.

Final addition is adding 4 Sockets. This would permit players to add Resistance, more Physical Reduction, Physical Resistance, Faster Hit Recovery or w/e suits them(including Rainbow Facets for Elemental Damage).

  1. Templar’s Might yielding Sanctuary Aura is intriguing but it increasing Magic Damage isn’t how I’d approach it. I’d have it ignore Physical AND MAGIC Resistance of affected enemies. This would permit Hammerdins and Bone Necromancers to take down the Magic Immune Undead in Act 2 and Wave 2 on Baal with Templar’s Might, Lawbringer or Azurewrath. I’d also recommend -Requirements for this Armor because 232 Strength is a big thing holding people back from utilizing it.

  2. Redemption Aura on Steel Carapace is ok but I recommend keeping Damage Reduced by X over replacing it with 20% Physical Resistance. Damage Reduced by X is applied first and can completely negate incoming damage. Rather than remove it, buff it. Max Resistance kind of infringes on Guardian Angel imo, even if its 5% compared to the 15% on GA.

  3. Intriguing and I do like the Trap modifier but what about the Trap cap of five Traps at once? Perhaps increasing that cap would do more for Assassins.

  4. No Gloves in the game with +Cold Skills either but I’d still take 2/20’s over this.

  5. Ah there’s the Trap limit modifier and with Vigor Aura too!? Strength requirement though is too high and didn’t the old one have -20% Requirements for 167 Strength?

  6. This ring would be GODLY if you gave it Teleport and the Life/Mana per kill.

  7. Skill buff for PComb + Offensive auras is kind of nuts ngl, particularly if they don’t care about the 125 FCR breakpoint.

  8. This belt is better than Snowclash is for Cold Sorceress’. Yeah you need higher FCR for Lightning builds but given that it comes with 30 Lightning Resistance to offset the Sunder Charm, I’d take that.

  9. Solid and definitely competes with Griffons.

  10. Only thing I would propose is you add in Scepters for Clerics and change CTC from Struck to Attack. Lower Resist is an Offensive Curse so it should have an Offensive mechanism to activate it. If it were Weaken or Dim Vision, then being struck makes sense. As for the Enemy Resistance factors, that’s quite substantial since that -25% isn’t Nerfed like LR and Conviction is to Sundered Enemies and to get that from the Weapon slot helps Fire Sorceress a ton(can achieve -68% before Lower Resist and Conviction are even applied. Lightning Sorceress, by contrast, can hit - 60 with Crescent Moon + Griffons(80 with Jeweler’s Monarch or -85 with Self-Wielded Infinity).

1 Like
1412

I’ll go one by one of your points.

my goal was to make it an universally good item. the comparison to fortitude is an apt one, which is why I though of amp damage. yes wands exist, but consider the ease of use. the +skills and the salvation aura change are there to make it good for elemental builds, not just for phys ones.
it’s true what you say about defensive auras needing to be defensive, but that’s what makes them so unused, outside of specific circumstances.
in a straight up choice, would 20% to elemental damage compete with a -85% resist from conviction, or a -150% from conviction? never. but at least it would make it more desirable.

for ease of understanding, i thought of it increasing magic damage, but your suggestion essentially does the same thing, it would arguably be even stronger. My thinking was that Magic damage dealers need a bit of help (with the exception of hammerdins), as long as it helps them, great.

thematically, yes, the idea was to make it a tanky armor that could be customized, so i tried to pick universally strong defensive options, which other armors have more of. 5 vs 15%, 20% DR vs 25% leviathan and 30% shaft, etc.

more on this on the Shadow Dancers. Indeed it’s 2 new properties that have to be implemented, which makes these suggestions as improbable to be implemented as possible.

excellent, that’s what I was going for.
Also, i’m sure we can find some gloves that would be nice with +cold skills.

this is what I was going for. first, you would think they are exceptionally strong. but yes, it’s a 203 str requirement. is it worth it? maybe, maybe not.

5 is not that much, though it is enough for you to feel it. you do give up stuff for it. either a +skill, LL, Mana, CBF, AR, resists, etc.
Perhaps it would be better to have Teleport on an amulet though, since that’s indeed an even bigger tradeoff. Metalgrid is a solid contender in this regard.

it’s a +1 vs a +3 blue amulet. essentially the options are +3 and 10FCR from a blue, +2 and 20FCR from a crafted, or +4 and no FCR from this. If you don’t need the FCR, great. If you do, it’s a damage loss for sure, nevermind the other mods.

for sure not for a 200FCR nova build. again, better if you don’t need the FCR. indeed good if you need the lightning resist, not as great if you are already capped.

see i considered this. on one hand, on attack sounds like the way to go. but it would be useless for too many builds. On attack would only be useful for Palas, MA assassins already have mosaic. Traps and light sosos(though it may not be bis for them) do not attack. Fire sosos do not attack (unless you’re running an enchant bear or smth). Cold sosos do not attack. Cold druids do not attack. fire elemental druids do not attack.

which leaves the pallies and the fire claw druids. undeniably better if it’s on attack for them, but not entirely useless if it’s when struck. Worse for pallies and bears because of high defence, but not bad for warewolves since they get struck more. Should have added Scepters there, sure, but I think on balance, you’d want it when struck because it helps more builds that way.

1413

Wisp Projector is actually one of my favorite rings in the game. Hardcore players typically utilize TGods to deal with Lightning Damage(along with +10 Resistance cap) but I like Wisp Projector and having %Absorption along with Dwarf Star to handle Fire Damage. You add Lightning Resistance, Teleport and Life/Mana per kill effects and Wisp Projector would be pretty strong for any class/build.

What I’d really love to see is a Flickering Flame counterpart for Resist Cold and Resist Lightning. As such I have a couple runeword submissions:

Permafrost(3 Socket Helm): Sol + Ohm + Pul

Level 4-8 Resist Cold aura when equipped(varies)
+3 To Cold Skills
-10-15% to Enemy Cold Resistance(varies)
Damage Reduced By 7
+30% Enhanced Defense
Attacker Takes Damage of 15
Can Not Be Frozen
+5% To Maximum Cold Resist
Poison Length Reduced by 50%

Capricious(3 Socket Helm): Pul + Lum + Lo
Level 4-8 Resist Lightning aura when equipped(varies)
+3 To Lightning Skills
-10-15% to Enemy Lightning Resistance(varies)
+30% Enhanced Defense
+10 to Energy
Regenerate Mana 15%
Magic Damage Reduced by 5
+5% To Maximum Lightning Resist
Poison Length Reduced by 50%

Basically Helm runewords for Act 3 Mercenaries and anyone looking to counteract Sunder Charms. Speaking of Act 3… I got a Shield runeword just for them.

Devotion(4 Socket Shield): Jah + Ber + Hel + Dol

10% chance to cast level 20 Fade when struck
Level 16-20 Prayer aura when equipped(varies)
+100-150% Enhanced Defense(varies)
+2 To All Skills
20% Faster Cast Rate
+50 To Life
+30% Faster Hit Recovery
Damage Reduced by 8%
Replenish Life +7
Requirements -15%
+3 to Light Radius

Devotion is a new Shield runeword I devised that fills two particular roles. 1) It grants Prayer aura, the first runeword to do so, that could potentially see use on not only Paladins but perhaps other casters provided they’re able to cover the constant mana cost Prayer has. 2) It covers up a huge hole Act 3 Mercenaries have in recovery. Since Act 3 can’t rely on Life Leech and Life Tap, we’ve basically resorted to using Phoenix(which isn’t cheap) or pumping them full of potions. By placing Prayer on an Act 3 Merc, they can replenish their life over time while being significantly easier to equip thanks to that Hel rune.

2 Likes
1414

some feedback on this
the strength of act 2 prayer mercs lies in the fact that the healing for prayer is doubled/tripled with Insight and Cure. This is because their Prayer is native, it’s considered as if they have invested hard points in it, so it acts as a synergy for Meditation/Cleansing.
If the Prayer is granted by an item, it will not count as hard points invested, so Meditation/Cure will not double/ triple it.

So you would end up with a weaker merc, weaker healing, for a considerably higher rune investment.

1 Like
1415

I generally like that approach of a lvl 57 3 OS cold RW. But how does that compare to Nightwings? I wouldn´t like to replace NW in any scenario. But I guess +3 Skills and the - cold resist along with CBF might be too much? CBF alone is mighty compared to FF.

How about adding only +2 skill, change CBF to HFD (we proposed that HFD should stack) and only give it 7-12 minus cold resist. Still super solid for an really obtainable Ohm. But would be a good alternative for rare druid pelts and an options for coldzons?

Same here. LO transfers to lvl 59. It competes with lvl 76 Griffons (what is soo much rarer). So I would clearly keep the power distance to this by making a light RW even weaker (Lightning caster don´t have problems at all). No FCR is a good starting point. But I would also capp skills at +2 and -res to 7-12 and PLR to 25%. I think it should be good but not nearly as good as a low rolled Griffs.

And honestly, FF filled a gab. Cold and Light doesn´t had this gab tbh :man_shrugging: And I´m not sure if we didn´t placed other items to help non sorc chars with that. We should go through current proposal!

On top, I don´t see, that we need to have three same same helmets for each element. So we might give it a little twist with adding +3 to Thunder Storm as o-skill? I assume/hope here, that TS will get buffed a bit in the future. Would be an interesting twist and not crazy strong by any means? But first, do we need that really and does it add something new to the game or is it just easier to obtain and leaves some uniques less relevant again?

I see where youre going. But I guess that is just adding more of almost the same. Your´r right with prayer aura, but that would not be limited to Act 3 mercs. Your Act 5 merc would also like that, especially with the high FHR and DR. On the other hand the pricing with Jah + Ber would be appropriate (not to create a second OP low-cost Spirit brother and only available in lvl 65 upwards). Actually spirit should cost those HR imho :slight_smile: The - 15 req would help to reach that point. But we already added 2 more 4 OS (less strength) options to the OP. And since you would probably use eth ones, that would be even 10 points lower. So we would have this problem anymore.

And if not, they should rather add enough +strengt points to the starting point of all ACT 3 mercs instead (along with dmg buffing those dudes).

Generally I think we have already enough good caster shield options (all viable for A3 as well).

New 2 OS Splendor at lvl 37
New Lidless (eth or not) at lvl 41
and eth Spirit in the new bases (Hyperion at levl 48 or Pavis at early lvl 25)

New Visceratuant at lvl 28 for the light merc to some lesser extend as well.

As much as I like this proposal for beeing well balanced on a price-performance point of view (Krassus explored prayer precisely, but I wouldn´t mind not beeing as good as on an Act 2 prayer merc tbh). Bottom line it would not be needed for Act 3 really and all others would go Spirit like today? :man_shrugging:

Would rather focus on the other unique shiels tbh!

I would like to discuss this one again a little bit. I jus watch a YT vid from “michael bustamante” (credits to him here).

We discussed the above proposal for the sake of improving the them of “hail”. Michael came up with the same direction (what else) but would put 10-12% CtC lvl 16 Blizzard on striking AND make Strafe an O-Skill.

Looking again on this lvl 36 bow I would really support this. I have no idea what would make this bow end game viable (I guess there is none), so we would not cause any problems at all. It just would be a fun mid game bow to mess around a little bit. Zon would only use it for some time. Cold chars would not be OP by any means due to the lack of synergies. Even with Nightwings, an Cold Ormus or DarkHelmets proposal for a cold helmet RW that wouldn´t be really stong (you might finish the game with it, but not more).

What do you think about that?

1 Like
1416

I was thinking we could put a fun spin on Gravepalm, redesigning it around “chill to the grave theme” as a melee/caster hybrid glove that gives bonus to cold damage, cold skill damage, with a reanimate effect…

Gravepalm
Sharkskin Gloves
Defense: 96-112
Req Level: 32
Req Strength: 20
+140-180% Enhanced Defense
+100-200% Damage To Undead
+100-200 To Attack Rating Against Undead
+10 To Energy
+10 To Strength

  • Buffs:
    • Adds 6-36 Cold Damage
    • Add +3-5% To Cold Skill Damage
    • Add 5% Reanimate As: Returned

I really like that idea, here you go…

Endlesshail
Double Bow
2H Damage: (30-35) to (72-83)
Req Level: 36
Req Strength: 58
Req Dexterity: 73
+180-220% Enhanced Damage
Adds 15-30 Cold Damage
Cold Resist +35%
+50 Defense vs. Missile
+40 To Mana
+3-5 To Strafe (Amazon Only)

  • Buffs:
    • Add 10% CtC Lvl 10 Blizzard On Striking
    • Remove (Amazon Only) from Strafe

Agreed. How about we add a few open sockets, change skills to a static +2, improve MPK, and lastly add bonus to valkyrie to fit namesake?..

Valkyrie Wing
Winged Helm
Defense: 247-297
Req Level: 44
Req Strength: 115
+150-200% Defense
+1-2 To Amazon Skills
20% Faster Run/Walk
20% Faster Hit Recovery
+2-4 To Mana After Each Kill

  • Buffs:
    • Add 1-2 Open Sockets
    • Add +3 To Valkyrie (Amazon Only)
    • Change Mana After Each Kill to +5
    • Change Amazon Skills to +2

In another thread, Krassus had good idea to put increasing max ravens on Ravenlore and then I was thinking we could change raven charges on Cranebeak to o-skill so all classes could use. Also think Ravenlore could use a buff to MF…

Ravenlore
Sky Spirit
Defense: 343-390
Req Level: 74
Req Strength: 113
+120-150% Enhanced Defense
+7 To Raven (Druid Only)
+3 To Elemental Skills (Druid Only)
+20-30 To Energy
-10-20% To Enemy Fire Resistance
All Resistances +15-25

  • Buffs:
    • Maximum Number of Ravens Increased By 3

Cranebeak
War Spike
1H Damage: (102-120) To (163-192)
Req Level: 63
Req Strength: 133
Req Dexterity: 54
+240-300% Enhanced Damage
+40% Increased Attack Speed
-25% Target Defense
Adds 1-305 Lightning Damage
20-50% Better Chance of Getting Magic Items
Level 8 Raven (15 charges)

  • Buffs:
    • Add +3-6 To Raven
    • Remove Lvl 8 Raven (15 charges)
1417

Another item where I would like to talk about possible “adjustments” to our current proposal.

I´m currently playing a WW-Barb and try do use a lot of my “stashed” items to get a better feeling for those and just having a new build. Now in early hell with lvl 65 I wanted to changes the helm for my merc and straight grab an Arreats on my mule but remembered that I also have a 2/3/3 Demonhorns Edge waiting (383 Def, so a middle roll).

And even with our changes, I don´t see this helm beeing used over an Arreats?

Ok, its the elite version so no upping. But has not really more defense than your usual AF. It has a lot of rolls (even when leaving ED aside). An Arreats of any kind is allways usable imho.
The lvl req is almost 20 lvl above AF and you need a bit less strength (but that should not be a problem on a barb). Rarety should be around the same (although I´ve found +5 AF but only one DH so far).

Even with slightly higher IAS of +15% and the good 30% OW on top of (best case) +3 Barb skills, I don´t think of a lot use-cases I would choose this over the massiv boost for strength/dex and all res of AF on top of one more combat skill point?

Arreat’s Face
Unique Slayer Guard

Defense: 302-363
Required Level: 42
Required Strength: 118
Durability: 54 +150-200% Enhanced Defense
30% Faster Hit Recovery
+20% Bonus to Attack Rating
+2 To Barbarian Skill Levels
3-6% Life Stolen per Hit
All Resistances +30
+20 To Strength
+20 To Dexterity
+2 To Combat Skills (Barbarian only)

I think two possible options. And on top we could limit the rolls of the skills from 1-3 to 2-3 and increase ED to the same lvl as AF (120-160% > 150-200%).

A) Simply add 2 OS. (so you could add another 15% IAS jewel more than AF will get or compensate some resist along with more str/dex or mana after kill etc.). I´m still not sure if that one OS more would make it viable agains AF.

B) We could increase LL a lot to make it a better merc helmet. From 3-6% (like AF too) to something like 8-12%? And I guess we could also add some DR still without surpassing AF :man_shrugging:

AF is just too good for a mid-lvl item… would be great even without the dex/strength.

What´s you opinion about this?

1 Like
1418

no longer competes with griffons.
at +2 skills and 2 sockets it would never see use. It essentially becomes a badly rolled rare circlet, I wouldn’t put facets in that
even at +3, +15% light damage, -15% enemy light resistance, it may still not be as good as a well rolled gryffon.

valkyrie is great i guess for leveling or HC, but most of the times it just gets in the way of herding. then again so does the merc, and we usually fix this with teleport.

1 Like
1419

Well, I guess we could change Valkyrie Wing to roll +2-3 for both +skills and OS. Makes finding a +3 skills/3 OS an exciting find…

Valkyrie Wing
Winged Helm
Defense: 247-297
Req Level: 44
Req Strength: 115
+150-200% Defense
+1-2 To Amazon Skills
20% Faster Run/Walk
20% Faster Hit Recovery
+2-4 To Mana After Each Kill

  • Buffs:
    • Add 2-3 Open Sockets
    • Add +3 To Valkyrie (Amazon Only)
    • Change Mana After Each Kill to +5
    • Change Amazon Skills to +2-3
2 Likes
1420

Griffons has 25 FCR, something that Lightning Sorceress’ covet more than anything if they hope to achieve 200 FCR breakpoint. Whether or not the Lightning Damage on Griffons is enough to offset the extra points to Lightning Skills on Capricious is something I haven’t delved into but it basically boils down to Offense on Griffons(higher FCR and -Resistance with 5/5 Facet) vs. Defense on Capricious(Resist Lightning Aura + higher Lightning Resist Cap). Yeah Capricious is easier to get but I did this with Act 3 Mercenaries in mind more so than the Sorceress itself and that’s the same viewpoint I have with Permafrost and Cold A3 Mercenaries. Nightwing is still the dominant Cold Sorc Helm because Cold Sorc’s covet %Cold Damage, which Permafrost does not have. Frostmaidens will have a difficult choice but that’s their dilemma as I see it. It also doesn’t seem right that Flickering Flame(Resist Fire) exists but nothing for Resist Cold and Resist Lightning, hence the submissions.

As for Devotion, no Merc besides A3 can use Shields, hence it’s explicitly for them and main class characters that opt to use Shields. However, since Prayer has a constant Mana cost, only Paladins(running Meditation) or someone with an Insight Merc will opt to use it on a main-line character. Otherwise, it’s Act 3 and only A3 that will use it.

1 Like
1421

Well it´s an lvl 44 exceptional item why the heck does it needs to compete with a 12x more rare end game BIS item? It should be a solid helmet you could beat the game with and maybe leave it until you find the next upgrade? :man_shrugging:

We removed it after long discussions from the OP after several members stated, that it doesn´t needed any rework. I personally liked the first approach we took with +20% IAS a lot. I really like your previous proposal with 1-2 OS, MAEK to 5 and fixed +2 skills as well (leaves a chance that you find not good enough one).

This version with 3 skills and 3 OS with 40/15 in it will be the new pvp meta helmet for every zon and straight godly. So a no for me tbh.

With the current version you can easily play till late hell without any problems. More mana and fixes 2 skill woulb be barely enough to shine. 2 OS will do for sure. Imagine what even mediocre rare jewels would ad to this!

Ok, youre right! Can see all you´ve said. Still not sure if we need the shield. Whats your oppionion about the mentioned shield upgrades so far to put that in perspective?

1422

by itself, it does not.

yes, but the 40/15s are a separate investment. 3 of these are far harder to get than any helmet

and are you sure a 3 socket COA will not have the same issue? If this one would be godly, what about COA with the 15% DR, resists, and more FHR?

Consider that items can follow an extended path than “item 1 is great until I get item 2”.
You can add to that with “item 2 is great until I can invest super rare gems/runs in Item 1”

1423

Thats why I would not like to see that as well, even on a lvl 82 end game item (as for now). As said serveral times.

My goal is to make now not used items viable. Not BIS, but viable. If I ask myself if I would use that SSF and the answer is yes. Then the jobs done for me. Except 4-5 items like “The Grandfather”, Templars, Carnium Basher etc. Here I want to see a real competitor.

But so, the the game is already easy (I don´t want a D3 like game). I really don´t need a Tyraels with 4 OS, COA with 3 OS and so on…

But thats just maybe me. If I want a real power creep I´d turn on hero editor. :man_shrugging:

1424

To fit theme of Demonhorn “Edge” and to make this helm more viable for combat, we could add 25-35 flat damage along w/ OW…

Demonhorn’s Edge
Destroyer Helm
Defense: 345-408
Req Level: 61
Req Strength: 151
+120-160% Enhanced Defense
10% Increased Attack Speed
3-6% Life Stolen Per Hit
Attacker Takes Damage of 55-77
+1-3 To Warcries (Barbarian Only)
+1-3 To Masteries (Barbarian Only)
+1-3 To Combat Skills (Barbarian Only)

  • Buffs:
    • Adds 25-35 Damage
    • Add +30% Chance of Open Wounds
    • Change IAS to +15%

Curious on your thoughts, but think Ravenlore could use a small bonus to MF in addition to increasing max ravens as follows…

Ravenlore
Sky Spirit
Defense: 343-390
Req Level: 74
Req Strength: 113
+120-150% Enhanced Defense
+7 To Raven (Druid Only)
+3 To Elemental Skills (Druid Only)
+20-30 To Energy
-10-20% To Enemy Fire Resistance
All Resistances +15-25

  • Buffs:
    • Add +15-25% Magic Find
    • Maximum Number of Ravens Increased By 3

Lastly, what do you think of this?

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1425

Thematic yes for sure, but on what build would rather choose DH over AF (own char or merc)? Especially if you consider the higher req. In my feelings there is something missing for an item with a lot of rolls? I can not see that really. Is the 30 flat dmg offsetting the 20 strength on AF (leaving dex aside)?

Would help. The max number of ravens make it beeing used. MF is a little cherry on top.

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1426

True. As Laying of Hands is one of the best choices for PvM physical characters, I think we could do the same and add a healthy amount of Damage to Demons to Demonhorn Edge and feels thematic (and would make this the only unique helm with DtD)…

Demonhorn’s Edge
Destroyer Helm
Defense: 345-408
Req Level: 61
Req Strength: 151
+120-160% Enhanced Defense
10% Increased Attack Speed
3-6% Life Stolen Per Hit
Attacker Takes Damage of 55-77
+1-3 To Warcries (Barbarian Only)
+1-3 To Masteries (Barbarian Only)
+1-3 To Combat Skills (Barbarian Only)

  • Buffs:
    • Add +150% Damage To Demons
    • Add +30% Chance of Open Wounds
    • Change IAS to +15%
1 Like
1427

I’ve always been in favor of adding sockets to Normal/Exceptional tier Shields. It’s not right that every other class that isn’t a Paladin has to grind for Monarchs that take 156 Strength while Paladins can use a lowly Targe and achieve the same 4 Socket result for a Spirit. I mean Defense is way higher on a Monarch or Elite Shields compared to a Normal tier Targe but if you’re simply looking to get +2 Skills, FCR and w/e else Spirit provides, base Defense on the Shield is kind of irrelevant in that regard. I’d also look into perhaps reducing the Strength requirement on some Shields(particularly Elite ones… 219 on Aegis is insane when the heaviest a Paladin has to endure is Vortex’s 148 Strength requirement).

As for unique Shield suggestions, Medusa Gaze and Spirit Ward getting -30% and -20% Requirements respectively only reinforces my point on Normal Shields needing their Strength requirements adjusted lower. How much and which ones need it I’m not entirely sure but most builds generally don’t go above a Monarch or 156 Strength, hence I’d say the ceiling should be roughly 190 or ~10% less than what they are now. Also when adding Sockets(like to Tiamat’s Rebuke), I’d like to see 2-3 Sockets(at most 4) as opposed to just 1 since anyone can get that via Larzuk right now if they chose to do so.

Oh and one more thing. @Charles: For Medium and Heavy Armor, it’s been proposed to have an innate Physical Resistance(and decreased Defense penalty when running) built into it to encourage users to use them over Light Armor. Are we extending that to Shields too or will Shields be different in some capacity?

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