Wait, what?
Can you provide an example that’s not the orcs and draenei?
I have no idea why they would think this?
Its absolutely moronic that they could have ever believed that KJ would have just let them disappear with just how much of a personal grudge he seemed to have against Velen. You get stuck on a planet without your patented means of escape available (due to the Genedar being kaput), and you don’t plan for what you should expect to be the inevitable by this point?
Apparently the Prophet Velen was ONLY of value when he had prophetic powers? So much so he failed to cultivate actual wisdom and common sense?
7 Likes
Because Blizzard sucks at writing. They wanted to strand the Draenei on Draenor so the orcs could work them over, and also needed the Draenei to be ok with being stuck on Draenor. Ergo, they thought they were safe. No, it makes no sense. Yes, it portrays the Draenei as being very dumb. Welcome to Warcraft writing, where there is no characterization, and every gets made into idiots to advance the plot.
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Then if we’re looking at it through this lens, then shouldn’t the Draenei and the Orcs BOTH be condemned and absolved for the sad (very stupid) chain of events that took place on that world? Which truly is again the crux of my argument. It can’t be both ways, you can’t just handwave away and absolve the Draenei and perpetually condemn the Orcs. Either condemn them both as idiots that led to the other’s destruction, or absolve them both as victims … caught in the schemes of some great Cosmological Force that was way outside their weightclass.
That’s all I really wanted from this stupid debate. A little even handedness. Not this starting with the conclusion that the Draenei = Good, and Orc = Evil, and then constantly working backwards to fill in the blanks to justify a conclusion that can’t be wrong. Just the arguments supporting it can.
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The Draenei didn’t choose to have the Legion chase them, and they didn’t choose to be on Draenor, to boot. The Orcs didn’t choose to be on the planet with the Draenei, but they did choose to murder them.
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The orcs had their culture, faith, and health used against them by KJ and his puppet Gul Dan to convince them that the Draenei were behind the Blood Plague that was absolutely ravishing their peoples. And they were promised that the Fel Blood would make them immune, which actually it did give them the constitution to shake off that deadly magic virus. It just also enslaved them.
But … I guess none of that matters. None, the stupid evil savage primitives should have known about a threat they were kept deliberately blind to; and had the strength to resist the very same forces that the majority of the Eredar species bowed before. Orc = Bad; Draenei = Good.
9 Likes
A child who defends his country, which is at war, and dies in the process.
From the point of view of the parents here: Is it fair, is it fair that it acts morally right, but has to die much too soon?
it is indeed not dump, its exist even in a morality desicion the Point of…"How much I can burden someone depends on many factors, including development.
The child getting killed isn’t morality at work, though. It will happen whether the child was good or bad.
If I told you your neighbour was plotting to murder you, and you went out and murdered them, I would bear blame for the act of murder that had taken place.
But so would you.
Told you your “neighbor” was ACTUALLY murdering you’re family, and you went out and murdered them. By convincingly taking on the persona of your dead relatives, who have always led you true before. Also, that neighbor had condemned your entire family already anyway, so there was no way out no matter what. Whether you realized that at the time or not.
Truly, the only way the Orcs in that situation could have came out to prove they are not evil is by being expected to have the strength to do what the Draenei did not. Die with their planet. Condemn their entire race to being merely a statistic in the Eradar’s intergalactic civil war.
4 Likes
Meaningless. At the end of the day the orcs chose to murder the Draenei. That is their sin. The fact that they were mislead lessens their culpability, but it doesn’t remove it. They could have done more to see that the reasons they were given were in fact true, but didn’t.
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How? When the Draenei deliberately kept the path to the truth from them?
The only reason Ner’Zhul even figured out he was tricked was when he realized that Kil Jaedin looked awfully like the Draenei, and KJ revealed he was incapable of hiding his weird fixation on Velen. Like a spurned lover that one was. But by the time he did, it was too late to save anyone other than Durotan and the Frostwolves from imbibing in the Fel.
But, again the Draenei are faultless and flawless. The Orcs of evil and flawed. Shame the Orcs weren’t the trust-fund kids of demigods or realized the wonders of rebranding.
11 Likes
You know how the ancestor’s congregated at Oshu’gun? And that the orcs were told by KJ that they were no longer to go to Oshugun. And then Nerzhul eventually went “Nah, Imma go anyways” and when he did he contacted the real ancestors and found out the truth?
Maybe a few more orcs should have gone ‘wait a minute, why can’t I double check with my ancestors?’
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Because the Orcs have always listened to their Elders? And their Elders said not to go to Oshu’gun, so they didn’t.
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Hmmm.
“I was just following orders.”
1 Like
I mean really. It’s like every priest in in all the human lands starts getting visions that race XXX is planning on trying to destroy them. Even when they question them, the Naru show up and confirm the story.
And every indication is that even Velen sees this point. In War Crimes, when Tyrande is trying to pin this on the Horde, Velen’s response is “Demonic influence is hard to resist”. He understands what the evil they lead to Draenei did.
20 Likes
Seriously. The Draenei deliberately did nothing to prepare the orcs for the inevitable Legion incursion, and were surprised that a demon lord nicknamed “the deciever” was able to trick them.
I weep for the poor Colonialist Draenei who had to suffer instead of using the Orcs as a decoy before jetting off to a new planet.
6 Likes
They didn’t do it for the same reason nobody in the Alliance said “Hey, maybe we should double-check Shaw’s intelligence report before we go to the Broken Shore.”
They believed they knew and could trust who they were talking to.
6 Likes
And they were both wrong.