What the Horde needs is a clearly defined acrostic poem:
Happy to help!
Or genocide…
No, just kidding.
Or are we?
Reeeeee!
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The version of Gorgrond is also from WoD’s alpha, from before they scrapped Farahlon and just crammed in as many of the assets from it as they could. It was much more barren and much more industrialized.
Thats not what the book says.
"Brothers and sisters.
Decades have passed since the last vestiges of the Legion were driven from Draenor. We could not have accomplished this noble undertaking without the aid of the orc clans, united as the Mag’har.
Our fondest wish is for all the people of Dreanor to remain unified in purpose.
Sadly, this dream is not shared by all of those who once stood beside us.
Many noble orcs have embraced the Light. Exarch Hellscream has been an example for his people to follow. Yet sadly, even his own father resists the true path.
I believe with all my heart that the Mag’har are destined to join us as servants of the Light. But first, they must be taught to trust the naaru as we do.
The Light Mother has blessed me with visions. I know that one day the Army of the Light will march across the Great Dark Beyond and bring order to countless troubled worlds.
That bold future begins here. With us. We must make Draenor whole again.
I call upon you all to ensure that the future promised by the Light Mother is fulfilled. Purge the infection that prevents Draenor’s heart from being whole.
The Light will forge a new future for the orcs…
but first, we must save the Mag’har from themselves.
No more division. No more defiance. In the Light, we shall be one."
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This is flawless logic.
imgur(dot)com/a/3QJ3vhE
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I’m definitely thinking of something that mentions the Breakers or Primals, if not that book.
Anyone have any insight as to what that is?
Is it spoken quotes from the NPC(s)?
I think a few of the Mag’har mention wiping out (And eating, so it was probably a Laughing Skull that said this) the Primals.
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Coming back to Orcs drawing on Hun/Samurai thing…
I’m now starting to see a lot of similarities between Saurufang’s story in BfA and and old Samurai film.
He starts off loyal to his Daimyo Warchief, and does some pretty terrible things. He’s eventually shamed and leaves.
Feeling regret for his actions, he contemplates ritual suicide, but ends up coming to the conclusion that he can atone in life. Survives a couple assassination attempts and goes on the offensive.
He then goes to visit an old friend/former student whose given up their old life so they can raise a family and live a simple life in his little home… but then ninjas attack!
He’s also in a lot of very contemplative/atmospheric scenes where there’s virtually no dialogue, music, or action for long stretches. Not really the norm for WoW cutscenes, but something that’d fit in perfectly with many a Samurai film.
How much are we going to bet that if he dies in BfA, it’s going to involve a single stroke battle,
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I am not sure if it has been mentioned in this thread, but it is worth pointing out that in A Good War, Saurfang himself is the commander who literally pointed the catapults at the tree, and i believe it even stated he wanted them to think they may fire at any time.
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I was watching Avatar: The Last Airbender the other day and I had an epiphany once they had Iroh on the screen. Saurfang is supposed to be our Iroh. They’re both renowned war leaders, the greatest warrior of their generations, each lost a son during a siege, and try to steer the future of their nations towards a “brighter” path. They both admitted to not being able to take the mantle of leadership from the warchief/firelord even if they wanted to, and now have to rely on a young man to fix the world’s problems.
The difference between Saurfang and Iroh is Saurfang’s lack of badass moments. Saurfang only had one badass moment and that was Borean Tundra. Every other appearance has Saurfang either sad or just standing around. Iroh has his sad moments, but between them were his display of awesomeness.
Saurfang’s awesome moments came from cleaving entire Alliance raids and meme magic.
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But didn’t Sylvanas give him that idea? People do tend to REALLY overlook the fact that she did lead him by the nose through several of the key planning processes; and the threat of artillery against Teldrassil was one of those ideas.
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Sylvanas didn’t hold an arrow to Saurfang’s head and force him to do any of that.
He’s his own person with his own will, but by the end of those conversions he was literally staggering at Sylvanas’ genius.
I think “Sylvanas gave him that idea” is a cop out.
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On the other hand she could have just ordered him to do it, since … yah, know … Warchief. But, no, you are right that he got into the concept she gave him (now I think she does not share the same motives she gave him for this war, but that is a different topic).
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Character memes are basically headcanon.
Christie highlighted Sylvanas motive as wanting to build up the Forsaken while using Stormwindian corpses, and the Horde’s motive as bloodthirst.
We even see how the Horde bemoans boring uneventful Silitus, but began to chest pump, cheer and clank beer mugs when they realized they were going to wreck the Night Elves.
At the end of the day motives smotives, Saurfang lead an army to crush the Night Elves with hopes of obliterating Stormwind and dismantling the entire Alliance. Now all is forgiven, Saurfang and the Alliance can now hold hands and sing camp songs.
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As a side note, I actually don’t have too many objections to the concept of the Horde attacking the NEs (I have issues with Teldrassil for certain). I also don’t really have issues that Saurfang would be supportive of such a conflict, if he genuinely believed its for the benefit of the Horde in the long run. Hell, I wouldn’t be so opposed to Sylvie’s support of it if I even for a moment thought she was genuinely doing this “For the Horde” (or even For the Forsaken at the very least) … which, I do not believe even slightly anymore with her tactics and motives being so opaque.
Cursewords is actually right when he references Genn’s attack on Sylvanas in Stormheim. As much as I am personally glad that she did not succeed in obtaining Eyir, it is true that several top leaders of the Alliance requisitioned key military resources in an attempted assassination against THE newly appointed Horde leader (with no real reason or provocation from the Horde’s perspective). So, what it amounts to is that even WHILE the Horde was still “upholding honor” … members amongst the Alliance were attempting make good on Varian’s threat anyway.
On top of this there were no consequences to this act. While Genn of course is understandable to some effect (as he is a King of his own Kingdom); even Rogers (who Anduin DOES have TOTAL authority over) did not face disciplinary actions. Then with Anduin’s FLOODING Orgimmar with SI:7 agents (to make sure the Horde knew they were ALWAYS being watched) … they had to expect SOME form of reaction from the red team. Its part of why I even toy with the idea that Shaw actually IS Mal’Ganis … because escalation of tensions is exactly what making such a public display of authority over another Nation’s autonomy would result in.
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Sylvanas support to the Horde equals everyone eats, everyone wins. Sylvanas is able to potentially recruit dead Stormwindians, while the Horde crushes its long time enemy. Sylvanas needs the a strong, dominant and powerful Horde to fulfill her goals…everyone eats.
I’m okay with Saurfang and Sylvanas’ attack them before they attack us motives. I’m also okay with Sylvanas’ make the Forsaken great again motive.
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And I am of the mind that we might end up seeing an answer to the question of “What happens to her Bulwark Against the Infinite if she were to find herself in a place where she no longer needed them”? Will they be discarded like her arrows? I do not believe that (at least after she decided to burn the tree) her intentions will benefit the Forsaken people (and EVEN if for a moment I did believe it would benefit the Forsaken … they will DEFINITELY not benefit the other Horde races).
Her motives for wanting this war SO BADLY; Her motives for burning that tree; her deal with Heyla; Her use of that dagger; all of these are VERY BIG red flags for me.
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Well, yea. They killed civilians up until Teldrassil under Saurfangs’ command, but it would’ve been fine I guess. It’s the bloodthirsty horde at the end of the day. But where Blizzard really crossed a line is by obliterating most night elves and then stopping right there.
I just hope we won’t get to a point where blizzard ignores teldrassil long enough for people to forget about it, leaving the night elves completely screwed lore wise and nobody seems to care anymore.
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Well, they didn’t kill Civilians “under Saurfang’s Orders” … they killed civilians DESPITE Saurfangs orders. He does order the Horde PC to attempt to remove non-combatants from active combat zones. So, like I said I don’t have TOO many objections to the concept of the Horde attacking the Kaldorei in the environment of escalating tensions post Legion (ESPECIALLY after the Genn incident showed that KEY members of the Alliance were FULLY WILLING to attempt to fulfill Varian’s threat DESPITE the Horde “Upholding Honor” up until then).
My issues really come in with Teldrassil. Its the moment that Saurfang realized his horrific mistake (his lesson for “A Good War” was essentially he made a catastrophic error making assumptions about Sylvie’s motives; and ignoring all the warning signs with her strange behavior due to those assumptions). This lapse in judgement resulted in him helping create the nightmare that was Teldrassil (no wonder he tried to hide after). It was also the point where I ceased to believe EVEN FOR A MOMENT that Sylvie was pursuing this conflict “FOR THE HORDE”.
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