there were times a 5 ilevel upgrade from wf kept someone who got a weapon 3 times off of a boss keeping it from giving it to someone who has tried for a month to it and wasn’t lucky. with master loot the second time it dropped it would’ve gone to the other guy. example pulled from the forums during bfa.
edit it having leech on it makes it untradeable as well, fyi.
I think they are stuck in their bubble and do not have a great cross section of what wow means to different players. Ion specifically starts with the game he likes (which maybe it is the core of wow) tacks on systems around that… its why things feel janky.
A table mission that had no thought about progression put into it… “we dunno it works in the end”… a crafting system that requires casual players to buy 2 wow tokens to afford the base item for a legendary (as the crafting of higher ranks is gated well outside what they have access to farm/craft)… M+ loot system that mimics the old roll dice roll system we had prior to personal loot.
I will say there is something screwy going on with M+. I hope it gets addressed because it does suck for some to get 35 anima. Someone worded it as a pittance for doing a m+, which is a great word for it.
That only applies to non-pug groups.
wat
just spend a saturday picking herbs
ML is not for pugs though. it should exist for 100% guild groups only. in legion before it was forced personal loot almost all pugs were personal loot anyway.
“gO sTaRt yOuR OwN pUg iF yOu DoN’t LiKe IT!!!”
It’s the science of this game. More people join groups than make them. If you give leverage to group makers to own everyone’s work who you’ve consented to join your group, and you have the power to walk off with all the loot and even if someone works harder you don’t.
Look at Classic. Classic is the perfect example of why Master Loot won’t work in a modern system.
Classic is full of 30 year old dudes in basketball shorts who abuse Pugs and funnel gear to their alts or people they sell runs to in Discord for real world money.
It’s a toxic cesspool of gamers having accessibility to too much power to abuse other players and cheat the system. On paper it sounds good. It only benefits a minority of players, the ones with the power. Of course it works for them. They’re the ones who are taking advantage of it. What about the intentionally lower ilvl plebs you’re consenting to invite that you know won’t be doing high dps so you farm their work? lol Blizzard aren’t idiots.
i got my legendary shoulders for 600g on the ah. but i have to do more torghast and lfr before i can craft them. 190 is fine. even the 235 is 35k on my server for my slot though.
The sequel Buff Necrolord
Except you can’t control that, which is exactly the the problem. Making ML only available for 100% guild groups is literally impossible. (That has never happened btw - pug groups did use ML)
Master Loot may have been designed for guild groups, but there is nothing limiting it to only guild groups.
That’s only in guilds with a loot counsel. I for one do not join loot counsel guilds as they are only good for world class mythic raids. But you have the option to not join that guild. My old guild before it fell apart had really good rules that were very fair.
Veteran raiders got 1 veteran raider loot roll per raid, and you had to say you wanted to do a vet roll before any rolls took place. You could only /rand on the first loot roll if it was main spec roll and you needed it. After that anyone could roll, off specs, alts, etc. If an Alt was asked to come to raid you got to roll as a main. If no one needed then it you could roll for xmog.
except it isn’t. in legion it was for like 80% guild groups. did you even play? or is the ML booyman really causing that much distress that you can’t understand they already had the system in place?
It should exist for Heroic and Mythic difficulties only. Perhaps only Mythic difficulty since those are the players who have the most to benefit from anyways.
Not Pugs either. Guild groups only.
I agree this wouldn’t be a bad system then. It removes the potential for abuse and negative experiences which is what Blizzard knows happens with ML objectively on a macro level.
Why? If you can get guild perk rewards for guild only runs than you should be able to have a Guild Master Loot perk.
That’s under the assumption that everyone will play everything perfectly with 0 mistakes. Statistics don’t play this game, people do. This is a whole other issue with the game that I see as well, but that’s another thread. It’s being addressed because the min-maxers are really mad about covenants but again this for another thread.
i can agree to that as well. casuals who pug aotc shouldn’t get to dictate how progression raiders handle their loot. it’s ridiculous.and i’ve only been carried through heroic when i’ve done it. i’m no raider. i’m just not selfishly trying to control how people better than me play.
So let’s say a guild only needs 1-2 people to complete a roaster.
So they invite them to the guild…
and then kick them afterwards.
The idea of attempting to add any ML that has zero chance of ending up in a negative experience is literally impossible.
And that’s coming from someone who liked DKP.
A veteran roll for one raid tier, or each time you got together to raid? Cause if it’s the latter 
Because you can invite and kick people at will from a guild.
Meaning “guild runs” could still include random pugs and you can’t do anything to control that.
Exactly and who wants to carry an under geared player when that player can not be funneled loot easily? It will take months for that newbie to get gear via personal loot. Once you are in progression 3/4 the way through a raid you can’t bring in a fresh Mythic Zero and think he’s going to help the raid, no, he’s going to get carried for weeks.