What's epic about 20 man raids?

[Khagon-wild-growth]

@Heavywood-crusader-strike

@Khagon-wild-growth

SoD population

Already cut in half and actively plummeting daily, but live in your copium dream that making changes that make players quit in masse is a good idea. lmao

Citation required.

[Yoggsothoth-lone-wolf]

I’d rather it be 20 man with 40 man tuning. We’re already stronger than 60s at level 40. A 40 man raid would be the furthest thing from epic, it would just be loot pinatas with this power.

[Fafdamir-bloodsail-buccaneers]

what you are failing to see is that they will tune down MC for 20, so it will still be a loot pinata.

[Noxranna-bloodsail-buccaneers]

Of course not, Vanilla raid design in general was pretty uninspired. It’s the new 20-man content coming that I expect to be fun and engaging with a now better grasp on the idea, vs potential 40-man content that would necessitate being pretty basic and boring by virtue of having way too many people in it

[Lethlis-bloodsail-buccaneers]

They don’t have one other than raid logging.

So yeah, not exactly a good metric at the start of a phase. I know I have been way less concerned about missing lockouts his phase since most of the gear is “meh” and pugging is painful during the early stages of the wave 2 levelers.

[Nancypelosix-benediction]

@Nyaria-argent-dawn

So. no.

You don’t coordinate 40 man raids. Got it.

Guild leaders that lead top end guilds love 40 mans. You are being wishy washy on purpose.

Have you ever played this game or is sod your first time?

[Nancypelosix-benediction]

@Noxranna-bloodsail-buccaneers

Molten Core was cleared on day 4 of Classic by a raid that wasn’t even level cap. There’s nothing difficult about Classic raids at all beyond not falling asleep at the wheel. Nevermind that “difficulty” doesn’t necessarily equate to “fun” anyway

Post your logs showing you’ve cleared naxx 40

[Thalariel-lone-wolf]

I cannot even imagine trying to balance a 40 man raid for current SoD power levels, much less how things will be at 60. Personally, I wouldn’t find it fun or “epic” to sit there for 20 minutes slogging through a giant damage sponge boss with tedious mechanics. Much rather have a more intense, shorter encounter.

Reducing the party power by having fewer players means you can design more impactful fights with less bloated hp, IMO.

As for the argument that 40 man seems more epic because you have more people on your screen, is that feeling of epicness worth the half hour or more you spend pugging 10-20+ people to fill if you don’t have a guild capable of staffing a 40 man itself?

Personally, given the average attitudes I’ve experienced in the SoD community, the biggest turn off to 40 man raiding is having to weed through a bunch of self important jerks that equate worth as a human being to their DPS parse.

[Wîçkëð-sargeras]

post on your main so I can log check you, green parser extraordinaire

[Zaalg-ashkandi]

@Sthis-shandris

Had they released SoM now, and added even a small amount of class tuning, I think it would be a success.

Maybe, but the point is that Blizz already gave these people what they’re asking for in the first Seasonal server. Why do it again in the next one? Time for something different.

Hell, maybe they’ll do 60 person raids in the next Seasonal server. Advocate for that if they want. But not every Seasonal server needs to be the same or try to appeal to the same type of players.

[Birdhunting-zuljin]

Nothing.

It’s a bad decision and it’s a worse decision considering the content they’re pushing which is, uh, nothing. You have nothing to do inbetween raidlogs.
Make money? To buy what?
PvP? Why? The BG rewards are marginal vs raid and the PVP events need only be done like 3-5 times to get your weapon (and isn’t fun).
No reason to quest.
No reason to dungeon post 40.

Now the only thing going for SOD - easy grouping for raiding - is dying.

[Kickrøckz-proudmoore (Kickrøckz)]

Nothing, it’s boring.

Problem is, people want what’s easy not good, why bad music artist and fast food can be successful in our society., why terrible companies can fail upwards, same with politicians.

When I think about Classic I don’t think of ZG or AQ 20, those raids are an afterthought…MC/Naxx/BWL is what I think of as do most of the community but a few forum warriors.

[Kickrøckz-proudmoore (Kickrøckz)]

Anything in life worth doing is hard, that’s the rub…

[Felpickle-illidan]

Wah wah
/10

[Khagon-wild-growth]

Classic raids aren’t hard. Which means they aren’t worth doing. Try again, scrub.

[Merpish-sargeras]

@Bullakae-crusader-strike

The biggest reason I despise Retail is the whole idea of changes.

There is a dissertation’s worth of psychology to unpack here.

[Argentia-defias-pillager]

another guy who has never cleared naxx 40 but he watched his favorite streamer do it, that counts right

[Khagon-wild-growth]

Another forum warrior who can’t comprehend basic English. You don’t count at all.

[Kickrøckz-proudmoore (Kickrøckz)]

Of course they’re not hard, its been 20 years…is Zelda on the NES hard for you now? Cause it’s so much easier for me now then it was 35 years ago when I first played it and finished it and replayed it over again.

No World Buffs, no flasks, no reading up or watching a video and no addons would make it harder and we all know even 20 years ago when Death and Taxes were buying gold and getting world firsts, game gets easier when you start to cheese it.

20 mans were always an afterthought…I remember clearing BWL and MC and most of AQ 40(though did clear it in Classic) but never think about ZG or AQ 20…they were raids you ran on off nights to waste time.

Also, never said raids were hard below Naxx…you young bucks have horrible reading comprehension.

[Argentia-defias-pillager]

these people have never even cleared AQ40