Warlock Suggestions - War Within

Classes Warlock
21

Because Dev reason, who’s knows. These devs contradict themselves so many times it’s damn right frustrating.

They have literally have done this with other classes where they stated they added to the class tree because all 3 specs could use it.

But nope not warlock. And some of the reworks, you can tell they put time and effort into making them and trying to think of new fun things.

Like why exactly does destro’s spec tree still have about 15!!! two points nodes. When they are creating reworking some trees with almost no 2 points nodes or so many 1 point nodes that you can spread points to some liking.

The other issue I’m noticing with the warlock spec nodes is that whenever one of the two points nodes gets changed to 1 it gets nerfed by half or some large portion yet I didn’t see this happening some of the other reworks. Hell!! soul conduit was made into a 1 point node with the power of what seems like 2nd row talent as a CAPSTONE!!! That 5% soul conduit is not a capstone power node nor was soul conduit ever exciting.

Making it to the point where our CDs are so lackluster that we have things like naked tyrant builds around is not what id call great design. Making it where some night not even talent into tyrant because of the horrid mess for the demo tree structure isn’t either. Ignoring doom which sat in the middle of the entire tree for demo for an entire expansion also not great.

We got our tier set as a nerf version of it that we have to activate as a capstone (to include multiple nodes make it work) that seems that the dev try to treat it to compete with tyrant :rofl:. Yet unholy dk got their tier set full power as a 1 point node at the 4th row easily accessible.

Destro got a terrible exchange for no damn reason too. Worse a nerfed version of a shadow lands ability.

This dev then goes to hide tyrant behind a node no one would want for aoe. To me that just tells me the individuals were just moving random stuff over the tree with no care whatsoever about how it works which also explains why we’re getting the myriad of passives x damage stuff that does nothing for the gameplay feel of the spec, to include the effect rng dogs core procs has on ENTIRE demo tree.

For some reason, some classes/spec, barely get any thought out into them. Our dev team doesn’t even think about the mechanics of destro/demo before they come up with something that seems to not work with the entire spec tree or specs mastery.

Guess what happens after their mishaps we have to deal with it and they just start increasing the damage of regular abilities because they messed up. Like the whole hill and valleys, this could be done right but not when the person/people behind do no have any love for what they are doing or what they are working on.

Like I don’t get it, how do you rework ret, dh, monk, fire mage and then come up with this for another.

22

Based on the conversation here, I did make some changes to my proposed suggestions…

Which were all added to the original post, including a change to Grand Warlock’s Design, its original effects made baseline, Dimensional Rift becoming a passive involving Ritual of Ruin, Eradication and Ashen Remains becoming 1-talent point nodes, Rain of Fire being made baseline, Flames of Xoroth instead granting a 2nd charge to Conflagrate, AND the following Demo talent to replace the ‘Summon Doomguard’ I mentioned earlier in this forum thread.

Demonic Discord

Shadow Bolt and Demonwrath have a chance to sometimes summon a Soulkeeper for 6 sec at the enemy’s location that pulses for Chaos damage.

Implosion has a lower chance to summon a Soulkeeper, increased for each Wild Imp imploded.

Now, the big edit here, is instead of explaining all of that (since I edited it into the original post, I’m gonna delve into the abilities and talent interactions with the permanent cooldown pets! :smiley:

Darkglare (Affliction)

  • Eye Beam: 2 sec cast, 40 Energy, 40 yd range. Deals Shadow damage to the target, increased by 10% for every damage over time effect you have active on them.
  • Seize Magic: Instant, 20 Energy, 40 yd range, 15 sec CD. Purges 1 beneficial Magic effect from an enemy or 1 hostile Magic effect from an ally, and if an effect was removed from an enemy, reduce the target’s movement speed by 50% for 15 sec. Grants Darkglare 60 Energy if an effect was removed. Autocast: Cast upon master when they are unable to cast spells due to a Magic effect.
  • Optical Blast (Command Demon): Instant, 40 yd range, 30 sec CD. Blasts an enemy’s spellcast. If a spell was countered, prevents any spell from that school from being cast for 5 sec and reduces the cooldown of Optical Blast by 6 sec. Otherwise, silence the target for 1 sec if no spell was countered.
  • Shadow Lock (Sacrificed Command): Same as Optical Blast, just renamed.

Talent interactions with Darkglare:

  • Malevolent Visionary: Eye Beam deals an additional 5/10% damage for each damage over time effect present. Grimoire of Sacrifice deals 3/5% increased damage for each damage over time effect present (if Darkglare is sacrificed).
  • Dark Messiah (one of my custom talent, its a choice node with Grim Reach and changes Darkglare to instead freeze the duration of your dots while active): Eye Beam increases the duration of all your active damage over time effects by 0.5 sec. Grimoire of Sacrifice procs increase the duration of all your active damage over time effects by 0.1 sec (if Darkglare is sacrificed).
  • Grim Reach: Eye Beam deals the bonus damage granted by Malevolent Visionary to all enemies affected by your damage over time effects. Grimoire of Sacrifice procs deals reduced damage to all enemies affected by your damage over time effects (if Darkglare is sacrificed).

In short, Darkglare works like a Imp+Felhound!

Doomguard (Demonology)

  • Doom Bolt: 1.5 sec cast, 40 Energy, 40 yd range. Deals Shadow damage to a target. Applies Curse of Doom for 20 sec, causing additional Shadow damage every 20 sec it is active on a target, or if dispelled.
  • Destroy Magic: Instant, 20 Energy, 40 yd range, 15 sec CD. Purges 1 beneficial Magic effect from an enemy, and if an effect was removed, reduce the target’s movement speed by 50% for 15 sec, while also granting the Doomguard 60 Energy.
  • Shadow Lock (Command Demon): Same as Optical Blast, just renamed.

Talent interactions for Doomguard:

  • Nether Portal (remember, as noted above, Nether Portal in my wishlist became a passive when you cast Summon Tyrant, he leaves the portal he emerges from open, allowing you to beckon forth demons for his duration of 15 sec): 1.5 sec cast, 1.5 min CD. Opens a portal to the nether for 15 sec (it changes back into an active ability).
  • Dark Apotheosis (as noted above, I put this as a split talent with Nether Portal, replacing Demonic Tyrant, instant cast, etc): Instead of gaining Summon Doomguard, Dark Apotheosis is permanent, though instead of its normal effects it instead causes you to pulse Demonwrath around yourself while channeled, AND your Mastery increases your own damage done too. Gain Demonic Leap as an extra ability, as Dark Apotheosis is now a ‘stance’.
  • Ner’zhul’s Volition (My version was gain Demonic Cores when Tyrant/Apotheosis fades, and a Mastery buff for either X demons called during Tyrant, or the damage buff to Apoth lingering, but fading over time): Your Doomguard’s Doom Bolt has a 5% chance to grant 1 stack of Demonic Core. While in Dark Apotheosis, Demonbolt has a 5% chance to grant 1 stack of Demonic Core. Spending Demonic Core’s increase your Mastery by 1% for 10 sec. Multiple stacks can overlap.
  • Gul’dan’s Ambition (Mixture of Pit Lord summoning for Nether Portal, damage boost to Tyrant, and ability transformation for Dark Apotheosis. Also note, I removed Sacrificed Souls and worked it here for Grand Warlock’s Design users): Each active demon increases your Doomguard’s ‘Curse of Doom’ damage by 5%. Nether Portal still summons a Pit Lord at the end, and Dark Apotheosis continues to transform Hand of Gul’dan into Chaos Wave, and Demonic Breath into Carrion Swarm, but no longer causes Shadow Bolt to steal life from your demons for extra damage, and instead buffs the damage of your single target spells by 5% for each demon active.

In short, Doomguard is also like an Imp+Felhound! Its health is about equal to a Felguard’s though, and it’d be too long and complex to go over -every- talent interaction in the Demo tree due to my makeover to it, so I kept it to just stuff relating to Tyrant. Rest assured, in my wishlist, any talent specifically referring to Felguard was tinkered with to apply to all demon pets, with the sole exception of Soul Strike. Demo still get Felguard as a cool special pet, but you aren’t required to use it! :blush:

Infernal (Destruction)

  • Seethe: Instant, 30 yd range, 10 sec CD. The Infernal taunts the target to attack it for 5 sec, and increases its threat against the target. Autocast: Taunts the current target if it is not attacking the Infernal and taunts any target who attacks its master.
  • Burning Presence: Instant. Radiates Fire damage to nearby enemies every 2 sec, and increasing threat generation. Has a 40% chance to generate a Soul Shard Fragment. Autocast: Always keep this effect active.
  • Blaze Magic: Instant, 30 yd range, 15 sec CD. Burns harmful spells, removing 1 harmful Magic effect from an ally. Autocast: Cast upon master when they are unable to cast spells due to a Magic effect.
  • Meteor Strike (Command Demon): Instant, 25 yd range, 45 sec CD. The Infernal jumps into the air, assuming its meteorite form, and crashes into the target! Stunning and interrupting them for 4 sec, and knocking down nearby enemies.
  • Meteor Burst (Sacrificed Command): Instant, 45 sec CD. Release a powerful burst of flames around you, dealing Fire damage to nearby enemies and stunning them for 3 sec.

Talent interactions for Infernal:

  • Infernal Brand: Affects Burning Presence instead of Immolation Aura. Grimoire of Sacrifice also builds up Infernal Brand if Infernal is sacrificed!
  • Crashing Chaos: When you use Meteor Strike/Burst, it empowers your next 2 spells.
  • Rain of Chaos: While infernal is active, or if it is sacrificed, your spells have a 3% chance per Soul Shard spent to call down an infernal for 8 sec. These Infernals still trigger Infernal Brand like normal!
  • Lord of Flames: Every 15 sec Meteor Strike/Burst is off cooldown, it gains a charge of Fiery Command, and consumes all charges to summon that many infernals for 8 sec (still a max of 4 charges). These Infernals still trigger Infernal Brand like normal!

In short, Infernal is treated like a mix between Felguard and Voidwalker, with Imp’s burn magic and an AoE damage aura to boot!

23

I quit back in Cata and didn’t return until Legion so I didn’t recognize the collective abilities, my bad. Now they make more sense and I would prefer them in the class tree as capstones over what we have now.

Except for maybe the new capstone pact of gluttony but I have a feeling it might need to be nerfed.

24

Fair! My current 3 capstones are…

Master Channeler (Stole this bad boy straight from SoD Era)

Your Drain Life is no longer channeled, lasts 5 sec with a 5 sec cooldown, but costs 300% more mana.

Grand Warlock’s Design

See above in the first post for the edited version of it.

Soulburn (but expanded)

Instant, 1 Soul Shard, 6 sec CD. Off the GCD. Consume a Soul Shard, unlocking the hidden power of your spells.

-Demonic Circle: Teleport: Increase your movement speed by 50% and makes you immune to snares and roots for 8 sec.

-Demonic Gateway: Can be cast instantly, or your next use of it within 8 sec lashes enemies with nether energies, knocking them back.

-Drain Life: Gain an absorb shield equal to the amount of healing done for 30 sec. This shield cannot exceed 30% of your maximum health.

-Health Funnel: Restores 140% more health and reduces damage taken by your pet by 30% for 10 sec.

-Healthstone: Increases the healing of your Healthstone by 30% and increases your maximum health by 20% for 12 sec.

-Burning Rush: For the next 10 seconds while Burning Rush is active, you may cast 1 Warlock spell while moving.

-Amplify Curse: Your next Curse will afflict all enemies within a 10 yard radius of your target with its non-amplified version.

-Demonic Breath: Demonic Breath now deals Shadowflame damage over 6 sec, and adds 6 sec onto any of your current damage over time effects on the target.

You don’t see Pact of Gluttony because when I saw that, I knew what I needed to do…

Pact of Gluttony (Rank 2): You can use Healthstones multiple times during combat (only you though).

Its just a improvement for higher level warlocks, xD. They already nerfed the ‘Demonic Healthstone’ to provide the same healing as a normal one, the only difference is literally the fact Demonic can be used multiple times. So why not… just make that baseline? A rank 2 Healthstone you get at higher level?

Bonus 2 talents tho… Sweet Souls is now a split talent with Swift Artifice (instead of Swift Artifice becoming its own talent node)

  • Sweet Souls: Your Healthstone heals you for an additional 10% of your maximum health. Any party or raid member using a Healthstone also heals you for that amount.
    Soulstone restores 10% more health.
  • Swift Artifice: Reduces the cast time of Soulstone and Create Healthstone by 50%.
    Additionally, moving near an enemy’s corpse consumes their soul to reduce Healthstones cooldown by 1 sec, and Soulstone by 3 sec.

And another talent, a split node for Teachings of the Black Harvest (to keep symmetry, since I I kept Fel Synergy where it was, but made it a split node with Grim Feast instead!

  • Health Tap: Instant. Sacrifice a Healthstone in your inventory to gain Soul Shards equal to its charges, puts Healthstone on cooldown.
    -Sweet Souls: Health Tap also heals you for 10% of the amount Healthstone would have healed you for if used.
    -Swift Artifice: Health Tap also reduces the cooldown of Healthstone by 10 sec per charge on the sacrificed Healthstone.
    -Soulburn: Health Tap restores 10% health, and increases your maximum health by 20% for 12 sec.

Also, since it needs to be noted as well… Soul Conduit remains where it was, as a 2-point node for 10% refund chance, and Demonic Tactics was changed too for…

Increases the melee and spell critical strike chance for you and your primary demon by 5%.

Critical strikes done by you or your demon/Grimoire of Sacrifice has a chance to increase the other ones damage done by 2% for 15 sec. Multiple instances may overlap, up to 5 stacks.

Soul Link was moved to be a 2-point node, replacing Grimoire of Synergy as the Alpha build currently suggests.

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25

My gut feeling is that Pact of Gluttony may be nerfed or removed (if they ever commit to a serious rework) because of some big implications:

  • Combined with Lifeblood and we now have 15% leech for 20 seconds on a 1 minute cd
  • Combined with Soul Burn or Soul Harvester we basically have a personal Lay on Hands every minute

This is some massive healing. While Burning Rush did get nerfed and we might have to give up Demonic Fortitude (so we’re losing out on 5% stamina) it’s still an absurd amount of healing every minute imo.

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26

Absolutely, and here, this might help if I lay out the core warlock talent trees on my wishlist!

Banish and Demonic Circle/Teleport are baseline, Soul Leech remains baseline. Subjugate Demon and Ritual of Doom however, are no longer baseline.

Row 1 (Left to Right)

  • Fel Domination: Unchanged, but auto-known by Demonology.
  • Demonic Gateway: Unchanged, but auto-known by Affliction.
  • Burning Rush: Unchanged, but auto-known by Destruction.

Row 2 (Left to Right

  • Fel Pact: Unchanged, but 1 talent node for the 2-point benefits (a change I made in my wishlist like… 5 months ago, LOL, Alpha just catching up…)
  • Demonic Subjugation: Auto-known by Demonology, gain Subjugate Demon and Ritual of Doom.
  • Demon Skin: Unchanged.
  • Kilrogg’s Cunning: Auto-known by Affliction, If you cast Demonic Circle: Summon while controlling an Eye of Kilrogg, the circle will appear where the eye is located.
    Additionally, Eye of Kilrogg has heightened stealth detection, and can see invisible targets.
  • Fel Armor: Unchanged.
  • Path of Destruction: Auto-known by Destruction, Burning Rush allows you to walk on water, can be enabled while mounted, and does not damage you while mounted. Note. Hellfire (Destro Warlock passive from a talent) only triggers if you take damage from Burning Rush! Also extra note, the Soul Harvester talent that turns Burning Rush into a mini-sprint also just gives you flat water walking while mounted if Path of Destruction is talented.
  • Fiendish Stride: Unchanged (but another talent my wishlist beat Blizz to!!!)

Row 3 (Left to Right)

  • Curses of Enfeeblement: Unchanged.
  • Abyss Walker: Using Demonic Circle: Teleport or your Demonic Gateway reduces all damage you take by 5% for 10 sec. During these 10 sec, you can use Demonic Gateway once without incurring its cooldown, or while its on cooldown.
  • Howl of Terror: No longer has a target cap, like Psychic Scream. / Mortal Coil: Unchanged.

Row 4 (Left to Right)

  • Amplify Curse: Unchanged.
  • Demonic Embrace: Unchanged.
  • Demonic Inspiration: Increases the attack speed of your primary pet by 5%, and increases the chance for Grimoire of Sacrifice to trigger by 10%.
  • Wrathful Minion: Increases the damage done by your primary pet by 5%, and increases Grimoire of Sacrifice damage by 10%.
  • Fel Vitality: Unchanged.
  • Nightmare: When Fear, or Howl of Terror, ends, the target is affected by Curse of Exhaustion (this is in addition to your other curses, the movement speed reduction does not stack with Curse of Exhaustion). / Horrify: Your Fear and Howl of Terror can withstand 50% more damage before breaking, and causes targets to tremble in place instead of fleeing in fear.

Row 5 (Left to Right)

  • Foul Mouth: Unchanged, just using the older name, since it made me snicker.
  • Accrued Vitality: Drain Life heals for 15/30% of the amount drained over 10 sec, increased by 100% while below 50% health.
  • Sweet Souls / Swift Artifice (Both changed as noted in a prior post)
  • Gorefiend’s Escape: (New talent) Using Healthstone, or reviving yourself with Soulstone, resets the cooldown of Demonic Circle: Teleport. Additionally, Demonic Circle no longer disappears on death, only after you release spirit (Demonic Gateway already doesn’t disappear with death). / Impish Instincts: (Replacing the PvP Talent) Taking direct damage reduces the cooldown of Demonic Circle by 2 sec. Cannot occur more than once every 5 sec.
  • (Replacing Demonic Gateway’s location) Magical Appetite: Reduce the cooldown of your Felhunter’s Spell Lock by 4 sec if it interrupts a spell. / Spell Lock: You gain Spell Lock and your Felhunter loses it if Felhunter is summoned. Instant, 40 yd range, 24 sec CD. Counters the enemy’s spellcast, preventing any spell from that school of magic from being cast for 5 sec. While summoned Command Demon now causes your Felhunter to use its Devour Magic ability, and Grimoire of Sacrifice now grants you its Devour Magic ability instead.
    (Assume both talents affect Darkglare/Doomguard via Grand Warlock’s Design too)
  • (replacing Lifeblood) Soul Harvest: Using a Healthstone increases the rate you gain Soul Leech by 11/22% for 20 sec (for 30% of single-target damage done at rank 2). (Note: These numbers were when Soul Leech gave you 8% of damage dealt as an absorption shield. Since it seems to be 3% on Alpha, uh… I’d probably make it an extra 6/12%? For a solid 15% of damage done for 20 sec after using Healthstone?)
  • Greater Banish: Banish now effects Undead and Aberrations.

Row 6 (Left to Right): Totally unchanged.

Row 7 (Left to Right)

  • Ichor of Devils / Frequent Donor (Both unchanged)
  • Grimoire: Imp / Grimoire: Voidwalker (As noted, this works like Grimoire: Felguard, stored in Grimoire of Service, and the old glyphs which used to affect your primary demon now can be used on the Grimoire version to pick that version for that demon after you’ve learned the appearance for your barbershop main demon. This also replaces Socrethar’s Guile.) Imp burns 1 Harmful Magic effect from you when summoned, repeating every 5 sec if in line of sight. Voidwalker summoned this way more or less functions like Earth Elemental from shaman.
  • Grimoire: Felhunter / Grimoire: Sayaad (Same story as before, except Felhunter uses Spell Lock (like the now removed PvP talent that Demo locks used to have), and Sayaad uses Seduce. Replaces Sargerei Technique.)
  • Darkfury / Demonic Breath (Both Unchanged)

Row 8 (Left to Right)

  • Fel Synergy: Unchanged, except now Healthstone heals your pet for 150% of the amount it healed you. / Grim Feast: Unchanged, except its a split talent with Fel Synergy.
  • Demonic Tactics: Unchanged, except as noted in a previous post where it has some Grimoire of Synergy benefit.
  • Teachings of the Black Harvest: Unchanged, though to note, Darkglare/Doomguard via Grand Warlock’s Design both are treated like Felhunter, and Infernal is treated as an Imp! / Health Tap: As noted earlier, sacrifice a Healthstone in your inventory for Soul Shards.

Row 9 (Left to Right)

  • Resolute Barrier: Unchanged.
  • Soul Link: Unchanged from Alpha.
  • Soul Conduit: Unchanged from Live (though in the past, I debated having special effects for talents if you maxed them out, for Soul Conduit it would’ve been 1 extra Soul Shard slot for 2/2 ranks).
  • Demonic Resilience: Unchanged.

Row 10: Unchanged from previous post, its Master Channeler, Grand Warlock’s Design, and Soulburn.

As an extra note, ALL the node positions are pretty much identical to the live version, with some that should be obvious where they’re placed. Like Demonic Subjugation, Kilrogg’s Cunning, and Path of Destruction being directly below the starting talents, or Greater Banish being just below Nightmare/Horrify, and Gorefiend’s Escape/Impish instincts being where Nightmare/Horrify are currently.

Perhaps I’ll share my wishlist for the hero talents next. :stuck_out_tongue:

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27

FYI if you haven’t been using it already, I think you’d get a kick out of making a more visual tree with this tool. :wink:

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28

I may or may not have already made my Afflic, Demo, Destro, and Core trees with that program!

Edit: Though recent Alpha changes have made all of them somewhat outdated… and I’ve been too lazy recently to update that when I can just update my spreadsheet instead, xD.

29

Fair enough! I should’ve expected that lmao. Still, loving your work!

1 Like
30

I took the opportunity, with a new discovery I just made with how these forums work… to TOTALLY REDO THE FIRST POST.

It now includes the Core Tree, PvP talents, Affliction tree, Demonology tree, Destruction tree, Soul Harvester, Diabolist, AND Hellcaller!

ALL OF IT, NEATLY ORGANIZED AND NOT CLUTTERED! I am as mad as I am sleep deprived finishing it.