While a majority of our actions aren’t in the light of Alliance Aggression, because those instances are NEVER allowed to count. Both the Garrosh conflict and the 4th War was proceeded not by Horde aggression, but repeated acts of Alliance aggression. Most notably, from the SW side. However … there is always some cheap justification or some overwhelming handwaving (even from Horde reps) that discounts all those proceeding acts … so the Horde can be the aggressors.
That insulation from our “acts of grey” is not something the Horde faction or playerbase enjoys like the Alliance always does. You are always justified, we aren’t allowed to be. We’re mostly only saved by game mechanics requiring we continue to exist as a playable faction.
Okay, but seriously, I’d like for the Horde to just get taken over by the Alliance or for both factions to just end up joining together. We can still do PvP, since they’re throwing realms in together. Just have the realms act as teams instead of Red vs Blue. We’ve already established different universes and what not.
Hey, if all you want is Legion after Legion expansion I suppose that’s the way to go. Where you could seriously just write the entire Horde faction out of the story and not change a thing; while Alliance players still get mad that Horde players are “stealing” their characters and content … for Blizz not writing an inclusive story for us.
True, but I’m not certain you need to get rid of the Factions to just get rid of the Faction Conflict. And at bare minimum the continued existence of the Horde forces Blizz to at least pretend to consider our Faction’s races in their stories. If we get consumed into the Alliance, its not going to be an “even balance”. Its going to be the Horde and its characters largely watching the Alliance’s stories and victories. And maybe throwing in a few characters to nobly die once in a while.
This isn’t true. Varian organized an assault on Undercity with the intent to conquer it in the name of the Alliance before he sent Jaina to learn why the Horde attacked. When she returned and told him what was happening he decided this would be an ideal time to reclaim Lordaeron anyway.
It wasn’t a joint effort. The Horde and Alliance organized independent assaults on Undercity. The Horde with the goal of putting down a rebellion and the Alliance with the goal of conquering the city.
With Blizzard writers, I don’t doubt you at all. But, my ideal is that it’s mostly separated into continental threats. Kalimdor is largely Horde, so they’d be the primary focus there.
EK is primarily Alliance, so they’d get the focus there. (Again, that’s my ideal.)
But part of my want for this is because I am honestly dog tired of people still using factions as an excuse to demonize, bash, and insult one another. At least we have individual server forums… (That and I want crossfaction RP that I can group into so I can be the weird dwarf or orc in an Alliance or Horde guild event. AT LEAST GIVE ME A TRAITOR MECHANIC.)
To be honest, the alliance as a whole largely gets forgotten. It always comes down to Humans and friends Got to make sure the alliance has that Human Potential front and center at all costs, regardless of the harm it does the other races of the alliance.
I honestly think blizzard doesn’t even realize there are other races in the alliance outside of the humans and Kaldorei. We all know how they treat the gnomes and Worgen and Dwarves. They’re usually thrown into the story for comic relief or suicide missions.
For them to do this they’d actually have to allow the Horde more territory worth defending on that continent. Like, truly consider that the constant famine issue was never really dealt with from the Garrosh area. It was an issue that was considered as Horde justification, but was swept under a rug when they just decided to make Garrosh a huge racist. And that was before the Kalimdor Horde was trying to support FIVE different communities in 5 zones, 3 of which are so destitute even the NEs couldn’t fix them. That should be THE catalyst for Kali conflict.
Honestly, the Horde should get Stonetalon and everything South. There NEs hold nothing but a few small settlements and a single recently built military base south of Ashenvale; and those lands (as brutal as most of them still are) would be a godsend for the Kalimdor Horde. As would Dustwallow, Thousand Needles, Tanaris, and Ungoro. But … we’re never going to get them. As for EK, everything Hinterlands-North should go to them … but thats also never gonna happen.
NOPE NOPE NOPE, Garrosh’s forces used Dalaran portals to steal from Darnassus, they used a NEUTRAL cities resources to steal from their enemies, calling attention to this isn’t betrayal.
Cause he’s a friggen moron. Like what was he thinking?
“Jaina has already been punished for being trusting and has already been backstabbed once by someone from the Sunreaver’s and she’s kept her cool, what’s one more going to do, send her over the edge”
Apparently yes. And even if Jaina wasn’t mad, he still proved that when it came time to pick a side, he chose the Horde over Dalaran WHILE IN DALARAN. Ofcourse he betrayed their neutrality.
Only those who tried to fight back/escape
Well…yeah I guess.
Innocents who tried to escape arrest, sadly this happens IRL. Ofcourse the alternative is that every time someone runs away from a crime the police just have to shrug their shoulders and let them get away.
Ok…Vareesa killing innocent animals was perhaps the only ‘bad’ thing the Alliance side did in the Purge, I would have been ok with knocking them out.
No sorry the bomb was a sneak attack, which is what people blame Garrosh for, not the initial invasion. By that logic, Jaina drowing Orgrimmar wouldn’t have been a ‘sneak attack’ because the Horde would have known they’d suffer retaliation.
So basically even if we pretend that an attack on the Alliance is ok as long as an equal amount of Horde races died, that still equates to an event where 1000 Alliance lives are lost and Varian is not meant to punish the HORDE???
Well I did the Invasion of Undercity Even in Wrath and not only could you see the test subjects but Varian even pointed it out.
The NE’s didn’t starve them, the Horde were basically the mob and said “Hey Night Elves, let us have access to your trees and food and we’ll make sure no accidents happen your way”. The Night Elves aren’t to blame if the Horde is reliant on resources in THEIR lands.
Calia was invited by Anduin as a guest of the Alliance, you’re out of your mind if you think that isn’t an act of agression. So what can the Alliance kill every Ally of the Horde that aren’t technically part of the Horde and the Horde have to sit on their thumbs going, “Gee, I guess since the Alliance isn’t being aggressive towards us we can’t really do anything”.
That’s not why Jaina got mad at him, it’s because he purposefully kept it a secret when he was in a position were doing so is considered treason.
Seriously, I’d like to know how you could possibly NOT consider it a joint attack? Do you honestly believe the Alliance should be ok with Forsaken forces killing thousands of their men and being like, “Well…it’s a Horde city, we really have no right going there ourselves even though countless Alliance soldiers die, we’ll just trust you guys to fully hold them responsible”
So in essence: “The Alliance has Moral Absolutism and I totally love it, but if someone calls us on it … I’ll BS about vague morally ambiguous things. Not because there actually is any Alliance Moral Ambiguity, but the lack of such would be considered a writing flaw; and the Alliance can’t have flaws”.
What are you talking about? I didn’t say the alliance couldn’t hold anyone responsible.
Unless I’m misunderstanding the term, I thought you meant a joint attack as in both sides working cooperatively to clear out Undercity of rebels, and I don’t remember it going that way at all. The two factions remain separate right up until the end, when Varian wants to attack the horde group right in the throne room until Jaina ices everyone and warps the alliance out.
I genuinly don’t understand why you act like this. You’re like a poster boy for everything bad about the forum. You don’t contribute to the discussions, instead you only seek to troll. Shame.
Because he, unlike the people you dislike, posts stuff like that in order to piss off Players he doesn’t like. That, to me, is the kind of thing that deserves a ban. Night elf posters, from what I can tell, are at the very least geniuine when they post stuff. He is not.
