As someone who promotes very little change to this well beloved game, I realized almost every single build that requires a shield, uses a spirit monarch. I think what makes diablo 2 fun is the diversity and ability to have unique characters, builds, and gear. So I’m disappointed at the lack of other shield options (unless you’re a paladin).
I think allowing 1 or 2 other shield to have 4 sockets would be a great improvement, and also adding 1 or 2 decent shield runewords to support certain builds. Anything we can do to allow greater diversity without seeking out the same overused item would be great. I dont hate this setup. I just don’t like how unoriginal it is.
Every other item or gear that is commonly used has other options. (Raven frost rings for CBF, and choosing to add a cham rune or switch to a trang belt).
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Once again, I’m not advocating that paladin shields be nerfed or that we make changes to the spirit runeword. And I am definitely not advocating to make the sorceress more overpowered (though adding 10 fcr to leaf would be cool). I literally just hate how the monarch shield looks, and I think we should be able to have more 4 socket shield options with like for instance, a trolls nest or blade barrier but with a 167 str requirement. Especially for the necromancer. The necro should at least have 1 elite base with 4 sockets.
I think its kinda a game flaw. Can you imagine if every single necro, sorc, druid and pally all wore the same head gear? Can you imagine if it was the BiS item for over 7 different builds, and nothing else came close (even with a different runeword).
Phoenix = Monarch
Spirit = Monarch
Exile = Monarch (unless your a pally of course)
I think one exceptional shield should have 4 sockets, the Dragon Shield for example (91 str). And at least all of the normal pally shields should be nerfed to a max of 3 sockets.
Well pallys may seem to have more variety but in general only a couple bases are sought after like high end pally spirits are nearly all STs due to best blocking %.
I’ve made spirits out of wards before especially on chars using coa since strength req needed is pretty neglible at that point
The problem as many many folks have desperately tried to change or remove is spirit. Personally I like spirit but if there was a 3 socket runeword that directly competed with it, maybe something a bit weaker but where very low strength casters could still wield without enigma think would instantly bring variety…but good luck finding right balance with this 3 socket runeword without becoming either bis and replacing spirit or straight up not worth making over spirit…
Paladin shields are one of the few class specific items done correctly. They have a lot of power and options early, most of them defensively. Sorc orbs should be allowed to make Leaf and Crescent Moon, and come with a random FCR roll between 10-25%. Necro heads should be allowed to have up to 4 sockets.
Monarch is one of the only things keeping Spirit balanced. The real problem is a lack of caster shield options that come anywhere close to using Spirit, and that’s with the 156 str req to use it. More than anything, that value is in the 35% FCR. FCR breakpoints are extremely important to any caster, and finding FCR gear is extremely limited. A circlet or amulet with any significant amount of FCR combined with the correct +skills, not to even mention other useful stats, are among the rarest items in the game. Half the reason that lit sorc is so strong is the existence of Griffon’s Eye, a combination of +skills, 25% FCR, and amp+pierce. No other element has that kind of support from a head slot item, or any slot really.
If another item or shield RW could be updated with 20-30% FCR, then opening Spirit to earlier levels for other classes could be justified.
I agree with part of this, that we become a bit locked in place with some builds requiring the FCR from Spirit leaving really not much of any other option. However, I don’t agree that we have a lack of shield options across all classes. For example, my Barbarian uses Rhyme, I can make use of Necro heads pretty well, and sometimes they are better, paladin shields obviously, and we have phoenix for fire builds and JMOD/4 socket facet shields for javazons and such. I feel like the issue with Spirit is more directly impacting the Sorceress followed by the Druid. This is my .02.
Also:
This. Can you imagine being able to hunt for an epic orb base to make your leaf or crescent moon and then being able to free up your shield for something defensive or purely MF!? That would be very nice.
Yeah, the lack of 4 Socket Shield options is one thing that always bothered me. Paladins have it easy with their class-specific Shields on which they choose Sacred Targes for the 30% Base Block(60% with Paladin Class bonus). The highest Strength requirement for a Paladin Shield is 149 for Vortex while Sacred Targe’s need just 86. Their Smite damage is rather consistent at an average of 46 too, which is way above anything a normal Shield can do. To make things even more enviable in the Paladin’s favor: They roll with up to 45 All Resistance.
For everyone else, it’s basically Monarch(22% Base Block) at 156 Strength, Aegis(24% Base Block) at 219 Strength or Ward(24% Base Block) at 185 Strength. The thing going for Monarch is that it’s a Light Shield, hence no movement penalties that Aegis and Ward would apply being Heavy and Medium Shields respectively. What’s more, Monarch’s 156 Strength requirement is typically the highest requirement for most builds. That means anything beyond a Monarch is pumping stat points into a stat that you likely won’t benefit from whatsoever.
@iGanc: Barb’s cannot use Necro Shrunken Heads… they’re class specific. Don’t know where you got that idea unless you’re just illustrating potential non-Monarch uses?
I just checked the 4 maxroll necro guides. Guess the offhand!
Spirit
Spirit
Spirit
4 IST in a monarch
So BiS for necro often is Spirit, always is a monarch, never is a head according to maxroll. Everyone grab a pinch of salt.
You can use Lidless on a Sorc pretty well as well.
But here it’s about BiS.
also needs 4os → Monarch says hello. (What the OP is about)
I think allowing 1 or 2 other shield to have 4 sockets would be a great improvement
there are already ward and aegis.
If you want lighter shields to have 4s, you’re just asking for a buff to all casters. If you let troll nest to have 4s, then everyone will use troll nests.
and also adding 1 or 2 decent shield runewords to support certain builds.
There are other shields worth using. Phoenix and Dream for example. Also there’s the stormshield… if you don’t feel like using stormshield, play some HC.
On pal you have HoZ, on necro you’ve got Homunculus; on necro swap i use +3 summon darkforce to have stronger skeletons (still looking for +3 raise while shield to make a splendor in it!). And on the new meta char infinity nova sorc you use a lighter shield on swap (splendor or lidless)
Keyword is “often”. I mean, Maxroll isn’t the end all be all… pretty sure they don’t even have guides regarding PvP. You know, you can also try to find ways to make a different shield work as the BIS besides Spirit. It’s fun!
You can’t LLD with spirit, so a nec head is better. Poison necros arguably rather use trang shield. Phoenix for fire druids (yes I know Monarch, but it’s a different item).
The OP made two points, one being the runeword “spirit” is always used. I gave examples how that runeword doesn’t have to be the BIS item. The other point was being more shields should have 4 sockets. They aren’t all monarchs, but I agree. We should have more 4 socket variety, and maybe 1 exceptional shield receiving 4 sockets. I totally agree on that.
There are just 3 non pally shields that can have 4 sockets.
All pally shields can have 4 sockets.
I would like to see the 3 exceptional and 3 normal versions of the 3 elite ones that can have 4 sockets, also be able to get 4 sockets depending on their item level.
So…
Elite Exceptional normal
Monarch (156str) Dragon (91str) Kite (47str)
Aegis (219str) Pavise (133str) Tower (75str)
Ward (185str) Ancient Shield (110str) Gothic Shield (60str)
The reason there is only 3 shields is because the items were made and number of sockets set before the runewords were availble is what i think.
They just simple over looked that there was so few 4 socket non pally shields.
Also this would be very simple fix.
The alternatives are the unique elite heads provided that you have a 20 FCR helm/amulet, or some combination to make up for the lack of FCR for not using spirit+hoto, depending on the necro build. For any bonemancer using white, and I’m sure that a +8 bone spear white wand is still bis, they’re tacking on a Spirit if they haven’t gambled or crafted FCR gear.
This is just terrible foresight. High Str req shields, especially heavy shields, should have high block. They’re already demanding a large Str investment to equip, making them have worse block than light shields is actually braindead given that blocking is as good or better than more defense.
The point of class specific gear is that it exclusively buffs that class. Paladins having their special shields is perfectly fine. The only decent idea you stumbled upon was having the larger heavy shields roll up to 6 sockets provided that some 5 and 6 os RWs get shield versions. 8 sockets isn’t a thing that the game does, and you won’t find anything to do with them other than a bunch of jewels or HRs, which could be good but isn’t likely to be better than investing that into a strong shield RW.
You missed the bone shields. The game has struck a good balance with Spirit and Monarchs. Sorcs and Druids are hard stuck with a high str investment, but Spirit is also very cheap to make and reroll and the best caster shield in the game is most cases. Necros have their unique shrunken heads that are good items for their casting builds. Paladins get their special shields that offer better versions of all Monarch RWs, which is kind of the point of those items existing.
Rather than make 3os shields able to roll 4os, it’d be better to make a 3os shield RW for casters that competes with Spirit Monarch or just bridges the gap while leveling. On top of that, get rid of the run/walk/stam penalty for the heavy shields. Their str requirement is enough reason to not use them, and those extra movement penalties guarantee that nobody ever considers them.
Didnt miss the bone shields.
You miss read what i said.
There are just 3 non paladin shields that can have 4 sockets and they are all elite shields.
What i said was make the exception and normal versions of those shields able to have 4 sockets also.
If you upgrade a kite shield it becomes a dragon shield and up grade a dragon shield and it becomes a monarch shield
If you upgrade a tower shield it becomes a pavise shield and if you upgrade a pavise shield it becomes a aegis shield.
If you upgrade a gothic shield it becomes a ancient shield and upgrade a ancient shield it becomes a ward shield.
Paladins have 15 shields total and all of them can have 4 sockets.
If they would make the exceptional and normal versions of the elite non paladin shield be capable of 4 sockets that would be just 9 shields total.
Also since they have terror zones now they need to show item levels on items so we can tell if they came from tz or regular area for socketing purposes.
They already keep track of item levels anyways so the game knows how many sockets to put on a item and it would be nice if we knew the item level also so we dont waste a socket quest.
The issue is, the reason why this specific shield is used is because it requires the least strength among the 3 types of non-paladin shields that can have 4 slots. Making more shields have 4 slots won’t solve the issue, it will simply move the overused shield type to another one requiring less strength instead.
I’d say I’d rather they worked on uniques that serve as alternatives to that shield than yet other OP runewords. Spirit Monarch would then be the “easy” item to get, and harder to get uniques can then replace it for certain builds when they manage to put their hands on them.
They do need to add ilvl to items. To the point about the normal and exceptional shields, it would unbalance using Spirit. They can make new caster RW for 3os shields to compete with it, but adding 5 more, lower str req Spirit options isn’t a good idea. They also need to buff the heavy shields, because right now they’re never used.
I read exactly what you wrote. You’re understanding of how defense and block works is horrendous. Giving low str shields high block just cements their use. Do you know what block does in this game?
