He is a real monster. Even though I’ve pugged him 4-5 weeks in a row GDI he can still be rough.
I swore I screened everyone and the raid is something like 215+ with everyone 10/10 On The Toon They Were Playing and we were still getting crushed.
The weeks I have done it our DPS has been blisteringly hot, easily pushing P2 before third adds but this week we were struggling but it didn’t really seem like anyone was that bad, especially the last few attempts with a smaller raid size.
I generally run an extra healer because it helps compensate for my healing (it suffers when I’m calling out DBM) and it also helps during massacres and mirror changes when the tanks can drop low just because everyone is moving.
But yah any thoughts, especially the last few pulls where Elayeth started tanking (he was backup at first) would be much appreciated.
htt ps://www.warcraftlogs.c om/reports/pWPdDkBVxJAC2Qb9
Feel free to look at previous weeks too. htt ps://www.warcraftlogs.c om/reports/VDx2rfQmwFdphtL1
Now one thing I do know that went wrong in the last or second to last pull is that the tanks were under the impression they had to get wracking pain on the ranged adds by walking all the way down the platform until they were in front of the add. I don’t believe that’s the case, but correct me if I’m wrong. The tanks wind up killing themselves because what should have been 3 steps in to the mirror was a 100-meter dash. htt ps://yout u.be/CmGy5iBuR10
Your overall damage and healing numbers aren’t bad, it looks like it’s just the execution based on the logs.
Almost every single pull the raid had multiple people die before P3. People dieing to stuff like the puddles on the ground and Massacre. Also, it looks like that when you are getting to P3 that you are taking alot of ticking damge from Crimson Chorus. Maybe the adds are not being dpsed down fast enough? Keep in mind that the adds being up in P3 reduce % Healing Received by the entire raid. Couple that with the ticking damage, you can’t really keep people up no matter how much you spam.
Yah every transition went bad. Once I finally got it to a point we could push phase 3 before third adds, it got messed up because raid dps had swung so much from too little to too much and it caught us by surprise.
I’m just frustrated because I haven’t had a week where it seemed to go so smooth in P1 then everything kept going wrong p2
Edit: GDI I went in there tonight again and still wiped on it for three hours. Couldn’t find a decent tank…8-10 stacks of scorn, 3 stacks of wracking pain, debuffing the add on the wrong side, urggg…
I literally didn’t have a tank queue for 3 hours despite being in the queue the entire time. That has like…never happened to me.
Now if you’ll excuse me, I’m gonna go get some gear on my blood dk.
http s://www.warcraftlogs.c om/reports/YFcJQzbf8wGNPMp9/
Rough rundown of wipes for tonight:
1: People getting used to only 4 soaks
2: People getting used to only 4 soaks
3: ursoc tank had no idea what he was doing
4: ursoc tank had no idea what he was doing
5: both pally tanks failed p1
6: First P3 orbs too far / adds up to long, was a good pull though
7: another good pull, tank death due to lack of healing I think due to soak being too far from Denathrius
8: Slow attrition, 2 deaths p2 2 deaths p3 then slowly just came apart
9: Tank death due to impale I think? happens at 3:45
10: Missed p3 transition by under a second
11: Themis stood in massacre while also not taunting boss, azraeldin had 3 stacks
You can be closer to the mirror if that helps. However if you guys are dying trying to apply the debuff dont bother. it’s not needed the cabals are squishy already.
we taunt every 2 wrecking pain and i tank ramonia the whole time. I dont recommend with your tanks being Venthyr and not a dwarf to remove bleeds. Just mentioning it so maybe it can give some ideas.
As a Paladin Tank they can get spellward and finalstand to negate the shattering pain or scorn. Sadly they are venthyr and may fight you for there DPS because that is why they rolled venthyr.
Without going into full detail because of many factors something is going on with your tanks Damage Taken they are taking 3k DTPS more together then us and that is a lot of healing. There is no point of having a venthyr dps tank if youre bringing in more healers to make up for the damage taken. all it does is give the boss more HP, Sometimes less is better.
https://imgur.com/a/0d4ojO8
Tanked ramonia 100% and still taken less overall damage. This is also a Sire kill going through the whole boss fight of course
Saw your vid. if the tanks played it right it’s not a issue. I think there playing around massacre to have more running room and that is why they do it. However the transition was rough when the tank didnt taunt right away to put him to mirror.
One correction to weavy a prot pally would NOT take final stand to deal with shattering OR scorn, or really on any st fight. Doing so shows a lack of understanding of the fight and the class (in regard to the person taking it not you).
yes spell warding would be taken for scorn if you want to get one use it has some value in the first two phases also but a shorter divine shield CD and more importantly ad CD from not taking spellwarding will in basicly every case be better.
Final stand is used for getting 8 secs of divine shield vs only 3 when there is no mechanic fixate. A extra 5 secs of ds is not worth giving up rp unless required to do the mechanic (your examples are not) as the increased uptime of wings will more than counter the damage extra taken via more holy power as well as increase your dps and healing on top. Also as shattering is a fixate on the tank it’s used on final stand dose NOTHING at all for it. In fact hurts you as lose the other option. While scorn you are not tanking when using ds for and in fact removes flexibility of being able to ds the scorn while other tank is tanking and go immune soak that is more likly to result in a wipe than using it to extend your tanking time by 8 secs via resetting score and keeping on tanking.
If looking to ds the pains you just do so without final stand. Furthermore if not taking sw can bop to the same effect. Leaving you divine shield for scorn rather than spellwarding so still are able to do exactly what you said to do using sw plus final stand with ds and bop but gaining two talents on top. One of them making your cheat death have twice as much uptime so rather massive and letting you divine shield twice earlyer in the fight. This means having a 20 percent damage reduce and cheat death for every single time you tank him can every other this is far far more massive than the value of spellwarding will ever be on phase 3 before even talking about its value in phase 1 and 2.
each to their own. we normally use them on 3-4 shatters in. Example of when he is ravaging with a shatter to blow us away or to keep it further away a moment in ravage to have more distance on shatter. They are just used for more positioning area without the tank needing to take extra damage and allowing the raid to take minimal damage. It is nice seeing the raid only take 10-15% of there HP after hand. Then i just taunt to reposition. Its kinda like when you tank Kryxis in SD if you get at 80yrd range quickly you dont drop balls. and ignore the mechanic.
P1 and P2 I take no damage and barely with my partner tank. so that reduce Ardent CD is really not necessary its actually overkill. I even tank Ramornia 100% of the time. There is literally no damage. as long as you dont get hit by massacre and ardent wont save you from getting knocked off. Those are the only 2 ways a tank would die.
its how we do it. we just sleep during P3. Something else you Dont want to do is tank Ramonia and Sire at the same time. I do it everytime and i dont fall below 90%hp. Ive seen others try and fail. I get away with it because i have Ironblood and 80k+ shields before i have to hit Celestialbrew.
As said using final stand for shattering shows you don’t understand the fight and your class:
Using divine shield without final stand is EXACTLY the same thing but you have weakened yourself to do it as he is already fixated via the effect itself. So you are taking a talent making you lose another one for no gain to do exactly what you can do without it.
So no not to each there own. One is clearly worse than the other.
Spellwarding same thing using on a pain to reduce the scorn damage on a shatter is a complete waste as not taking spell warding and using bop would of been a greater amount of damage mit as the main damage in that int is physical while you gain ad.
So again not to each his own again a clearly better way to do the same thing.
Using spellwarding for scorns also makes no sense as even if you did you would than not take spellwarding use ds on skorns and bop the pains you where divine shielding to the same effect bit with again more ad casts AND more wings casts
So no not to each there own there is one that clearly is worse to do met the same end.
As said extra ad and wings in phase 1 and 2 is a bonus my comp just looking at phase 3 alone already shows taking final stand and spellwarding is not only worse but detrimental weakening your toon vs giving any gain. As such the build that is not only better for phase 3 but gives you significantly more dps, healing and survival all fight is not a to each there own thing. It’s a lack of understand of your class thing.
Taking final stand on a single target fight without it having a clear use is already bad but than going as far to give up bop to gain an sw for what could use ds to handle that mechanic anyways only to use ds where the bop you gave up not only would do but do better makes no sense. As now your cool downs on not only divine shield is longer but so is ad and wings. As such you have only weakened yourself significantly to no gain.
I had to look it up. its hand of destruction. Sorry. Like i said i am sleeping during phase 3 and its all the same RED. Guess my stupidity proves my point on how easy that fight is.
If your talking about using final stand on hand of dis your making even less sense than you said before. As just a normal fixate from taunt would keep him on you long enough to deal with a hand so once again a waste of a talent, while using a ds there would make even less sense when it’s as easy as steed out other tank taunts. Esp as you said you taunt after anyways to pos so your using what is one do your most powerfull cds in place of a movement CD when the raid is moving anyways so no real gain.
While yes not moving out via using them can have value but recommending giving up not one but two of a tanks major cds just to not use a movement CD is not a good thing esp if having issues with the fight. As a tank you should be prepos before the hand being able to run out to where you want after the hand so keeping the boss still durring it is not really a factor esp not one worth two major cds. Using the major cds where you said in your other post was more correct in fact the way is recommended to many just with bop and ds being used not sw and ds.
you’re probably right he just handles the second half of P3 himself. It could be a EGO thing.
Thanks for the analysis. You guys know way more about pally tanks than I do at the moment and this dude was a pug so things like his covenant I don’t really have control over.
But the fact you tanked Remornia 100% of the time and still took less damage. That is some valuable analysis and shows he took way too much damage.
Only thing i have to say is dont expect other tanks to do the same thing. It’s a gimmick i can do because i am Darkiron with a racial that is on a 2 min cooldown that actually refreshes during a boss fight compared to kyrian potion. Ramonia also drops her own stacks during massacre. I also hit mild defenses during mirror transfers when i have sire so i dont get smacked.
other than that it’s really just avoiding junk on the floor. Hope that helps on when to hit CD’s and when tanks needing to swap.