More tightly tuned raid encounters that normally would mean having people hearth to respec or switching players in and out.
Which is why raid encounters only got more challenging because if you needed a lot of healers on one fight, but few on another you didn’t have to completely switch the raid makeup
If we’re struggling to make an enrage timer yes we are 100% dropping healers. I 4 healed a SSC on the PTR, I imagine most groups will use 5 or 6 at most.
Hate to say it as a healer but you are only hampering your progress by adding more healers to a raid.
It doesn’t make the fights easier because you can already swap people in and out or have someone respec; it makes it slightly more convenient. We’ve done that plenty of times because we’ve had unfortunate roster issues. It’s drastically overstated how often people would be respeccing with Dual Spec.
But you can’t make this argument when the premise for demanding dual spec is commonly that the barrier is too high to do it (the gold cost).
You’re in one breath saying “It’s easy to do anyway”, and in another implying we need it because it’s essentially too hard to do without dual spec.
You have to pick a lane, either the gold cost is prohibitive, or it isn’t.
If it is too prohibitive, then fair enough, you want dual spec because you have issues managing the gold to do it as often as you’d like. It’s a fair issue, that has it’s own set of arguments around whether it just means you need to farm more, or Blizzard needs to meet you half-way because reasons.
If it’s not too prohibitive, then…just go do it the way it’s implemented now. It means you want it for pure and simple convenience and I’ve yet to see a change they’ve made so far that was pure and simply for convenience (other than the boost, actually, but I’m not the biggest fan of that either). Additionally, if this still doesn’t concern you, then we can just jump from one convenience/qol change to the next on a list of things added in all later expansions until we get to something you wouldn’t want to see implemented, and then you’re at a crossroads of deciding why you feel one way about dual spec, but another way about something else.
No I’m not. Not wasting more time on disingenuous stuff like this.
As a feral dps who was third tank in WotLK, I respecced several times every raid. Sometimes for bosses and sometimes for trash.
There were healers who did the same.
There were DPSers who respec’d between trash and bosses.
There were DKs tanks who switched specs to tank certain bosses/adds.
All in all, there was at least one and usually several players respecing EVERY single boss fight.
If you weren’t there, stop guessing.
Okay, back to basics then:
Why do you think dual spec should be added to TBCC? As in, what’s your personal reason for wanting it? I’m puttin’ you to the test here, and seeing if there’s actually a reason and you don’t just come in here to post clown emojis and be a contrarian.
Imagine if Death Knights weren’t released until 6 months into WotLK.
Why do you show people such disrespect and then ask more questions as if we’re supposed to assume you’ve suddenly learned how not to be disrespectful in the future?
I’m only emitting disrespect in the direction I feel like I’m receiving it, tbh.
Do you want to start over?
Is that your MO?
“Hello, your opinion sucks and you’re a terrible person. Anyway, continue to engage with me in regular conversation now, thanks!”
That about sums it up?
I’ll ask again…would you like to start over?
My post in that anti-Dual Spec thread has more likes than the OP. People know that Dual Spec is a healthy addition to the game. They can see it on private servers (ironically the same private servers that so many “No-changers” on this forum claim do a better job than Blizzard.)
So you want it simply because other people want it…? You’re arguing completely in their stead despite not actually being a person affected?
For the record, I don’t personally put any weight on likes. I’ve gotten a huge number of likes spread out amongst my dual spec posting history, not all on one single post like your example, but sprinkled through out the various discussions. It really, truly, should not impact the discussion in any notable way.
Also, I played on a private server that made respeccing trivial in vanilla and I thought it had real, impacting effects that hurt the experience. In fact it’s a part of why I’m so confident in my stance that it’s a poor add.
Of course it’s a bad faith argument, you can’t swap specs in combat so fights themselves certainly aren’t balanced around dual spec. And raids as a whole aren’t either, ironically the fight the biggest swing in requirements was 4 horseman in vanilla.
I think one of the better arguments for not adding dual spec is the fact that they haven’t added yet to begin with.
I mean there simply has to be a reason they chose to have not added it yet, and I’m inclined to think it’s a reasonable or important one that is tied in to their vision of how they want TBCC to be played.
You’d have to argue that they completely blanked and just forgot that dual spec was one of the most popular features in the history of the game and “woops” left it out…which…I’m not sure is a reasonable assumption?
Yes.
I have 4,000 gold, over 1,000 gold in consumables and my epic flyer. I’ve played this Holy Paladin and until yesterday I respecced a total of 4 or 5 times in the last two years (respecced yesterday cause I wanted to slightly change my spec so I can do a little more DPS in Karazhan.)
I don’t personally need Dual Spec. I would buy it and use it every once in awhile but the number one reason I want it is to prevent this game from continuing down it’s current path to desolation.
I want Dual Spec so the people who play multiple aspects of this game don’t burn out (many already have) on trying to schedule Arenas and Heroics and everything else around everyone’s respecs. I want Dual Spec so they aren’t consigned to constantly farming gold to respec for the next year and a half or longer.
What makes your desire to relieve those people you know of that burden more integral to implementation than my desire to ensure that everyone continues to face that burden because it better replicates the experience that we all signed up to play?
To me this is eerily similar to the “Should all games have an easy mode” debate…sort of.
My answer would be no. Some games should basically just be difficult and if it’s too hard for you there are other games.
To me, lack of dual spec represents a standard that was inherent to the TBC experience, and you either have the gumption to work through it or…you play a different game.
It’s regal and nice of you, of course, to simply just want the best for the people you know, but you’re ignoring people like me. What you want is directly adverse to what I want, and harms the game for me. So essentially you’re looking at a poll, or likes, and saying “yeah, f the minority”. Except…this isn’t really a reasonable approach to gauging whether it should be done or not. Even if we’re a small minority, that doesn’t mean we are to be completely ignored simply by way of the numbers.
So this can’t just be about the majority wanting it, done deal. It’s just not that simple, unfortunately. There needs to be a truly, logic-driven reason that TBCC needs this feature added to maintain the intended experience (which I think is…at the very least TBC-like?).
Completely disagree.
Right now, I would guess that less than 10% of raids are having players respec on a boss to boss basis. It’s expensive, and it’s inconvenient, which means it is working as intended to deter most players/guilds from doing that.
But with dual spec, I think we’d see 90%+ of guilds having at least some players respec for some bosses, every week. There would be no reason not to. It would instantly become meta, if not to help overcome difficult encounters, then to maximize parses. I think it would become just as prevalent as world buffs were in vanilla Classic, although obviously not nearly that impactful and gamebreaking.
Every time less than 3 tanks is needed for a boss, 1-2 tanks would spec pure dps. The same thing would happen for every role, so that raids would have the exact number of tank specs, dps specs, and heal specs for each fight in order to optimize.
So what? There simply isn’t that big of a swing in role requirements that it makes a huge difference. In a 25 man you have maybe 4-5 people who would be swapping.
Stop pretending that there would be some huge demand for everyone to swap specs all the time.