[Warrior] Arms and Fury both need help


#81

Curoar you should go try GW2 warrior (free2play) then come back and compare to Wows warr design.


#82

Ooooooooooooo on my college is at I iKk


(Drezwazluz) #83

Literally the only trait keeping arms somewhat relevant in raids right now, lets remove it. Absolutely genius.


(Drezwazluz) #84

Thinking outlaw is the best dps spec is adorable.


(Varrow) #85

I mean, for M+ right now it is absolutely arguably the best spec. Still a damn good one in raids too.


(Drezwazluz) #86

Dh, UH, balance, ele, etc.


(Juggs) #87

That’s only because numerically it works. I was talking about how it feels, not how it’s tuned. My point was Gathering Storm is much more intuitive in the context of Arms warrior’s kit than Test of Might is. The fact that it’s optimal to use your only real damage “cooldown” outside of your damage window just goes against the design or fantasy of the spec.


(Drezwazluz) #88

See, feeling doesn’t have anything to do with tuning or design, and is thus pretty pointless. Case in point, ToM is actually pretty popular among some circles, I know a few of the boys that abused FR and rend in Legion like ToM now, doesn’t make them or you wrong. Does make asking for the one trait that keeps arms somewhat not worthless at high end play to be removed extremely silly.

Why. It literally just takes your damage window, and extends it. Makes it bigger.


(Varrow) #89

Yes those classes are certainly good, but you don’t see them like you see Rogues on the time trial rankings right now.


(Juggs) #90

How a class feels to play has everything to do with design, how could you say it’s not. You can’t say ToM is popular when it’s numerically the best choice at the moment.

You mention people that abused something in Legion. I’m sure people would like something that’s overpowered. The playstyle of Arms lately has been playing around your CS windows where you can do the most damage. The point I’m making is that you want to use your big abilities and would want that big strength buff inside your CS window, not after it falls off.

It’s always better to stack CD’s, Buffs, Debuffs, etc and is the reason things got out of hand in MoP. So the fact we have a 45 second CD that makes a burst window, but we end up not using our damage CD, and gain a bunch of strength outside of it, makes no sense.

It would have made alot more sense to have the ToM build up and when you get the strength proc that’s when you CS and do huge damage in a window. The problem is they don’t have something to tie the ToM trait to other than CS/WB.


(Drezwazluz) #91

How did you get that, from this. Do you know how to read?

You’re right. Just a bunch of parse hungry elitists. They don’t have any actual preference or tastes. That’s why they still are playing arms in this god-forsaken raid. Because they only care about overpowered things.

You know this is closer to what arms in Legion was, right? Higher uptime on damage windows? You had close to 100% uptime on CS. What is there to play around with that, or have big abilities inside it? It was just a constant passive.

MoP? What? And no. It might feel better to you to stack stuff in your damage window. But a purely subjective stance is not reason to design flaw when it is far from a unanimous take.

This, as a result, doesn’t make sense. You’re saying, it makes more sense and feels better to stack your CDs. But ToM is a larger boost than the CS window. So why does it feel Counter-intuitive? Because the name of the ability is different, that boosts your damage? That doesn’t really make any rational sense.


(Juggs) #92

We’re never going to agree or see each other’s point so I’m done with the conversation.


(Palaceknight) #93

Would be nice if we got some sort of acknowledgement of how currently under-tuned our dps specs are, especially Arms.

Arms:

PVE:
More so what is concerning to me is that on top of damage being under-tuned Arms could use some help to make the rotation more fun.

I absolutely loved EP since its inception in legion, it also was in large what kept us competitive in Single target damage. I found it extremely odd that it was completely removed and no serious consideration was done to correctly adjust the spec to be competitive.

Though to me EP was something that made the spec more rotationally fun to play in the execute phase, gave us a unique niche role that was effective on progression fights (albeit with reasonable execute phases). The loss of EP made the spec instantly less fun for me to play and realistically is something that should be baseline to the spec. The general consensus from feedback on the forums seems to agree with the notion that EP was a positive addition to the spec.

I wouldn’t mind seeing some improvements to the rotation outside of execute phases as well. I am not asking for the spec to be as spammy or gcd locked as Fury, but Arms currently has some glaring and jarring moments of down time that doesn’t feel fluid or fun.

The spec definitely could use a baseline proc to shore up the rotation and help with how linear the current rotation is. Sudden death would be a perfect candidate for a baseline proc (or even crushing assault, however I would drastically prefer sudden death).

The current version of rend doesn’t feel rewarding or fun to use. It has a super high rage cost for damage that doesn’t feel noticeable or impactful.

We have no control over our rage generation outside of Skullsplitter which pigeon holes us into selecting it for PVE content. This is why sudden death should be made baseline and a new talent that can compete with skullsplitter should be implemented

PVP:
From a competitive PVP perspective we are also severely lacking:

  1. Our survivability, and self-sufficiency is non-existent compared to other melee classes/specs

  2. Our damage is no longer as threatening as it used to be considered we have devolved mostly into damage bots

  3. Our utility/cc leaves a lot to be desired compared to other melee classes/specs

  4. The skill ceiling of the class has been drastically eradicated and there is nothing special a warrior can really do that makes them desirable to a 3s team or even for rbgs.

The spec has completely lost its identity and needs some serious consideration and improvements.


(Bobbydígital) #94

would it be terrible if BS and DR enraged us as fury?

what about recklessness granting enrage? lotta overlap with RA talent there however.


(Varrow) #95

Reck and BS make the most sense. BS because of the duration and it would just open up the usability of the attack. Reck because at least the GCD would do something.

Even with RA, it would still shorten the GCD cast of Reck, auto attacks, dots, whatever for that downtime as well.

As a single GCD ability I think Dragon Roar is fine as is in that regard, but it would be cool if DR had a bonus of some sort during Enrage I think.


(Sy) #96

The fury AoE cap needs to be reworked. A 5 target limit absolutely blows in big add fights, and bladestorm hits like a wet noodle. Make it a fall off percentage.


#97

“Lasciate ogne speranza , o voi ch ’ intrate”


#98

I just want to know how many times have they seen more than 5 healers in a
BG, cause I can barely find one if I’m lucky :rofl::joy::rofl:


#99

Still waiting on some love from Blizzard to save class balancing in this game.

In order to push IO score, I had to reroll to prot to even get invited to any high keys. I honestly think the best way to bring fury back into the game is to bring back shockwave baseline + remove fury AOE 5 target cap. This would honestly be a great start to us at least being able to keep up with other classes in any form at all.

I’m sure they read this thread but as an avid fury warrior player myself, I have been checking the forums/wowhead everyday for some news or acknowledgement that DPS warriors have been getting the short end of the stick and that improvements are in the works.

Just the acknowledgement alone would keep me going but developers just keeps ignoring us.


(Bobbydígital) #100

with recent articles talking about making talents that aren’t picked more interesting, I am very excited to see what the team has in store for talents like frothing, deadly calm, dreadnaught, cleave, fury’s massacre, meat cleaver and ravager.