You dont need to worry about Tier gear if you are not doing high end stuffs.
M+15s and KSM can be beaten without a tier gear.
I am just a Casual player progressing slowly thru M+. I will try to get what I can get. To me, M+ is easier to progress. But once I max’d out on it, I would move forward and maybe go raiding and that’s when Tier gear could come to me.
For now, I wont spend with PuG raids who keeps on wiping. I will come to them when they stop wiping… when they progress with their slow learning curve. I would have double legendary and fully decked with ilevel 270 gear by then. I am a fast learner. It’s just I dont have much play time as Casual. Wasting time to slow learning curve of PuG raid people is not on me right now.
I agree with this I have personally 25 tier boss kills and have yet to loot a piece of tier while guildies have 4 piece and have done half the content I have. When you are talking about 15-20% power gain from tier it feels so much worse not looting it. Release the catalyst next week with the final chapter Judgment. So that players can start crafting their tier and actually utilizing it. Remove the RNG aspect from this patch.
yeah, I also extended a lockout on an alt to have tier bosses only groups, I lead I tank. I think I went a solid 20 bosses with not only no tier dropping, but also no loot (only a cape someone traded after putting up for rolls).
I am going to stop doing these. catch up? bad luck protection? pfft yeah right.
Why would someone want to catch up with someone who has done the exact same thing but got luckier rofl.
Yeah they absolutely need to add quicker catch-up at this point. No reason for others to fall behind simply based on bad rng – I know many good players who just want to play the game at the high level they are capable of and are getting highly discouraged. It’s true you’re starting to see people gate M+ key invites based on having tier – because why wouldn’t they want someone who can do 20% more passive damage from two pieces of gear? But feels horrible for those who don’t have it yet.
Here is the problem with this. People have been playing alts for a long time now. The stance you are taking is good at the start of an expansion, not now. Even if tier crafting wasn’t available week one, it should be sooner than April 12. Especially since you can only craft 1 piece a week. That is a long time for people to wait as your buddy next to you has 4 piece and you 2 piece or no piece because they had better luck. Catchup mechanics this far into the expac shouldn’t wait a month and a half out.
Edit: also to me a “catchup systems” is bad if people have to use it to catchup main characters they have been playing since day one of the patch. Which is what is going to for sure happen for the majority of players. Catchup systems should be for alts, new players or returning players that came late into a patch.
Ya this is what feels bad. Person A is better geared than you because they got lucky. Take me for example. My alt rogue has two piece because of better luck. It’s played less, caps less vault slots etc. But here I am, alt Rogue better geared, does more damage etc because of my main based on luck.
This also allows a situation where “the rich get richer” since people that already have 4 piece can use their first few crafts (which are time gated) on optimal 278 pieces they get from M+/pvp activities, and on slots they want to plan legendaries around (Unity on Helm being a popular option). Those without 2 or 4 set will be desperate to hit those power spikes and upgrade anything to get there, even a helm slot, putting them farther behind. Release it next week and with no cap on crafting, there is no reason to time gate this mechanic.
It’s just interesting because in Legion tier sets were only available from the raid. And to top it off you could wear 4p and 2p because tier had 6 slots then.
No chance at getting them from mythic+.
No creation catalyst system at all.
Yet there wasn’t nearly this much crying on the forums about not having their sets 4 weeks into the new raid tier.
I hadn’t considered this. An early mistake I made in anticipation of CC was choosing a 278 helm with a socket from the great vault in like week three or four. It was the only tier slot available to me at the time, and I figured that I needed all the help I could get. I still don’t have tier, and the helm selection will be pretty wasted in the end if I decide to tierize it. Ope.
What’s unique about this system and what makes it feel super oof for affected players are the ways in which, for M+ at least, tuning seems tied to 4p power levels - and that’s not to say that tuning shouldn’t be, because it should. Sure, you can get KSM without tier, but you’re probably soft capped a beyond that. Players without tier are simply gated because they’re unlucky without protections. And the caveats of entering arena without tier at this point are pretty obvious, right? Right.
And so the problem is this: say what you want about wanting to let things feel special because of scarcity, letting loot be loot, observing the CC as an alt catchup - fine - but the bad luck factor is significant enough in the shadow of the tier’s design to cause folks without sets to feel like they’re playing a whole patch in the past in the meantime of the CC showing up. You’re essentially entering an expanded game world with fewer tools to play in it.
This isn’t entirely fair, but I feel like another analog would be having the community achieving flight in ZM at an ~18% success rate. If you’re lucky, you’re flying sooner for no super reason - it’s a luxury, after all, right? Who cares? If you’re unlucky, don’t worry, you can hit the air with alts in two months. Anyway, you can access elevated parts of ZM without it, albeit taking a bit longer, so it’s fine.
Oh, also, anyone mentioning that the design clearly accounts for people having tier on their mains in time for the release of the CC in week 8 aren’t really understanding the gravity of the issue for folks that don’t have tier, but that’s probably obvious.
Yes and No. The creation catalyst is a patch feature. It was presented to us. We want to use it. We want to try it out. We want to play the game with the shiny new thing…
But we have to wait. For arbitrary reasons that were decided based on time-played metrics.
I understand this. I am not taking the stance where I support how the CC is implemented. I am explaining how I most likely think it was decided to time gate it. Purely on a statistic based time-played spread sheet. In order to drive and stretch out player engagement and drive up MAUS.
Don’t like complaining but feel compelled to say… timegating on this particular “borrowed power” (for me specifically 4-piece tier bonus) is really making me feel “left out” at the beginning of this season in a way that I have never felt before in this game. Raiding is fine only because I’m a tank and group with some very lovely folks who don’t mind that my dps is now below the healers with good tier bonuses or double leggo. Dead last on the charts more or less but whatever it’s not really hurting heroic raid I suppose.
However in M+ the lack of tier bonus for bear dps trying to push keys atm is just crushing. Survivability has never really been the issue with bears but dps has sucked for all of SL and now I’m really starting to feel like dead weight when other tanks are easily pushing 10k and healers are out dpsing me and there’s nothing I can do with my 1-set piece but hope to get incredibly lucky over the next four weeks or whatever until catalyst opens and I can fully catch up.
It’s not like KSM is going to be remotely hard this season or I somehow need the borrowed power in any way to get KSM. More that I just don’t want to feel like I’m being carried to KSM and in a month from now or whenever when I finally have my bonus everyone will already have KSM and it won’t be because I helped push any keys in the meantime. This doesn’t feel good. Pls halp.
Tier sets also didn’t matter in PvP. At all. Because tier and legendaries were disabled. So there was that too. None of this is crying. You can’t compare Legion to now. Mythic+ was also brand new in Legion, so you had less people hard dedicated to only Mythic+ at that point.
My other argument though is catch up mechanics should be in place for alts, new players or returning players. Not for players that have been doing the patch content since day one. It’s really odd to me that you play the game, some people put in quite a bit of time, and they still may need to catch up to players that have put in the same or even less amount of time into the content in the patch as them.
I mean right now you can only created one piece a week. So honestly if it came out of Tuesday you could easily have all 4 pieces ready to craft each week, or even have 3 of the 4 already waiting if you wanted too. That’s the other issue with this, you wait that long for CC only to be able to craft one piece a week.