I mean, that’s one conceivable path to take. It also strikes me as the laziest and most boring one, losing all your stuff just to get it back in the end.
Personally I think holding 4/5 out of 7 kingdoms is pretty solid. They don’t really need the rest.
Point of Clarification.
Dalaran is allegedly neutral.
Gilneas belongs to another playable race
So does Kul Tiras
Just want to keep things precise. Carry on.
Kul’tirans are still humans, as are half of Gilneas. Besides, Blizzard’s been quite backbreakingly clear about wanting to view them as still humans that are merely inflicted with a condition.
Dude, that is literally your entire point on these topics. You’re so extreme in your anti-Forsaken rhetoric that they can’t even be allowed to exist. And if that means deleting them entirely so that what amounts to the status symbol of Lordaeron being reclaimed (to flex that human potential) … so be it. Lordaeron and Alterac are dead human Kingdoms. Let the people still living there make use of them.
I’m trying to be conservative about my approach to this, especially regarding the Worgen, which attracts a different crowd.
And the only reason any of that is the way it is is because Blizz is too lazy to invest the assets needed to give them both back (or give the Horde something of its own to let them participate in Legion). Frankly, “Humanity” is on the cusp of reclaiming FIVE of SEVEN Human Kingdoms into the Alliance … with only Blizz’s own lazyness getting in the way of that. Not the Horde.
If you object to an arc that takes the form of “pushing back against adversity until you triumph over it” then I have bad news to tell you about most fiction.
I don’t care whether or not they exist, actually. I care mostly about where they exist and I’d like them to exist in a place that doesn’t create massive amounts of stupid BS in the story.
They literally just got Stromgarde back. That’s the first human kingdom all other ones came out of. Lordaeron is not the ancestral land of Stormwindians nor even humanity in general. Forest trolls lived there before humans conquered it.
Go play TES Online if you want a fantasy world overwhelmingly dominated by humans. Only there it works as their human nations feel like they have a real history and culture. As opposed to every WoW nation but Kul Tiras. Which has references to 80s movies and architecture straight out of a Playmobil castle toy set.
The humans of WoW are terminally boring and it should be considered a blessing when they’re turned into undead or werewolves.
Rokhan should’ve won Arathi. :<
I object to arcs that are about dealing with the loss of something and how you can move forward despite it, and then ending that arc with “actually you don’t have to move on, you can just have the thing back.”
Not sure Lordaeron is exactly a point of conflict anymore, considering the literal heir to the throne is now undead. Unless Blizz BS’s her kid back, or makes Anduin Arthas’ secret love-child … that kingdom is dead. And reclaiming it at this point (after like 20 years after the survivors have resettled) would only amount to a “Status Symbol”. A way for Humans to stroke their egos … more … by pushing all the locals out.
I think you might be a bit confused about the character of my post here.
If we start including other playable races and other territories that are allegedly neutral, the scale of humanity’s grip over the World of Warcraft is even crazier. But I’m not introducing those elements (until Fojar starts doing so to another playable race) to show that even if we remove easily contestable matters, Fojar is still asking for one playable race to completely displace another, and have far and away more exclusive territory than anyone else.
Outside of the effect on a potential Forsaken story, I kind of wish the ‘secret son’ the scarlets have was actually her daughter; seems like it could be an interesting (if generic) story for her specifically.
observes endless shrieking on the forums about the Forsaken losing Lordaeron
Yeah the Horde definitely isn’t an obstacle here
Humanity did move forward. It found new allies, renewed its bonds with old ones, sacrificed massively to defeat the Scourge and the Legion. It incorporated new tactics, it evolved as a culture to accept things like Warlocks, Shadow Priests, and even Death Knights which would have been unthinkable prior to WC3. They got the assistance of Werewolves and Dark Iron Dwarves, and even Eredar. Everyone sacrificed massively to reclaim what they have managed to so far.
Saying that the arc is “you don’t have to move on you can have thing back” is a gross oversimplification of the human narrative from WC3 onward.
None of the things you said have anything to do with coping with the specific losses of the human kingdoms which is what we’re talking about. It’s just them doing unrelated stuff.
They are absolutely going to do something with her child btw
And what’s more, kingdoms are greater than just their monarchs and heirs. Like if Varian had also died in the fall of Stormwind you’re proposing that the logical narrative progression would have been for everyone to go “welp guess there’s no kingdom anymore, no point in taking it back.”
It’s actually been about 11-13 years or so. By comparison Stormwind spent about ten years destroyed or being resettled after the First and Second Wars.
As opposed to what you’re proposing, which is for the Forsaken to push all the locals out (oops they already did that lol) as a way to stroke THEIR ego.
Ahh, got it. And yeah, it truly is a bit bonkers. Like I’ve even willing to push for the Forsaken to move out of both Hillsbrad and southern SP (south of the Sepulcher) since both territories are contention points. And immensely difficult for them to hold should Gilneas finally be allowed to reclaimed. But, it never made sense to me that the BEs and Forsaken never took hold of the Plaguelands … if nothing else for join national defense. You add in the FTs (who’s problems are problems we need to find solutions for) and the Frostwolves in Alterac … there are truly a lot of indigenous populations in that top 3rd of EK.
That sure is a lot of people to displace for “Human manifest destiny”. Even excluding the BEs.
The entire human arc from vanilla to WotLK was about them regaining their balance and holding back the Scourge in Lordaeron. In WotLK the Alliance attacked Northrend specifically in Lordaeron’s name in order to defeat the Scourge once and for all. In Cataclysm the Forsaken filled the Scourge’s power vacuum and renewed their continent-wide rampage against humanity, inadvertently prompting Gilneas and the Worgen to rejoin the Alliance to combat the Horde in the region. The Argent Crusade immediately began to revive and resettle Lordaeron for the living.
There was an armistice for a few years and then BfA happened when the Forsaken were fully pushed out.
You’re correct in saying that the entire Alliance arc wasn’t specifically centered on the human kingdoms, but the human arc absolutely was.
Because the Plaguelands are extremely dangerous and what parts aren’t held by the Argents have historically been held by the Scourge. And after WotLK the Argent Crusade seized control of most of them and they have a stated goal of reclaiming Lordaeron for the living, making their goals incompatible with the Forsaken’s. It’s still an open question whether or not the Blood Elves even fully control Quel’thalas yet as well.
There are plenty of reasons, with the Blood Elves and Forsaken both being relatively weak being the biggest among them.
Ah yes, notable indigenous groups in the Eastern Kingdoms, Orcs
I think if you were going to write a fantasy that revolves around medieval warfare, you should know a thing or two about the weapons used.So yeah, I would 100% assume Dave Kosak did his research about archery before taking on writing a character who uses archery as her primary weapon.
It’s also common knowledge that you don’t waste arrows like you would waste bullets. Wasting any ammo in hunting is unproductive.