They’re not that complicated, though.
Every time you complete a bountiful Delve and use a key to open a chest (aka every time you open a bountiful chest), you get one Radiant Echo. So, one Key = One Echo.
You can use one, or five, of those Echoes to engage in a brief event quest during which you kill enemies and complete small objectives, and at the end, you’re awarded key fragments and some valorstones.
What is complicated about that? Use Keys = Do Echoes = Get More Key Fragments/Valorstones.
Don’t forget, Delves are part of ‘world content’ so tying them back into world quests and events is the expected behavior.
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yes, its not that bad at all, the last tier im not sure about havent tried it yet
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so why not just give the shards in the delve chest?
Or remove the keys altogether and just have 4 bountiful delves a day with bountiful chest in them?
The extra steps of collecting the echoes and then finding a time-limited memory and going to that to then trigger a multistep event to get shards to build keys to use in bountiful delves is what I mean by unnecessarily complicated.
It’s gating, pure and simple.
tedium to drag out the content.
I get it, you like it, but it’s still 4 more steps than needed unless you’re worried about engagement metrics.
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“Go to place, do thing” is not as complicated as you’re trying to make it sound. It’s a giant ball on your map and it only takes like 5 minutes to do lol
Why are you making it seem like this big, complex system when it’s really not that?
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why aren’t the key shards just in the delve chest then?
Because that’s not how it’s designed? Idk, I like being able to save up Radiant Echoes and cash them in for extra keys when I’m in the mood to open a couple of extra chests.
Just seems like an endgame loop they’ve created to tie world content and delves together as a system to build more keys. Devles > Echoes > Shards > Keys > Delves
I don’t think that’s a bad idea in and of itself but I think the execution is pretty underwhelming because the nature of the quests is boring. I’d rather the rares around the world drop a few key shards than these boring quests.
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this is what I mean, it breaks the content loop to add extra steps that aren’t intrinsic because they want to force a change of behavior. if that’s your thing then you’re in luck but it’s poorly executed in my opinion and feels like nothing more than busywork but if you are a wow lifer that needs to play dozens of hours every week, well there you go- ‘content’.
I started doing the world soul memories with friends. We got 264 points with 4 ppl.
I had a three man group last night and we cranked it. Ended up with 179 key shards 200 something valorstones on a 5x echo.
Also! Exploit early and often! lol, the world soul memories yesterday were in the AK zone so you can use your general bombardment ability etc and they wipe out mobs for you so easy.
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This is the best option.
There’s no need to make us grind for keys.
They are just wasting our time to keep us playing but it’s not fun at all.
I hate when these companies sacrifice fun for play time, because it doesn’t make me want to play more. It makes me want to stop playing altogether and most of the time I do.
Nobody wants to do chores inside a video game.
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Wow players seem to want to do chores, the idea of fun per hour appears to be foreign to them.
This system is peak Blizzard design and they use it often.
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Yes they want things to do and they don’t care what it is, as long as they can spend time doing it.
It’s unfortunate and it’s the reason a lot of the game is designed the way it is.
People need better standards.
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I feel like placing a few coffer key shards in the curios would be a great change and at the end of non-bountiful delves, because as it is it feels like there is no point in running non-bountiful or opening curios
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I went into a memory solo. Used a 5-echo option. Ended with 130 coffer key fragments (a whole new key) and a bit over 250 valorstones.
So, seems like the Echoes are the best way to get keys for delves once you exhausted your free keys from the first four weekly boxes.
what’s weird to me is you don’t do WQs for Mythic Keys or play BGs to unlock Raid wings.
But Delves have lockouts on lockouts on lockouts.
Bountifuls are already limited availability per day, having limited coffer keys and limited methods to get coffer keys doesn’t seem like a system that’s going to last the expac or else Delves aren’t going to be an evergreen content pillar. This is where the borrowed power system went, and you will be able to get more keys easier much later in the season because…sub numbers.
And if they’re going end up pulling the ripcord on coffer keys, then it’s just gating.
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5 echoes for 1 key is terrible though.
You are only getting 1 echo back at the end of a run after using 1 key.
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but what else are you doing with echos?
and where else are you getting keys after the basic ones that are available? the WQ that awards 1/4 of a key isn’t much to be excited about.
numbers vary a lot. a friend did a 5-echo last night and got like 280 fragments!
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130-200 basically if you crank it hard af. Also I read they disabled the new popup boss in tier 8 delves, but when it was active and dropped it’s large claw for you to loot, it also gave you an echo 
But thats still only 2 keys.
The point is youre going to eventually run out of keys completely.
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