At the same time, people act “elitist” by claiming they carry people when they really don’t.
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It really isn’t because the point of the analogy is that you don’t recruit from leagues far below your own and not that m+ is the equal of the NFL. That’s common sense bud.
What if I am on a geared alt? And my main is 1k? And I never linked my io to my main? In this case yoh would be missing out.
This is why io is a grwat tool. In the hands of the right people it can produce spectacular things. In the hands of the wrong people and it can produce a trash pile that the dump would turn you away from. It is all about how the individual uses it.
I agree with that.
Not by all, and this is not fact.
This is not possible, everyone has access to m+ keys and can start their own raid group. No one is physically blocking you with their body from entering any type of instanced content.
Like what? Arbitrary to you might not be arbitrary to everyone else.
Again: “That’s like, your opinion man”. You’re talking about 2 different things here, one is called being a jerk and the other is only doing high-end content with friends or PuGs that meet a leader’s specific criteria. The leader is free to do whatever they want with their key or raid they’ve put together, and because they earned that level of key the currently have OR took the time and effort to assemble a raid group, they get to decide how either is done. It’s a fair tradeoff that’s available to everyone.
What can be readily averted? I don’t understand, this won’t stop players from acting like jerks and in fact if they were forced to invite people they don’t want to in the first place, they aren’t going to treat you well and you’re better off not going with them anyways.
If you’re talking about forcing “elites” (remember, not all elites are jerks) to share their key, or force them somehow to invite people they don’t want to… That’s not fair to them. They did the work to push the key, or they are taking the time to assemble and lead the raid group, so they set the rules. Not interested? You don’t have to join that group. Assembling a raid, assigning responsibilities, doing /rw callouts mid fight… all of these things kinda stink to have to do. Leaders willing to do that should have some benefit accorded to them.
Not all elites are guilty of elitism. Elite = high end player, Elitism = acting like a jerk? I guess?
I’ll invite people that have prepared and studied fights, or aren’t going to die 13 times in a m+ because they’ve taken the time to understand the dungeon, sure why not? They deserve a fair shot. I won’t invite someone that has no idea what they’re doing because they couldn’t watch a 5 minute video though. That’s called “Just showing up and expecting loot”, it’s bad. Proactively add value to groups you’re trying to join by knowing what you’re doing. That’s common decency.
RIP Uncle Ben.
We often do, with guildies and friends of friends. I do every week, I offer my 10 key to guild and people happily take my offer, and we go about and at least complete it so they can have nice loot next week ^.^ In return, they’re nice enough to offer me a flask for the run or help one of my undergeared alts out with m+0s. They do all this without me even asking or implying anything 
Such good people.
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While I agree with this sentiment, it isn’t very well received in practice. I am very well aware that my experiences in this game do NOT necessarily represent the whole community, but let’s just take an example:
Doing a dungeon. X player says he’s never been in here before. Y player tries to offer him advice. X player says “I don’t need your help. I’ve been playing this game since blah blah blah.” X player ignores mechanic and wipes the group.
This happens quite frequently. Advice offered is not always advice taken and more often than not players get too upset that they are being told “how2play” and just ignore any suggestions laid before them.
In that vein, I actually TRIED to make this a little more painless by offering tips and advice on M+ and have even created a community based around it. Not many people join and I can’t help but speculate that the majority of people who complain don’t WANT to learn, they just want to complain. I’ll even drop the invite link here because I TRULY AND HONESTLY BELIEVE that the best way to ameliorate this problem is to improve the pool of M+ players as a whole. Join if you’d like, or don’t, but don’t say it wasn’t offered. This community is of course based on alliance which is where my toons are, but I think it would be great if one of my counterparts on the Horde side also started a community like this.
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Because you’re treated the solution as “Not My Problem”.
That and sometimes a hands-on observer can do the following:
- Give on-the-spot evaluations and tips for small issues. This does require some observation skills by the teacher, but it really can help some times.
- Answer questions, quite often about those tiny details which video guides can neglect or insufficiently explain.
- It helps with the morale, especially with new players. Being told to “watch a video” won’t help them so much as break their self-esteem on the issue, causing them to abandon pursuing more advanced content… if not the game entirely.
Video guides can be useful, I won’t deny that… but like any teaching/learning tool, there’s always a few things that a pre-packaged guide misses or doesn’t quite get through to the one who needs to learn the material. That’s where teachers/mentors come in, to fill in those gaps.
The community as a whole doesn’t want to help eachother right now, and hasn’t for years; the constant referring to video guides rather than trying to help people on the spot is ample evidence to this. Referring to a video guide shouldn’t be the first step, it should be the second last one; the actual last being a mix of hands-on learning and answering questions based on the video/experiences.
If players actually did try to help out eachother, at least a little bit, rather than trying to dismiss the issue as not their’s to at least try and resolve, it would do HUGE things for the morale of the community as a whole. The game wouldn’t be losing new players before they got anywhere either.
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Here you all go, this player is nice enough to extend a hand about a significantly difficult part of the game. Kudos @Mugz! That’s very admirable of you.
Kind of hard not to “confuse success with elitism” when you come off as a complete elitist {censored}. And yes, you do. Might want to check that superior attitude at the door when you’re trying to give advice about confusing elitism with “success”, hoss. Just a friendly suggestion.
Yes, I am a {censored} and I make no apologies for it. Have a Coke and a smile! 
Semper Fi! 
OP your being an Elitist by talking about it and calling people Casuals…
Wow your so mean ![:rofl:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/rofl.png?v=6" ":rofl:")
I am going to scream at you you ELITIST!!!
This guy has been saying stuff like this since WAYYYY back early in the thread, and not one of you has said you’re grateful, thank you or to the best of my knowledge has joined his community.
If you’re looking for anything more than what @Mugz is offering, you’re looking for a free carry and you can forget about that lol. That’s entitlement and even if I sound like an old lady I don’t care… Shame on you.
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Ok so lets run with that, let say a player has gotten the max level gear he can with out going in to “end game” yet but wants to. Now he’s tring to get into m+/raid but every group he tries to get into gives him the “gitgud scrub” … how is that player suposed to experience said end game? Start his own group? Because thats going to work… “g/l dude, im not in the mood to carry you” mentality is every where at that level.
So, the question is again, how does he progress? Added twist lets say its a rogue.
Are you kidding? Rogues are in such demand right now JUST for their shroud/lockpick + CC and stun ability that it’s almost sickening. You just need to get your ilvl up a bit and then start your own M0 group. Get yourself a key and start running them. Familiarize yourself with trash mechanics and what must be interrupted. After that you’re golden.
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See you say this but ive been kicked from groups BECAUSE im a rogue. “Rather have a war or dk sorry” so yeah the CC is nice. Lp is w/e… and shroud? I run into more people that dont even know rogues can do that than anything.
What level of content is this player trying to get into? Do they have an ilvl acceptable for a +5? Are they trying to get into a +10, only being 355 ilvl?
That’s not a 100% definitive conclusion “gonna happen every time” thing like you imply, unless the player is trying to do content outside of his actual potential to survive unavoidable damage/usefully contribute. Because at that point,
is actually a viable reason to not bring someone.
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Hang in there, it gets better. My IO is around 940 which isn’t amazing but it’s higher level, and I still get denied because warriors don’t bring anything to the group outside of raw damage. We lack meaningful CC, no stuns, and our only buff can be replaced by a scroll. ![:stuck_out_tongue:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/stuck_out_tongue.png?v=6" ":stuck_out_tongue:")
Yeah but ya got armor and a good self heal… oh and a way bigger HP pool.
Why do people like you confuse casuals with entitled bads?
I could be wrong, but I feel like the real complaint from the casual crowd about M+ is that there is no queue system. Has nothing to do with your e-peen.
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Success is an arbitrary designation generated by a small elite as a means to maintain their power and control over the desires of the general public.