Yes and no, I really only use the tier list as a pseudo place holder to see how the landscape is playing out for class and spec design as well as where the direction might lead to, hence thr metaphor I used on someone else sitting on the couch watching a tornado come roaring at them.
But there is one thing that is really REALLY hard to overcome and thats player perception. If youre running m+ and are trying to oush into 8’s but have a half decent io score but only have run 6’s that comes down to player perception.
Think of it like this, if you have the skill to run 9’s but only have run 5-6 and try to sign up for an 8. Then the one saving grace outside of io score or gear or any if that is how the generalized concensus would be about how effective or well the class is compared to others
Well, despite your opinion on arbitrary placement of classes, it is just that - an opinion.
For you to say with such certainty that you deserve placement over another class simply due to your own disliking of the class says to me - “This person focuses too much on overall generic class placement and interjects his personal feelings and takes offense if a particular class is generally performing better/worse.”
To me, that’s setting yourself up to always be disappointed. It’s almost like getting offended at sunny weather because you happen to hate sunny weather. Lol.
How is this inserting MY personal feelings when YOU asked me what classes I would move to the bottom and why? Yiu…you asked me that right here ---->
I said where I wiuld like to be especially given ret pally hasnt had a track record that spans years long where it really wasnt anything more than middle of the road…that isnt feeling thats a statement backed by facts
I didn’t really foresee your reasoning to be “I don’t like this class.”
Like I said, arbitrary and setting yourself up for disappointment. Just pointed out how being so sensitive to your placement is going to lead to disappointments. Even in kindergarten, there’s a line leader and a caboose. Everyone takes turns, even 5 year olds.
Your own statement is arbitrary though, just cause there is a leader and caboose doesnt mean its the same person consistently every time like it has been for ret paladin and thats how its been for literal years.
Shadowlands: started off strong for 3 weeks then nerfed so hard you could barely run higher than 16 keys cause NO ONE would risk it.
Dragonflight: Could barely survive getting hit and our defensives were mediocre at best till the rework which gave us time in the spotlight for 12 days then nerfed right back into mediocrity
Edit: Your own theory of there “always” being a leader and follower seems to stem from your reliance on class balancing changes that happen and normally this would be true except for the dragonflight expansion which brought to life the existence of “God Comp” which reigned from S1 all the way to the first month of S3
Survival Hunter. Ret is not the only class that gets tossed. (Ret and Survival do have the most consistent time spent out of top 10, whether it matters is subjective.)
Is that ok? No. Is it happening? Yes. It won’t change unless majority of Ret Paladin mains and Survival Hunter mains ditch the game. Money talks the most, unfortunately.
That is the sad truth and one thats worse is a lot of wow players suffer from “game freak syndrome.” Game freak is the oublisher that leads to the development of the pokemom series and they could put out a god awful pile of junk, slap the word “pokemon” on it and loyalists will buy it up.
I did manage to quit world of warcraft before back in 2022 to play FFXIV during the shadowlands SoD era so who knows what TWW will have, though I am hopeful about my place for improvements
Blizzard should do better at giving different specs a moment in the sun, yes. But without homogenizing the classes, there will always be a “better” and “worse” option.
Do whatever you want. I just was pointing out how getting riled up about placement will always lead you to this same place of frustration.
Saying that Rogues should be downgraded because you personally don’t like them is wild though. It seems like you’re taking this all really personally, so I’m going to just leave it. Good luck.
I did go on a hiatus a while myself, pre SL. I came back in hopes of things changing in TWW and honestly, I’m happy with what I see so far. A lot of much need QoL updates over expansions, Warbands is huge for myself, etc. Blizz seems to be doing better in the Balance department overall, Beta after the most recent changes there, has been pretty solid for classes in general as far as no like horrible outliers on either spectrum.
The problem you presented isn’t a matter of player perception on the class balance though. That’s just players having to decide between guessing if the player has the skill but hasn’t done it yet or if they have been trying and haven’t had the skill for it.
Player perception comes in when you’ve timed keys 4+ levels above what your applying to but people don’t trust your spec.
This is why the title of my thread is a “concern” rather than an all out declaration of war.
Your second comment about me taking things personally when my “personal opinion” of who I would put at the bottom and you not understanding that is kind of wild in and of itself. Again, im looking at a numbers trend and where they are pointing to and going “hey we should do something about this” instead of having it come out, be a mess and having to correct it
Rogue is still a problem child in pvp, my own personal bias rearing its ugly head is id pereonally like to see rogues nerfed so hard the class isnt picked for anything at all ever. But even I know thats not realistic so im happy to give them their time in the pvp spotlight even though rogue and mage are 2 of the strongest pvp classes to date
