Buy making making the min/maxing give slightly less then it does now. As for how, that not my pay grade, sadly on this I can only point to the generalized solution and leave how for the Blizzard team.
If I where to guess, make the fights more dynamic allowing each type of player to shine in the fight rather then just the one in the “perfect spec”.
Then howabout a loyalty program. Let freelancers freelance, swap between covenants to their hearts content. Or you can remain a loyalist, and gain bonuses for sticking it out with 1 covenant.
Didn’t play legion when it was current, but no, I wouldn’t have since I only have two characters. I may only not have an issue with missing so much because I wasn’t stuck in downtime when that was relevant.
No horde toons, so I couldn’t. But it’s another design issue I don’t like. I’m peeved that I can’t even unlock Zandalari, the only horde I’d be interested in playing.
That seems nice. However I was not talking with covenants in mind when I spoke. For me personally pairing the wants of design with the needs of player power is never going to be a good thing.
I think we should be able to steal covenant abilities from other covenants thru high level content. This way a wrong choice only slows you down and does not force a re-start.
Min-maxing people want to remove all systems to a flat and souless RPG. No inmersion and only cosmetic diferences between choices.
Thats why bfa was soo bad, no class fantasy because its bad for e-sports, bad for min-maxing. Preach crying because he cannot have “his fun”, so please Blizz remove all important choices, all flexible, all meaningless because the big boys NEEED ti have that sweet little 0,9% dps. Wow LoL
This seems like a really weird observation to me and doesnt fit with what i see in raids. In the vast, vast majority of cases good players do more dps AND survive more than bad players.
But aside from that, we arent really talking about mechanically good or bad players, but about min-maxing. And this is something that happens before the fight. You find out whats best for your character and you prepare your character to be as good as possible. Only after that has happened, the fight begins and you can show your skill. You could still “focus on survival” and do more damage if you put in some effort before the fight. If you choose not to do so, fine. But you cant act like all people who prepare are for some magical reason bad players in the fight, thats just too weird.
No, you wont. If there is a way of playing that gives a better result, you will pretty much always be better off with this playstyle. And you again pretend that theres a massive imbalance in peoples ability to play. Why is it that people in your view are such great players in their “wrong” playstyles, but fail when they should try the meta-spec? Its not like all good talents are actives and hard to use. Hell, Vision of Perfection is the best essence for many classes and you dont even worry about it.
Maybe, if you get someone to play the meta-playstyle he will be magically much better at this playstyle, why dont you think about it this way? Why only the other way around?
And ofc, i dont want to force anyone to do anything. If people are happy with their “wrong” setup, more power to them. But they can get a lot better results if they tried the better setups and put some effort in.
Hmm I think I’m going to back away from you. I don’t have endless amounts of time to respond since I’m doing office work at the same time.
You seem like the type to glaze past key points and plug in your own imagined intent to my words. When dealing with that poster style it’s best to walk away. Because I can not reason with someone who does those things. It becomes a circular conversation in which I have to re-type my key points over and over to someone who glazes past them as if I never typed anything to begin with.
I’m saving my fingers!
BTW: NO…none of what you think I think is actually what I am thinking. Also this is a fun video for all that swear by statistics.
There’s a reason they have specific servers for RP.
This made me think of one of those punch cards. Do 10 kryian dailies, get the reward from the 11th for free.
Maybe you need to try to make a more reasonable point then. Having no further arguments, but still acting like from a high horse is a pretty bad look.
If you think this is even remotely related, you really dont know what youre talking about and it probably is better if you stay out of such discussions.
Maybe they want to play a certain way and are putting quite a bit of effort in trying to get that way to work? I give more props to someone that’s trying to get alternative ways to play to work out than just blindly following the meta. However, they do need to have to have the wisdom to call it quits if it doesn’t perform as well as they need it to for the content. You have some good points, but this line is garbage.
You misunderstood this part or i didnt word it properly. The “put effort in” wasnt meant to say people who play some alternative build are lazy. Its great if people do that and have fun with it. Heck, without trying new stuff, we wouldnt have the glimmer-build for HPalas. Among these people are probably people who put a lot of effort in and some who do less and thats fine.
In this line i was reffering to people who would be encouraged to try the meta-build. If they would just change their talents, azerite and whatever and ran straight into the dungeon/raid, they would probably still get bad results, cause theyre not used to it. They might then give up and forever believe that this “meta-setup” is wrong and bad. Now, if they were to “put the effort in” (that what i wanted to get at) to learn to use this setup better, they would very very likely also see an improvement in their results. If you want to learn something new, you need to put in some effort, no matter if you want to play slow or min-max. Thats what i intended to say.
People who can’t perform effectively while living through the encounter aren’t min-maxing anything. That’s what we call a selfish jerk.
And at the end of the day, the better player will simply do better, period. Making sure you’re easy to heal is incredibly vague. I can stand in the back of the room doing no DPS and be easy to heal on Mythic Nzoth, but that doesn’t make me valuable. Everything is not absolute; some people are good enough to pull exceptional numbers AND be incredibly survivable.
And nobody cares if you run suboptimal talents or gear for Heroic raids, or +10-15, as long as you perform sufficiently. It’s not always blindly following the meta to do something that works, and it’s not always “finding your own way” by being suboptimal. Not my place to tell someone who wants to actively choose weaker things not to, but it’s not their place to tell me I’m doing something wrong by playing how I enioy playing either.
We call them unicorns. They are beautiful and rare and should in no way be expected to be the norm.
The truth is to down a mythic boss you need to put 50% of your attention into your rotation and the other 50% into paying attention. But since you can only give 100% you can never focus 100% on both things.
But sadly when I hear people lecturing, 100% on both things is exactly what they want. They seem to live in executive boss time, where 5 hour jobs can be done in 20 minutes and 1 man can do a 10 man job if you only wish hard enough.
Spoiler alert: nobody is suffering as a result of this system. Firstly because it isn’t in the game yet, and secondly because being the “wrong” covenant isn’t actually going to block you out of content like showing up to N’zoth with the wrong cloak.
IF there is any spec/covenant combo that can’t get CE Denathrius, then Blizzard should take a good long look into why. But there’s 0 reason to believe that will happen, at worst, some will be more common than others, which happens every tier with specs by themselves.
We call them people who have put in time and effort.
If rotations are hard for you to operate by muscle memory, maybe you should consider why that is. Perhaps build your muscle memory outside of raids? Works wonders.
Learning bosses is no different. Once the muscle memory and knowledge is there, fights should be something you can execute with ease.
Being able to execute your rotation while doing boss mechanics isn’t something intensely difficult. It’s usually either effort people don’t want to put in, or it’s people who simply can’t. And that’s okay; every piece of content is not intended for the entirety of the playerbase.
You would think. But I still manage to do good damage and live while I watch those who would lecture me die over and over to the same dumb stuff. And honestly I don’t leave cause it’s almost standard across all guilds.
To focus back to my original point is:
I do not like people who take min/maxing too far and push it on others. Especially when they are not statistically accounting for all the factors in their calculations. We have alot of self taught spreedsheet interpreters out there, that don’t read things right and they do alot more harm then good.
I feel there is a misconception here.
Mythics raiders aren’t some rare breed of super humans
A lot of rotation execution is muscle memory with some assistance by addons. If you are struggling to follow a rotation while doing mechanics I do suggest practicing with target dummies. Get a feel for the class. My eyes aren’t looking at the action bars and the boss at the same time. I’ve just been with my class enough to know what should be going on.
If you’re the kind of person that has to look down on their keyboard while typing. I suggest not next time and what goes on. Overtime it may see like your fingers instinctively know where to go.
If you need further assistance to know when CDs or buffs go off I suggest weak auras. There are libraries of pre-made you can import.
In regards to mechanics. It’s just a matter of good teamwork. We have addons to scream at us when something bad is about to happen. Often times someone in the raid is designated to scream at us as well. Whaveter you do just remember you can’t parse dead. If that awesome proc happened and you want to finish a rotation for made dps… just don’t move away with the group and live to see the proc again.This is honestly one of the biggest fails in groups. That one player who just needs to get that bid d* dps in. But in reality all they do is parse grey because they can’t stay alive.
No good raid lead should expect you to be perfect on the first couple pulls. Execution aren’t always perfect even if the boss is on “farm”. People are always learning
I agree, You responded to a single quote alone. You made some large leaps as to what my skill base is. However I think you where generalizing using me as the focus on how you feel about lesser skilled players.
I do think there are alot of players who can do it all, they usually feel no need to boast to anyone. However I do see alot more who just THINK like they can do it all. And that would be fine, but they seem to always have to tell others what to do.
Great players - don’t need to point it out on a spreedsheet.
I mean, those arent min-maxers, theyre just even worse players…
If you wanna talk about bad players berating others, sure that happens and its quite annoying. But to me, this isnt a question of wether min-maxing in itself is good. If this what the thread is about to you, i interpret it differently.
I dont exactly know where people are pushing it on others. They cant force you to do anything. If its in your dungeons group, leave. If its in your guild and its annoying enough, leave them. Otherwise, tough cookies, you gotta deal with your friends. Maybe talk to them?
The rest of this just really sounds like excuses of a bad player, im sorry…