respekt you like challenging yourself by entering the most unfair BG against alliance
For Wintergrasp,
Add RP-GG to all workshops.
Add Bombs like IoC at all workshops
Some more info to show AV mobs need to be looked at:
75% of Vann’s dmg is being mitigated or absorbed with a tower still remaining (which reduces dodge by 10% as well as increases dmg)
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It was a severe disservice to the playerbase to not remove Wintergrasp from rotation until the time after you make any changes to help fix it.
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I disagree. I, and many others, do not want them to remove Wintergrasp.
Personally, I’m enjoy the extra challenge of Wintergrasp Offense, right now.
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There are certainly times that offense can be fun in Wintergrasp even when losing, but in the current setup, I’d say the only way that it would be fun would be if it worked like Strand of the Ancients where the teams were swapped for a second round with a time limit set to the winning time of the first round. Myself, I’d probably be happy with just that change, but I don’t think many people in the random epic queue would be happy with that kind of match length. I generally only join the queue if I have plenty of time, and I don’t leave any bg early unless there is some urgent in-life reason; however, a double-round Wintergrasp would probably have even more afk-outs than now.
The changes Blizzard has noted won’t fix the issue of many people on offense just running around unorganized and drowning themselves or standing in cannon or catapult fire or whatever they are doing, but until the devs implement those changes, they shouldn’t waste the time of people randomly queuing epic bgs by having Wintergrasp as a possible selection. I wouldn’t want it removed from direct queuing during the interim, but of course it’d become nearly impossible to get a game through direct queues most of the time…Since there’s no way to blacklist a battleground anymore, if you end up on offense in Wintergrasp right now, it’s a near guaranteed loss because the offensive team constantly bleeds players.
I think Wintergrasp is simply a tough battleground to balance while trying to keep it a single round. I absolutely loved doing Wintergrasp with a good group of people in Wrath, but as a single-shot battleground, it’s just too defense-favored. I’d like it changed into a 2-round system, but that’s extremely unlikely, so I think it would have been nice if Blizzard could have hotfixed it out of the random epic rotation—leaving it for direct queuing and wargames still—until they make the changes they plan on making.
I do really hope the changes they do end up making helps balance out the battleground, since I do want to play some good matches of Wintergrasp. I am glad some people are getting enjoyment out of Wintergrasp offense now, but with the sheer number of afk and drop-outs per match on offense right now, I hope we get this balance pass sooner rather than later.
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Besides the imbalance issues, the other problem with Wintergrasp is it’s just too complicated of a bg for a group of random pug players.
It’s not like Ashran where you just teamfight in mid, or AV where the objective is obvious (“kill the boss”). Lots of players in Wintergrasp just running around randomly/running in circles, afking on their mounts, or just mindlessly following the pug in front of them.
I don’t see this changing with the patch. It was never designed to be a battleground in the first place, that’s probably where most of the issues stem from.
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I just got my IoC mastery today. I got 50 wins in the last month by exploiting the fact that glaives are very weak. I was able to run in, apply all my bleeds (with 2 buttons due to pvp talents), die, rez, then run back. I could single handedly defend IoC by myself even when the glaives are heavily guarded.
Glad I got my ach now, I won’t be able to do that anymore with these changes.
i dont agree that its too complicated, all the epics basically require someone to call things out and lead, the issue with wintergrasp is people dont want to follow, most pugs consider it lost before it begins so pug teams never have more than 5-10 people trying to win. it doesn’t matter how hard or how simple a game is, if only 25% or less of your team is even trying, you wont win.
I know this is really late, but I keep forgetting:
Please fix the line of sight issues with the RP-GGs in Wintergrasp!
Man, this is just super frustrating. Sometimes, I’ll be on the same plain and keep getting the LOS error… Then, sometimes I can be behind a mountain and shoot one off. I don’t understand! It’s especially bad if you are on a tower/wall and trying to shoot. Whether or not it will seems to just be a coin flip. o.o
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Hmm - most ppl know that Glaives has been a losing strat but enough Alliance are so glued to it that it usually splits the team leading to the almost inevitable loss. If you read some of the posts on it you will see that horde players love it that Alliance go glaives or split strats. Doesn’t that fact that Bliz have buffed glaives make it obvious that the hangar is/was the winning strat? The same applies to the inevitable woods/mage tower rush that alliance seem to always do - it leads to a (usually) 20 point lead for horde that you never get back. Bliz is putting resources more central - that says a lot about that one too. The biggest problem with alliance losses in these BGs is the inability to change tactics and the stubbornness of many glaive/woods rush addicts who split the group. Regarding Wintergrasp Offense problems - just get rid of the rank prerequisite for building vehicles altogether. Defense already own the keep - that should be advantage enough. And yes Sunken Ring is much closer that BT to the turrets in the keep - I could never understand why so many alliance continue to rush SR via the north road under those turrets.
Lini is a horde plant/spy - he shows up under some alias in every one of these BGs to fool Alliance players into going docks so hordies have an easy win with the hangar.
OH great some changes, but, they dont fix a real problem in Ashran. The horde mage has a knock back and the ally mage does not. Either give them both the same ability or remove it.
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The knock back has been removed, these are just out of date notes.
https://us.forums.blizzard.com/en/wow/t/905-ptr-changes-updated-march-4/875072
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How are you folks enjoying the changes?
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Is Ashran more winnable for alliance?
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Is WG more winnable for the attacking team?
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Are WS and docks more comparable in value to hangar in IoC?
No.
No.
Unfortunately it doesn’t seem their changes have had much of an effect on the offense vs defense winrates. Defense is still winning most of the time, if we’re talking a pugs vs pugs game.
I was in a defense loss yesterday, but Shadowblades was on the other team and he is very experienced on the map. He was probably with a few of his buddies, knowing his pattern. He was probably raid lead too, if I had to guess.
Hangar is still king from what I have seen so far (a bunch of docks losses). Looks like it’s still “business as usual” in IoC.
So far the patch has been pretty uneventful compared to 9.0, I did see a few miniboss summons in Ashran, but that’s about it.
I just won offense as a level 38 (I’m leveling a new alt). No premade, but I encouraged my PUGs to follow the same strat I normally do, and (most of) them listened. Semi-close game I admit (we would’ve lost if we lost all 3 towers at that point, -24 minutes), but it’s doable with no premade.
Much easier. Looking forward to playing Defense actually lol, since that might be a new challenge.
Theoretically, it SHOULD be, but from my experience, I didn’t really have probs countering Alliance.
Might merc a couple to see if I can win on Alliance.
Have to agree here.
I think the docks changes just make people focus glaives HARDER (as in, it’s more urgent to kill glaives), so less people ignore glaives, and more people kill glaives.
People seem to have “adapted” to the change quite well, from what I’ve heard (not seen. No IOC battles yet on my end yet).
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The reality is an extra ~40k health on a glaive thrower just doesn’t matter that much versus geared DPS players. That’s what… 3-4 extra globals?
The underlying issue is that vehicles can be destroyed, but the airship can’t. I’m not sure what else can be done outside of redesigning/overhauling the bg. Maybe add a “mechanics wrench” PvE item that can be used to heal vehicles? I don’t know 
Since we’re on this topic, demolishers still wreck them too.
I’m in the process of testing a new IOC strategy that MAY make Docks/Workshop more viable.
Details coming soon.
Bad news: It MIGHT be Horde-only, while Alliance CAN do it with a bit of luck.
Will you be streaming it? Interested to see what you have in mind…