Right back at you.
You are the only one of us who has posted incorrect data on how shatter combos work my friend.
You’re in that bed alone good buddy.
What exactly do you think is causing your frostbolt to still gain the 50% crit bonus when your nova breaks while the frostbolt is in the air?
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Err, I think you’re actually both wrong (but Killinger is right that Shamans and Mages are using the same ‘exploit’).
I don’t think shatter combos or elemental mastery have anything to do with spell batching except that they are made more lenient.
Buffs and debuffs that are consumed after a spell cast do not actually consume after a spell cast in vanilla. Instead, when the spell lands, the next “hey, did a spell hit yet?” check confirms that a spell has landed and the buff/debuff vanishes. If you land another spell before that check completes, you get the extra crit.
That’s not spell batching, and it would still work even if spell batching were removed (though it might be more difficult/work less often).
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Maybe I’m misunderstanding what spell batching is, but you get the crit bonus because the frostbolt was already in the air when you send the fireblast or CoC. Damage and crit are calculated when the spell leaves your hands, not on impact. Same with ele mastery and lightning bolt / earth shock. It was later changed to only affect frost mages, and then in BFA it was changed again to include… I think fire mages?
Okay, you can replace “lands” with “leaves your hands” and the concept is the same.
Spell batching is just a knob that blizzard can widen globally, but individual buffs and debuffs did (and still do, to some extent) have their own “batching” going on.
There are little “checks” like this all over WoW even in retail. Classic is not unique in this regard. Spell batching is a much bigger thing than that.
I think spell damage is not actually calculated when it leaves your hands, it’s calculated a very small amount of time after it leaves your hands (to account for checks like the ones in shatter combos). But it “seems” like it is.
Try standing further back than 20 yards. Don’t use multiple cast spells in a single batch while grounding is up.
The mob is in a nova when the frostbolt and cone of cold hit him.
This was furthered by the fact they added ice lance to do it from full range in TBC.
Then it was even furthered because when they remove spell batching in patch 2.3… GUESS WHO CAN STILL SHATTER??
Then on top of it, EVERY XPAC MAGES STILL USED SHATTER COMBOS.
Shadowlands…they are still going to be using shatter combos.
Frost novas have a CHANCE to break on damage, the damage happens at THE SAME TIME not because it’s batched but because they LITERALLY LAND AT THE SAME TIME.
It’s called shatter combo for 2 reasons, the talent is called Shatter but more importantly the combo of the 2 spells hitting your nova and criting SHATTER THE NOVA.
It’s literally it’s intended purpose.
All of you need to stop spreading missinformation on how shatter combos happen.
They were always intended, now for instance say frost Nova reads “BREAKS ON NEXT SPELL CAST” THAT WOULD THEN BE A SPELL BATCHING DELAY.
Remind us ALL again what frost Nova reads…go ahead I’ll wait.
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Wrong. Since they even gave ice lance a FASTER travel time than frostbolt for the KEY POINT TO HIT AT THE SAME TIME.
I’m not wrong. It is NOT SPELL BATCHING.
So even when batching is removed, you would frostbolt then flow it up with ice lancez they would hit at the same time, if lucky nova wouldn’t break and u can lance again.
Errr, I’m agreeing with you? It’s not spell batching, it’s just how debuffs like Shatter and buffs like Elemental Mastery worked in Vanilla. They have their own short “batch check” timers. They check like once every few MS for spells and if two are fired within that window both gain the crit buff.
It’s not spell batching, but you could say that those buffs “batch” on their own. It’s not the same as global WoW spell batching.
Why are you getting so mad when I wasn’t even disagreeing? >_>
They literally changed the code later on to make frost mages shatter combos still work. We were the only class they did that for.
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Just listen to the better mage I’m telling you what it is just pay attention.
It’s not spell batching.
As I remember it: they were still technically possible, but much more difficult because it was a lot harder to achieve two spells within the timer without global batching. So they widened it.
Go spend 15 minutes in WoW classic doing frostnova, then frostbolt, and hit the fire blast button instantly before the frostbolt arrives. Your frostbolt will still crit more than 50% of the time. Frostbolt and fireblast do not have to hit at the same time.
Silly troll I will cook you to make bone bread. With troll soup on the side.
They changed the code to have damage, crit, etc calculate on projectile arrival instead of on spell cast… for everyone but frost mages. It’s why frost continued to work the way it did.
I’m not angry with you I just don’t agree with you that I was wrong because I never stated on how they performed it their checks as far as the damage portion goes I simply stated that it wasn’t because of spell batching
Yeah this was a common theme with frost mages after TBC. We were basically designed around getting these combos from TBC forward. In vanilla wow it was every class.
From icy veins:
"This section is kept for posterity, as Ice Lance is not utilized in the current version of Frost, but the knowledge should remain.
Frost is unique among casters. Every other caster in the game calculates if their spell is going to Critically Strike the moment it leaves your hands. Due to Winter’s Chill wanting you to cast an Ice Lance directly afterwards, but being unable to be applied to the target at long distance before the Global Cooldown is up, Blizzard changed when Frost’s spells check their Critical roll to the moment of impact.
This moment of spell checking allows for the slower traveling Glacial Spike, Ebon Bolt, and Frostbolt to be launched first, but impact after the first bolt of the extremely fast Flurry, assuming it is cast directly afterwards. It is this cast time spell → Flurry → Ice Lance combo that is the heart of Frost, and it is this combo you must master to be competent in the spec, regardless of talents chosen.
In addition, Ice Lance also has a fairly fast travel speed, and should always follow up any Flurry cast with Brain Freeze. Winter’s Chill will consider the target frozen — Ice Lance will Shatter and gain the triple damage benefit, just as if it were cast under Fingers of Frost. And again, since Frost’s spells calculate their Critical status on the moment of impact, you should cast it immediately afterwards rather than wait for Winter’s Chill to apply to the target. The travel time involved will make sure your Ice Lance always benefits from frozen status. Waiting will make you miss the window."
If you got rid of their batching system NOW, before TBC and ice lance, you’d be screwing mages over too. You’re asking them to go against how vanilla worked pretty much exclusively to nerf horde shamans, which Blizz isn’t going to do.
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No one is saying to get rid of batching, not sure why you keep putting those words in my mouth.
All I said was to fix ele mastery so it can only crit on first spell.
Who even knows if that’s possible. This isn’t even my thread.
I could care less if they fix it, ele isn’t hard to kill. I see ele mastery I can ice block it as he casts his spell and immune them both.
I just saw the thread and figured I’d agree with the exploit/bug.
Okay, well destroying the strongest combo shamans have would be a pretty big nerf, don’t you think?