Bob doesn’t have bobs
Bob has my vote…someone get a glowy windchime and bring our Bob back from the dead. And someone get a writer to retcon him into existence first.
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She could have reached out, not every Forsaken has been shown to be fanatical and Sylvanas has been shown to be far from all-knowing and controlling (a la Wrathgate)
Doing anything would have been better than nothing, even if she couldn’t change the ultimate course of them under Sylvanas. If she truly cared soo deeply for the Forsaken she wouldn’t have just been chilling with the priests totally ignoring their plight
Build-up is important and given the fact that she made literally no attempts to engage with the Forsaken until very recently the Forsaken as a whole realistically shouldn’t feel like she cares for them, it wouldn’t make sense - she needs to now prove her words aren’t empty
That’s…I feel like you don’t appreciate the depth of Arthas’ betrayal or what the Forsaken went through, which is fine but it’s not comparable
There’s a part of Dark Mirror where Nathanos recalls in explicit detail his time as a member of the Scourge, I’ll include a couple of excerpts here to give an idea of what the Forsaken were forced to do and just how deeply it impacted them
"The world swam through a thick, smoky haze. There was no reason, no sense. Only hatred. A hatred rooted deep in the corners of his mind, its tendrils twisting, vinelike, through his fetid core. The man he’d been was murdered, his blood now salting the farmlands he had once called home. This creature might inhabit the dead man’s body, but it possessed no will of its own. It didn’t need one. It existed only to serve the Lich King.
He turned back to the ground where the half-consumed corpse of his latest victim lay. A warm rush of strength flowed into his body as he ripped a mouthful of flesh from her throat. He remembered the ecstasy that had gripped him as her screams grew quiet, the terror that froze in her dead eyes as he devoured her. Craving that sensation again, he tore off another bite."
“His eyes drifted down to the mottled skin of his gnarled fingers, stained deep red by his recent kill. A rush of shame banished the thrill of his reunion with Sylvanas. The thought that she would see him like this, a decrepit, nightmarish mockery of his former self, filled him with disgust. Almost of its own volition, his forearm rose to hide his rotting face.”
What they suffered at the hands of Arthas is monumentally profound, this isn’t just dying at his hands, it’s being raised as a decrepit corpse and forced to commit atrocities against your own people, atrocities that never leave you - atrocities that you don’t just “forget” when it’s all said and done
I honestly don’t think any race in WoW has suffered to that extent. Losing your loved ones is one thing (NE at Teldrassil) and it is a striking loss, but to be forced into taking part of the destruction? To recall the days that you spent, as Nathanos put it, “salting the farmlands you once called home” and not only devouring people but getting an unnatural thrill from it instilled by the LK? That just seems soo profoundly scarring to me
I’m perfectly fine with the Forsaken exploring their old life now, I would just prefer that they find their place as a “people” overall as opposed to latching onto another monarch right off the bat - now is the chance for them to detach their identity as a race from a central figure
I also don’t think that Calia’s claim to the throne should mean much to them. Those of the Forsaken that are even from Lordaeron underwent such trauma in their homeland that reconciling it is going to be a journey, logically I can’t see why they’d suddenly fall in line with their fallen homelands absentee queen
I actually don’t know that the Forsaken would still follow Sylvanas as a whole, though there’d undoubtedly be elements that would. The Bannerbae glance signalled the change in their mentality, that they don’t consider the Horde to be “nothing”, that after years they’ve started to consider it to be at least something akin to their place in the world
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I never said the forsaken didnt suffer, what I’m saying is arthas is his own person, his first kill in Lordaeron was his own father
and I’m sorry but the horde basically hates the forsaken and they know it
also I think you are really downplaying the power of a Royal, check out Simon II the dude was the king of Bulgaria and was in exile for 50 years, when he came back after the communist fell people were screaming “we want our king back”, he was 9 years old when he left
in all fairness he did try to make some kind of govern while in exile but it never happen and its not like he gave is all either but still people scream they loved him after 50 years and that was 96, not the middle age
in all I’m not saying its not rushed and that it couldn’t go in another direction at all, but people embracing their Royals despite they have never doing anything is historical accurate
And he subsequently laid waste to the lands of Lordaeron. As a Menethil, as the heir to the throne of Lordaeron. To act as if that wouldn’t mar people’s perception of the royal family is illogical to me
They trusted the Menethil’s once, and for the past 13 years they’ve suffered for it
No, they don’t. The entire reason that the Forsaken are a part of the Horde is because Baine fought for them. The Blood Elves have long worked closely with them as well (see Ghostlands). Trolls don’t seem to be particularly averse to undead, they even have a Loa of death that they can interact with who takes the form of an undead troll and the Zandalari themselves enslave souls for use as guardians and the likes. Orcs themselves have spent their time under the thumb of the Legion, if anybody can understand the shame of past transgressions it’s them - that was a major aspect of Saurfang’s character
They were, rightfully, sceptical of Sylvanas and her fanatics but to say that the Horde as a whole hate the Forsaken as a whole? That’s soo broad and just not supported. There are plenty of examples of Forsaken working alongside their Horde counterparts in peace, Forsaken have also fought alongside their Horde counterparts through countless battles and wars now
You’re relying way too heavily on real world examples, this isn’t the real world. Unless you have a real world example where the heir to a throne murdered his people, raised them as rotting zombies and weaponised them against their own people - only to have his sister show up after 13 years of no contact at all to claim said throne…I don’t see the relevance - it isn’t comparable, nothing that has occurred in our human history is comparable
The Forsaken have not, in these past 13 years, displayed any love or longing for their fallen nation or its absentee queen - they haven’t pined over Calia or wished for her return, they’ve forged their own place in the world. I can’t think of a single Forsaken NPC that has soo much as mentioned Calia
Hell, they literally lived in the ruins of Lordaeron - the old capital - and did not call their capital “Lordaeron” nor made any attempts to re-construct the city above. Their capital was Undercity, and they seemed perfectly content leaving the old Lordaeron in ruins to rot and be forgotten
Sure you could try and chalk that up to Sylvanas, but there was literally no indication that the Forsaken cared. No sly comments mentioning how they’d prefer to be up in Lordaeron like the past and not living in the sewers, no groups rebelling against the tyrant Sylvanas and her orders not to rebuild Lordaeron (if that was even a thing - nothing stated such). Hell, look at Forsaken architecture, it’s their own - they didn’t model it after old Lordaeron in an attempt to regain what they lost, they forged their own dark and gothic style
So like, there’s just no evidence that the Forsaken care about their old kingdom at all, and there needed to be if the narrative was going to be that Calia would return to claim her throne with the Forsaken welcoming her with open arms
Call it rushed if you want, but if it does go that way the build-up is non-existent and that matters. You can’t just ignore the past decade of established lore and go - “well aaaaactually, nah the Forsaken really wanted Calia back and there was just no signs of it all because Sylv…you know despite there being a literal rebellion plotted under her nose”. That’s just horrendous writing and shouldn’t be acceptable to anybody
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you keep talking about arthas and the menethil, I also never heard they saying they hate the menethil, never saw anyone talking about vengeance to the noblemans or whatever, they clearly hated arthas and the scourge, saying their hate goes beyond that is your opinion and idc if its illogical to you because nobody is blaming the horde for garrosh or Sylv actions, but somehow its the fault of the whole Royal family what arthas did, great logic you have there
you clearly dont like the character and the idea of her rulling the forsaken and that’s fine, but there is no reason for them to not wanting to hear her out, before the storm is canon after all and she is the rule of that land
Why are abominations treated like low caste citizens? Isn’t it time to show we’ve moved past Sylvanas? The new undead leader should represent the new face of the Forsaken. Vote for ROPE. Vote for CHAINS(hooks too). Barack Abomination for Forsaken leader 2019.
Uhmm.
Calia has existed since wrath…
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Um, the entire Forsaken identity was hinged around their hatred for their old heir
And there is NPC talk about how the Horde shares some of the guilt for Sylvanas, they’re not being prosecuted because how are you going to prosecute like the entire Horde? But the talk is there
Garrosh was clean-cut in the end, much more-so than Sylv. Garrosh was actively rebelled against by the Horde and his loyalists died or were imprisoned when Org was sieged - there’s nothing to hold onto there, justice was done
Neither of those are particularly comparable, there’s been no reconciliation for Calia
I don’t mind her being the racial leader, in fact I have a lengthy post in another thread detailing what I think Calia as leader could look like - strawman argument is a strawman argument
I just don’t agree with your assertion of “lul royalty” given that there’s no indication that the Forsaken would care about the old royalty and all you have are nebulous real world examples that hardly compare to the situation at hand
To give you the short of my lengthy post on it, I think there’s room for Calia and the Forsaken to have some interesting growth together. But Calia has to be put into her place first, she thinks she understands the Forsaken - both her and Derek are taking their own mentality as freshly risen and applying that to the Forsaken as a whole, which is ignorant
I would want them to learn that, I’d want Calia to learn that what the Forsaken went through with their resurrection into undeath is nothing like the lightforging she went through while surrounded by friends who meant her well. I would want her to go into the leadership position full of idealistic hope only to be cut down to something more like the Forsaken she leads as she learns the complexity that shapes them
Then instead of trying to “fix” them, I’d want her to instead try to guide them down a better path while understanding that they’ll never truly be human again
And like I said, that could lead to interesting growth on both their parts as Calia is humbled and has darkness introduced to her character through her experiences with the Forsaken - and the Forsaken in-turn are shown that although they carry the scars of their past and the darkness that comes with that, there’s also a better path than the one Sylvanas offered them - maybe not a path bathed in the sun but one that isn’t soo dark
^ The actual post
So yah, I’d prefer that they not have a singular new ruler - but that doesn’t meant that I “don’t like the character and the idea of her ruling them” 
All this arguing about Calia when we all know Roberto of Menethil is the true heir once his wiki page gets created.
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Fr though. I mean it is SURELY coincidence that every AR added to the game has had a female leader. It is going to be 9 to 1 in patch 8.3 when Mechagnomes get the first male leader (I at least am assuming it is the Prince).
Varian was the “Missing king” no one knew about until they fleshed him in the comics, and then he appears out of nowhere in WoW as the King, and then the High King of the Alliance.
This is not uncommon for them to do.
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its ok if you dont agree, history does agree, and I already told you it was her brother but not her family the same way garrosh did it not the horde
Like I said there is no talking about they hating calia or anyone else from the nobel families besides arthas anywhere
you do mind her, you dont mind if they do things the way you want, the way you think is right, otherwise you do mind
Turalyon is sad 
Good rebuttal 
Oh you mean I, alongside plenty of other Forsaken players, want actual character growth instead of having a character roughly shoehorned into the leadership position of one of my favourite races? Oh golly, how crazy of me
How dare I desire Calia to grow into the position of Forsaken leader instead of the Forsaken randomly going “oh yes my queen”
But I guess wanting build-up (something sorely lacking from the Calia/Forsaken storyline - as you yourself have admitted) equates to not liking in your books? Suuuuuure
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Turalyon is the leader of the entire Army of the Light and also not a Lightforged Draenei so I really don’t think he really counts as a representative (the word I probably should have used). Captain Fareeya is the one in charge of all the new Lightforged Draenei.
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That’s exactly what I was thinking. Why not a made-up character with a generic name that nobody cares about?
That is an unrealistic expectation.
A lot of characters in WoW are shoehorned in positions of power. The exception are usually Warcraft III characters, that were built up to their positions of power more slowly.
I never said her story has to end, but its 100% plausible that people will welcome their monarch back after being left without leadership, that’s my whole point and my whole first comment, it has only being 13 years since they where ruled by her family, not ages, the fact that Sylv was Tyranical and in the end just bolted out there probably with the most crazy forsaken left the spot open for a old ruler
tbh I forgot she existed but fair enough