I disagree. The roll that happens really takes me out of the equation, I don’t get a personal roll, it’s rolling on all specs in addition to the overall drops. To be clear I’m not against them adding this as an option, but I really think it’s going to be hard to get a pug to sign up when the lead is using this loot option. I guess I can’t see what is wrong with the current way things are done. It has worked fine for all the groups I’ve been apart of. Besides, we don’t gear out of raids anymore right?!??? lol.
Well, the easier option would just to be let people trade gear they get regardless of the ilvl upgrade.
This is assuming that there are others that will also want that item, or if you’re in an organized group that it’s not a bigger upgrade for you than others. You’re basically assuming all worst case scenarios, which you would also have to apply to your personal loot comparison. You can also target your rolls on items rather than being eligible for items you don’t want, which obviously has an impact on what items you get in guild groups.
If you are applying this loot to a pug, it’s probably bad. But in an organized guild? It’s definitely better.
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And that suggestion has been made repeatedly, including by myself. Blizzard has elected to ignore it and give us this instead.
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I mean people are getting to basically max ilvl outside of raid within ~two weeks of making a new character, so idk about that last sentence.
But what people are doing ITT right now is implying that being able to get more items is always better. Personal loot as it stands results in a lot of wasted loot/you getting items you don’t want that go to loot council anyway/etc. In a guild setting, this group loot will allow you to target your rolls and in most structured councils will result in you getting more optimal items for you. The raid as a whole will benefit more because you can target bigger upgrades to people more effectively.
If you are “unlucky” over and over and over, you will need upgrades more. Naturally, a loot council will see that and reduce eligibility on items you need. The goal is for the raid to get stronger.
I don’t see why they can’t let us just opt into it, silly.
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I’ve been in organized guilds that used loot council, addons, DKP … did not enjoy it at ALL and sat by watching all the drama that happened with those systems. Not interested in going back to that.
Loosening the trade restrictions was ALL they needed to do. I’m ultimately exhausted with Ion and his “I like your ideas players but I can make them better” and then it turning out to steaming pile of manure that just creates more problems.
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Their not bringing back master loot, what this seems more like is their simply removing the restriction of not being able to trade loot due to Ilvl. To where the people that get the drop loot it, and then can trade it at their will and desire. Which I think is a fine system to have, yet ML is gone and is going to stay gone. That’s simply never going to come back honestly.
Okay, but you joining bad guilds doesn’t mean good guilds should suffer. There are thousands of good guilds out there. Drama kills guilds in this day and age; there are more guilds that need players than there are players that need guilds.
After the first few weeks, a large majority of loot gets “masterlooted” anyway. This is really just removing the initial few weeks of wasted gear that people can’t trade.
I think that blade cuts both ways, all guilds are good until they are bad and this adds in a layer that can turn good guilds bad.
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And it’s hard enough to find a pug raid that’s functional. Good luck finding one now.
This just isn’t really how things work anymore. Loot could be abused today if guilds wanted to; nobody is taking items they get an instantly equipping them and using personal loot as justification for it. If an item is tradeable, they trade it if they don’t “win” the item. Nobody is freaking out over it. Loot honestly doesn’t mean much to most raiders. Most just want to do whatever makes the guild stronger.
Just feels like people don’t really understand how guilds currently operate in these threads. You get showered in loot in today’s WoW. The concept of stealing items/reserving/etc doesn’t even really make sense anymore; there are no items that are such massive upgrades that ruining guild morale would be worth the tradeoff. Especially since, as I said above, there are more guilds looking for players than there are players looking for guilds.
Does no one ever stop to think that if you roll on the loot and win it, if the roll appear on your screen, it will appear in your bags and then YOU can choose what you want to do with it?
This is NOT master loot, at most it is like the NBG/group rolls of classic being brought to the modern game.
The only way loot can be “ninjad” in a group loot setting is if one who does not need the loot, and does not intend to trade the loot, rolls and wins.
Here is the last bit that seems to be going over some heads: we don’t know if the new set up will be useable in pugs, which could still be forced PL.
All that people want is the choice on both how to distribute loot and what to do with it when they get it. Those who think forced personal loot is the way to go for ALL groups might as well just say “I am an idiot who thinks everyone should play my way, even if it kills off parts of the game”.
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This will have literally no impact on pugs because pugs will just continue to use personal loot, just as they did the last time both loot rules were in the game
Running into the situation when people got a technical upgrade that didn’t need was very low in the grand scheme of things.
Running into the situation where the guild leader tries to game the system by funneling all the great loot onto the people who do the most damage (because their spec was favored by the Blizzard gods) is incredibly high.
What a fantastic solution for that thing that randomly happens at a really low rate…replace it with something that ALWAYS happens.
LOL like they will balance things correctly so that random classes and spec’s won’t be sacrificed to the guild’s NONO list. LOL maybe they will fix the loot boxes. LOL maybe they will fix the drops, so you don’t get your needed gear the last week of raiding in that dungeon. ROFL!
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Citation for both of these needed. And neither situation should happen at all. You cannot justify guild groups getting screwed when they genuinely want to help one another when you can take personal responsibility and leave a toxic situation if one presents itself.
Your right, neither situation should happen. However, this will happen with what I perceive to be the current plan of just slapping on a “do you want to switch master looter on button”.
This is not a creative solution it’s merely a move backwards without addressing the established problems.
And you just tried to handwave obvious problems involving personal loot by saying “well they don’t happen that often”. Spoiler alert: someone getting screwed once is one time too many.
And multitudes of solutions have been proposed. No loot trading restrictions in guild groups, for example. Hiding personal loot acquisition so no one can see what you got that way if you wish to volunteer your loot, there’s no pressure. So on, so forth. There’s been loads of compromises presented so people can help their friends, which in an MMORPG, should be paramount.
Nobody cared enough though. If this is the solution we’re getting? Bout flippin’ time.
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If it appears for only one person, that could be an issue, if it appears for the whole group and it comes down to a vote, and the majority wins, what is the issue unless people just click yes without reading?
Sure it is
No one can ninja. Yiu will still get to roll on loot.
This is a great change for organized groups. Pugs can still. Use personal loot.