Man, with this logic I hope the Alliance plows through some Horde zones killing civilians, then just drops a void bomb on an entire zone killing everything. Oh, also all those souls get sent to a horrible zone of Void to suffer.
The Horde can save those people, but all that evil stuff gets scapegoated onto Anduin and he becomes the enemy we need to kill. Meanwhile the rest of the Alliance, who backed Anduin and supported him, gets to away with everything and is just talked down to for being evil and mean, but other than that nothing bad happens.
The Horde can just move on from that knowing that Anduin will be killed because he and HE ALONE, was responsible! I’ll take that.
Yes I know, I was just going with him for the sake of the Alliance leader being the big bad. Actually, I guess if this happened next expansion Turalyon would be the big bad. So just replace Anduin with Turalyon.
I will still take that deal. Wreck the Horde and get a finger wiggling afterwards saying how mean I am, sure why not! It’s better than constantly getting your teeth kicked in and told the ones who did it are just misunderstood and won’t do it again.
You’re missing a fair number of points, such as an entire expansion and more demonstrating your faction’s moral ineptitude, military incompetence, and general inability to get their own affairs in order, losing to inferior numbers of the enemy, losing every battle that occurs after your initial atrocity, and then helping the Horde raid your own capital while you then take a complete back seat in the next expansion and have no story whatsoever while the Horde and its themes are celebrated, their righteous and perpetually justified anger pushed in your face at every turn.
Also added to the fact that 9/10th of the roster would die in most humiliating ways. And not the ones hated like Anduin, but the ones loved the most like Tyrande and Malfurion. Some off screen in a book, by your own faction to make it worse. Some by a mook’s spear. Some by your own leader and that leader leaves. Thus making your own faction irrelevant. Also have media songs touted as the best like Warbringer Jaina repeat over and over how evil and despicable the Allliance faction is.
Moral ineptitude means absolutely nothing. The Alliance has the moral high ground but what does that get us? Literally nothing.
Military incompetence? The Alliance gets wrecked in War of Thorns and then goes complete idiot mode in the war campaign. Not to mention we are following an 18 year old KID! Don’t get me started on how stupid the Battle of Dazar’alor was, and then to stop the attack afterwards instead of pressing it and winning the war… again incompetence by the Alliance.
The Alliance can’t get their own affairs in order, look at the Dwarves, they had to have Human Potential Varian do it.
Losing to inferior numbers, that makes the Alliance looks like chumps. We had to rely on Saurfang, who LED the attack in the War of Thorns up until Teldrassil, to help us win the war, without him the Alliance is done because they are incompetent.
I’ll give you losing every battle, but I think this was meant to split even with the Horde winning the Barrens and Silvermoon warfronts but those got canned.
I am fine with the Horde raiding an Alliance city to stop a tyrant leader (who everything bad the faction does gets scapegoated onto) and then taking the backseat the following expansion. And then being told we were bad for doing what we did.
I would take that over constantly getting your teeth kicked in the most awful ways AND then when we go to get retribution we are told, “No no, they didn’t mean it. It was just that one evil person. The Horde is just misunderstood they won’t do it again…” plot twist: they do it again
You can also have Anduin, Jaina, Malfurion, Turalyon, and Genn get killed off if the tables were turned. That’s fine.
We have that now. His name is Anduin and he leads our entire faction for stupid reasons. Because his daddy lead even though the High King role (which is stupid) isn’t hereditary.
This exactly. He’s been forced down our throats since MoP and has been at the forefront since then even though the majority of Alliance players hate him.
You keep twisting these points out of recognition.
Moral ineptitude I’ll grant you, that’s mostly a “grass is greener complaint”. But you pass by how, in losing the War of Thorns, the Night Elf civilians inflict a far superior 8:1 casualty ratio on the Horde military and the Horde wins through some ridiculous “smuggler’s path” content pacing nonsense. You kind of undermine your own point here - the Alliance is smacked with the stupid bat because if they weren’t they would have won in patch 8.1 due to their overwhelming superiority.
Raising the point of the Dwarves, what, ten years on? That’s kind of weak. Hardly compares to two civil wars within… six years? Seven? Civil wars which we twice have to accept Alliance aid to sort out? That’s the point I’m making - not just “Horde raids Stormwind” but “You help the Horde raid Stormwind to kill your own leader.”
I seriously, seriously think you overestimate the “satisfaction” of the War of Thorns. One brief, heavily controversial two weeks of victory followed by a steady two-plus years of losing everywhere while the foundation of your faction’s story is shattered. You would have to end up with “Why does the Horde let the Alliance exist? I guess it’s because Blizzard can’t write the Alliance out of the game, kek” to approach parity.
Exactly this. Horde win in the end on this premise alone. They can/have done horrible things to the Alliance, and the Alliance is never allowed to retaliate, and at this point the only logical thing (from a story perspective) for them to do WOULD BE dismantling the Horde, but that can’t happen because the game is built on a two faction system.
The Alliance gets screwed TWICE because they can’t win the war. The Horde can start it and do severe damage, but just when the Alliance is about to win Blizzard comes in, like a parent, to tell us, “No you can’t do that.” because it is a two faction game.
Instead the Alliance is told the Horde will change. They won’t attack us again and commit genocide. Nope. Just forget everything they did before and accept it. So the Alliance looks like complete idiots who are just like that John Mulaney joke going, “OKAY!” when we are told to forgive and forget everything the Horde has done.
Can we stop arguing false dichotomies? Both situations were terrible for the Horde and Alliance.
I promise you, Dard, you like it now but you would actually hate that scenario if it actually happened to you. And Jellex, being a punching bag isn’t fun when you’ve been there, done that.
Let’s stop resorting to " who has it worse" like some d- measuring contest of the Story forums, yeah? Both of you would most likely complain if the tables were turned, and with good reason.
Your faction wasn’t the one who were made fools out of at Undercity, or the one who had an entire zone burn to the ground because we sent our army off to Silithus. You’re not the only one who is presented as incompetent. And we are presented as idiots to boot.
What’s the point of this, if it’s never allowed to be acted upon? It’s just blue balls. I’ll bloody pass. Or rather I wish I could.
This is stupid and I don’t understand why Blizzard thought it would be a good idea. Why subject the Horde players to Tyrande again, especially after BfA? If anything it is borderline OOC for Tyrande because at this point she should want to lop the Horde PCs more than trust them.
Similarly, why does the Alliance PC have to deal with Bwonsamdi? He is cool and I like him, but why does he talk to me as if I didn’t totally try to kill him in the BoD raid? It’s jarring and stupid.
Blizzard really should have made the Ardenweald campaign split for the Alliance and Horde. Like both factions do the first 3 chapters or whatever, but then Alliance does the Tyrande stuff while the Horde does the Bwonsamdi stuff, and then both factions converge back to do the last 3 chapters or whatever for the campaign.