When Did Sylvanas have her Soul Split

Hi,

We’re not going to know exactly what happened to Sylvanas for like months and I’m still a hot little potato about what looks like redefining a character after 17 years.

Let’s speculate: When did she actually have her soul split?

Sylvanas with an Asterisk
Before we do that, I want to complain loudly about what it means if Sylvanas is finally ‘unified’ in her soul. We don’t know what it means yet, but if you remember the Battle for Azeroth announcement like I do and the image of Sylvanas before a burning Teldrassil, then you remember that Blizzard is awful at this, and it usually means exactly what it looks like.

If she’s been reunited with her virtuous traits, we have to look at everything she does and says before that reunification with a big fat annoying asterisk to remind us she’s being influenced by an absence of her full personality and psyche. This implies that what she does while incomplete may not be the same things she would have done while complete.

Characters develop this way all the time, looking back on their deeds and wondering if they could do it over. Thrall has regrets over naming Garrosh the Warchief in his stead, but Thrall only has his own actions to reflect upon. Thrall does not get to say that the Jailer had a part of his soul held away from him, absolving him of some responsibility for the things Garrosh did. Saurfang also had regrets over what he did for the Horde, which made him different in the present than he was in the past. Thrall and Saurfang grew as a result of their history and actions. Sylvanas is about to grow because plot.

I Summon Blue-Eyes White Banshee
Whatever change she’s undergone, it’s being indicated with blue-eyes instead of red-eyes. The implication there is that anytime she had red-eyes, she’s incomplete.

So how long has she been ‘incomplete’?

Power-Slide into Frostmourne
This is the obvious one, but also the worst one. It’s obvious because it’s what we know happened to Uther and I’m pretty sure others slain personally by Frostmourne.

The reason this is the worst is because it implies that Sylvanas has been ‘incomplete’ this entire time, even in WC3, and that soul reunification might mean we have to look at everything differently and ask ourselves how much she would or wouldn’t have still done if she had her soul.

This one’s more likely because of Sylvanas’ blue eyes, which is dumb. If our only indication of her change is her blue eyes, then the implication is red eye Sylvanas is incomplete Sylvanas.

Everything points to this, it probably is this.

Self-Yeet in Edge of Night
Danuser has retroactively indicated that Kosak’s Edge of Night was when Sylvanas made contact with the Jailer. It was when she made her pact with the Val’kyr. Perhaps this was when the soul split actually happened, and that means only everything from Cataclysm onward was committed by an “incomplete Sylvanas”, but would leave her Warcraft-Wrath days relatively untouched.

Hand-Shaking with Helya
The only other point I can think of is this one, and I have no reason to back it up other than a pact being made, just like with the Val’kyr. It involves Helya, obviously, who is prominent again now, and takes place right around everything else is being ‘set up’ for where we are now. Sylvanas’ ascension to Warchief to set up everything she does in BfA, revealing Meuhzala was the voice that whispered to Vol’jin. Everything culminating now in Shadowlands wasn’t really getting planted until Legion, where this pact with Helya happened.

Looking outside of the narrative and how Blizzard does things, this also lines up interestingly. Legion was the last expansion many of the “Old Guard” were really involved in. Metzen retired early into it, Kosak was either already Creative Director for Hearthstone or moved over shortly after, and Danuser was already contributing to the lore with Dark Mirror.

This one’s also the most optimistic, because if this is where the soul split actually happens, then much more of Sylvanas is still ‘complete’ up until this point, and that also mitigates the effect of not having her soul because she was still doing some pretty sketchy things throughout (even though we know she was in league with the Jailer while active in Silverpine.

It’s Probably Awful
More than likely, given what we know, this is a change that happened from the moment she died and she only achieves her Final Form after 17 years, complete with all the good virtues that might have come into play while she was galivanting around being a capricious little turd and because of which we can no longer hold her completely responsible or contemptible for her actions.

Bravo.

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My best guess is “handshaking with Helya”- and the Soulcage was actually powered by her own soul fragment. Her soul fragment was released when Genn smashed the soulcage, and somehow peirced the veil, wrecked the Arbiter, and “broke the machine of death”.

Basically they retold Arthas’ story… except Sylvanas got a dumb trinket instead of a cool sword. She’s Arthas, but dumb.

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How much do you wanna bet that it gets revealed in the book? lol

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I think it’s safe to say when frostmourne killed her it split her soul.

If blizzard wanted to get spicy with things though imo, they could say after the initial split every death after further split said current soul when the Valkyre fez’s her

In a way to explain why Sylvanas is so wildly different and we all argue about the various iterations of her.

Thus the new full Sylvanas would be a ‘New’ version but also the true one going forward

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And we’ll have tons of overwrought dramatics about how much she hates what her previous selves did and how much she strains over that.

Ugh.

The only thing being the ‘true’ Sylvanas means is that she’s a true stranger and we can’t act like we know anything about her, because we don’t.

I mean I never said it be pretty but it would be a decent way to try and explain away all those ‘Drastic’ changes

And at this point I just wanna try and make the best of a bad/ annoying situation

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All we’ve seen the Ranger General do is warn High Elven Civilians to flee, bomb a bridge to stop Arthas and get impaled by Frostmourne.

One thing we should wonder is why her eyes turned Red when her Soul split while her whole self retains the Blue Eyes she had while living…

The Void called her an abomination and her Shadow Magic was far darker than normal Void Magic… If Sylvanas got infected by anything during the Troll Wars than it clearly hid in the part of Sylvanas’s Soul that Frostmourne did not take with it’s presence getting more noticeable when most of Sylvanas’s Soul was grabbed though still not strong enough to attempt possession.

Maybe the Ebon Blade’s interrogation will discover 3 personas inside Sylvanas: The Ranger General, the Banshee Queen and the Shadow-spawned aberration seeking the End of All Things that the Void recognized.

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We already know this answer, watch the Uther, Bastion teaser.

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Well, if you watch the video, you see the same little blue pained outline of her soul from the Warbingers cartoon. The one that floats after Arthas stabbed her and tortured her.

It is almost like they just transposed that little blue image from the cartoon on top of Sylvanas after she gets back… what ever the Jailer gave her.

So I think that is when it happened.

I had a similar idea, so I think it is a good one, hehe.

It could be almost like dying a shirt, or sugar coating candy.

The first time, it can be a dusting or smattering. But each additional time, more is covered, and eventually, you don’t even see the original color. Like each time she died and was resurrected, she lost more of her self, and became more tied to Death.

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Possible, though from the description of her mount drop, it implies the reason she has been becoming darker is that as her other attempts at coping failed the negative emotions of the darker half and death power was filling in the void in her soul.

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Yeah like Cursewords pointed out, when he tosses the missing part of her soul into her you see the blue outline of her ranger-general self as it merges with it. You also hear the same scream she gave during the Warbringers short when Arthas corrupted said spirit into a banshee. So yeah…almost 100% split happened when she was killed by Frostmourne (since all the other people with split souls were killed personally by Arthas with said sword).

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Yeah and I concede in the original post that it’s very likely what happened. Which makes me sad, because that’s almost the entirety of the Banshee Queen replaced with someone we just don’t know.

I’m not into comics myself and a quick Google search isn’t pulling anything up (I could just be looking badly) but I read that the Silver Surfer had an arc like this, where he was given his humanity back at one point and was promptly crushed by the guilt of everything he had ever done. Something like that is at least a possibility instead of the “oops no memory” angle everyone’s expecting.

Not everyone /wink

I view it as her getting her better qualities back ie deceny, honor, morality, virtue etc etc back.

I’ve seen a few theories floating around about the “Can’t let them reach the…Sunwell” as if her memory was shattered or on pause. I don’t think that’s the case.

I highly doubt she’s going to have any sort of amnesia when she wakes up. If anything I’d expect that once the missing part of her soul was unified with her body she would’ve gotten all those memories flooding her (the shock of which could’ve been what caused her to pass out in the first place, let alone having a missing part of her soul unceremoniously shoved back into her).

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She already appears to have some awareness about what’s happening. The first thing she says to others is indication she has memory of what’s going on, or what is about to happen.

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This is closer to New earth DC, where Super man and everyone is revealed to have been split into two timelines and both are now singular and canon. Evil Sylvanas still has the memories, old Sylvanas just now has said memories and what’s more, the morality and cognitive capabilities to process them as terrible, SHE still committed the crimes, it’s just now she can feel guilt for having committed them. The real question is whether the Alliance leaders gathered there will even believe her, she has lied and deceived them about several things in the past, so how are THEY gonna react when/if she wakes?

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Why does it just sound like it’s gonna come off like “DC did it better?”

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I kinda feel that’s its unfair to compare the two. You’re right, I think we’re going to get the fast food version, but DC Comics is a story telling giant.

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DC has its own problems, as does Marvel.

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