A) Torghast only flopped according to the forums and streamers (a very small percentage of the players)
B) Torghast only flopped with everyone else after the stupid e-sports changes.
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But isn´t the complaining about M0 because of gatekeeping? It´s not in LFD yet, is it?
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No heaps of thr forum complaints are its too hard. Just like the mage tower release complaints, apparently vision complaints (missed those apparently) I mean we even have people complaining the follower dungoens are too hard (search for them they exist). That subset of players will complain no matter what.
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No. Here’s a couple of the bigger “M0 is too hard” threads.
While I had been saying since SL alpha that Torghast was incredibly boring, I never understood the hate since you got everything you needed in a handful of runs and didn’t have to go back until the next tier came out.
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And you are the ideal. Unfortunately most people came back to forums and had a hissy-fit at the fact that they ‘had’ to do it at all. And all the while I knew a crap ton of people who would run around Torghast for fun … no rewards needed.
The only time I heard people complain about it was on the forums and from streamers (I don’t watch streamers but the hear-say was that they all complained about it). Everyone else was either you, “Meh it’s not fun but I can get it done quick and walk away” or people who enjoyed it. At least until they put in the timer and stuff. Then everyone hated it.
I actually liked it more with the version 2, with the Box of Things and the scoring system.
That’s a step counter not a timer, and from the ones I’ve done in the Alpha it is exceedingly lenient and basically just stops you running laps around the rooms.\
All I hope is that delve gear rewards hold some parity with the difficulty of other content pillars that offer similar rewards. I hope they’re fun, I hope they’re varied, I hope they’re interesting and rewarding, but as progression I hope they also… you know… progress…
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You have over 37,000 cheevo points and over 31,000 posts here in the forum. You are absolutely an anomaly in this game, not the average player. So it should come as no surprise that you consider some content trivial that the vast majority of other players consider difficult or annoying.
If you are living and breathing WoW your experience will be very different from the casual weekend warrior just out to have some fun now and again. When devs create content geared towards folks like you, they do so at the expense of literally everyone else.
If Microsoft/Blizzard intending to make a profit, they need to gear these games towards the majority of paying customers, not the .1% elites.
Bottom line, if delves are to succeed they cannot be be designed for for the thin air crowd at the top - they have to appeal to everyone.
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My full opinion on delves: I’m gonna play them. If I like them I’ll keep playing them. If I don’t like them I’ll stop playing them. Simple as.
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How do you feel about the void airship then?
It will depend on how difficult it will be to defeat all delves at the highest level? Is that something attainable over time by anyone who really wants it or is it out of reach to anyone except the highest skilled, most dedicated players who do nothing but play wow everyday.
If it’s the equivalent of a gladiator mount, well that’s not going to be something players can work towards.
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Given delves drop champion track gear at level 8, I’d hope level 8 is comparable to an M0. Then we go up from there. Final level is 13 I believe for that achievement. So what, a solo experience equivalent to doing an M+ 10?
Probably something similar to Shadowlands Mage Towers.
Going to be difficult to balance that. High defense / Self heal specs I would think will do better than glass cannons.
If it’s going to be that difficult, I hope its for a fun reason like the bosses have interesting mechanics that are enjoyable to play with and not a bad reason like everything is timed.
Torghast’s biggest problem was that it was boring. I literally fell asleep twice playing it. Them adding a timer didnt actually help that.
What does this mean, take over for M+? M+ is still going to be highly popular and engaged with.
I’m bracing for the whining for sure. “Delves are too hard”. “I want delves to be easier”. “Delves aren’t rewarding enough I want Mythic ilvl stuff from easy solo content.”
I’ve literally seen people who are like, “yeah I want the best gear in the game without challenge, so what” and I’m just like… you can’t engage these people. You literally just can’t engage with them.
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There’s no timers in Delves. It was just the only content I can even draw some comparison for.
And that doesn’t surprise me either. My ‘everyone’ comment was an exaggeration based on anecdotal evidence
Everyone has different things they enjoy. What kills me is when the loud minority can’t understand that their opinion isn’t indicative of every person who ever played the game, and is often the opinion of a small minority of players.
I’m sure there are a number of people who enjoyed Torghast V2. It just wasn’t something I, personally, saw many people say. Heck … there were things about it I enjoyed, like the box. It gave a progression/reward system to something I enjoyed doing anyways. Timers and scores have a place. But, for the most part, for non-competitive content it just leaves a terrible taste in my mouth.
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Depends. Brann can tank for you and if the majority of the damage / difficulty comes from mechanics it won’t necessarily favour anyone.
Yes. This will be a thing.
They are also very tied to warbands pretty heavily so we are entering a space where Blizzard isn’t insane to imply “bring this class or make one if you really care that much about it getting easier.”
But yes, you literally can’t build a tight challenge that glass cannons can solo that a role agnostic group of self reliant solo specs won’t run over. And that’s ok.