Thought he couldn’t find a raid group to play his warrior on. Now he has a OT backing him up? Which is it. He’s unable to play the game or he has a group of people sitting here stanning for him?
Why do warriors need to be better than every other tank? I thought this was about fixing the warrior issues not making them BETTER than other tanks. This is the issue I have with your logic and his. You aren’t satisfied with warrior’s working, you need them to be better than other tanks to push them out of spots despite them already being the most represented tank in the game currently.
Ideally every tank has some sort of reason for existing. Previously Warrior tanks had the advantage of being a Warrior when Warrior DPS weren’t that great, so they gave the tank group battle shout. Now Warriors are the best DPS class, so why would you not just want to bring a Warrior in both the tank group and the melee DPS group? It reduces the utility of the Warrior. Without bringing Battle Shout to the table, ideally Prot Warrior would have some reason to exist, but I don’t know if I would say it does in this current patch.
It’s just a worse tank. Which is what it is I suppose, I doubt we are going to get anything major in terms of balance changes.
Warrior has some threat issues right now, and the rotation is clunky/weird. it’s pretty clear that the cohesive design from some of the previous phases set bonuses fell short this tier.
But they are currently the most played tank by a good margin and they still do solid damage for a tank right now.
Like as far as general functions they have every requirement to work as a tank, they aren’t failing or missing anything at the moment aside from some minor threat issues with Ashbringer players (even I have issues holding over ashbringer warriors right now and I am near full bis prot paladin).
The issues with their group based buffs exists for all other tanks. There are no tanks that bring a unique buff that another of the same class that’s not a tank can’t bring easily.
The progression based rogue and lock cheese on the hard bosses was nerfed. Now, whether they should get more nerfs is another matter. But it’s hard to point at their standing then pre-nerf for warrior status post nerf.
I think this comes down to a perception and isolation. They are a “worse tank” in the mind of some people looking to make specific fights in SE easier. I mean, they aren’t suffering an issue so badly they are being pushed out completely as a tank class for overall raiding. They show up quite regularly in top speed runs for SE. They are missing from some of the progression raids, but we already went over the issues from rogue and lock tanks, and how they got nerfed (as well as the raid also being nerfed).
I just find these statements of “Warriors are the worst tank, there is no reason to bring them to raid” a very tone-deaf ultra high parser mentality that doesn’t really match up with the reality of what most players are doing. And I don’t find that catering to the top 1% of players to be a great way to balance a game that is ultimately not meant or designed for that 1% parse mentality.
Because that’s not the purpose or point of SoD. People don’t generally approach the game from a standpoint of hyper optimization and imo that’s what killed retail for me and many other players. If you want that level of gameplay go play in retail.
Except that’s not what I said now is it? What I said was, despite there being deficiencies in the class, trying to balance it around specifically the ultra high level optimization of an extreme minority of players is a mistake.
Rend needing a rune to scale is simply bonkers.
Our -3 rage cost rune is also something that shoudn’t even exist. Could’ve been changed to something actually meaninful at this point of the game.
The Dragon rallying cry is also a meme when you can simply get a better version from runecloths.
Warrior (tanks) need quite some changes to make them somewhat desirable in raids.
Just because warriors are “highly represented” doesn’t mean they don’t have their issues.
Protection Warriors are known to have threat issues and lack luster utility by most raid leaders.
I’m not asking to be the best tank, but raids genuinely feel like they’re shooting themselves in the foot by bringing a protection warrior.
Casual Tank Warriors are also struggling, I’m sure you can ask any of them and they will tell you that they mostly don’t main tank at all and they even struggle with picking up adds when taunt is on CD.
I’m not sure how to say I’m not the top 1% despite my parses. My guild is legitimately a semi-casual 20 man and we don’t run parse strats. To be honest my rankings probably come from the fact that no guild in their right mind will accommodate for a Prot Warr to main tank every fight.
Definitely not what I said. Warriors being the most represented class counters this claim that they are so useless as to be a detriment to the raids. Every class/tank has their issues, no class is perfectly designed.
Again we keep saying this, but work with me here. If this is true, if this is the mentality of having a warrior tank, it doesn’t bear out in the data. They are the most represented tank at all levels of game play and even see themselves being the most represented tank in speed runs alongside feral druids. This specific argument is one we will never agree on and feels like complete hyperbole.
Our raid has a warrior main tank and the only time he has ever mentioned anything is about how I have better threat then him on cleave targets at 4 or less. We’ve talked about the threat issue before, and the mutual thought for us is warrior lacks on the first 5 seconds of the pull and after that he’s golden and I have a hard time catching up with him unless I pump everything into it.
It comes from your ability to play the class and your gear. Look, we both agree that the rotation for prot warriors right now feels off and that their threat is a bit low compared to other tanks. And we’d likely both agree on solutions or fixes to those. I just don’t agree with this repeated rhetoric surrounding how weak/useless they are for raids considering their representation. Even perception wise this should show up in the data overall.
Important to remember that this is a baseline multiplier too, so it will interact stronger with abilities that inherently generate more threat like shield slam. So smaller increments will have more impact than you might think.