Wow is and always has been nothing more than a competitive cooperative raid sim coupled with the need to step through a leveling process once every 1-2 years. There is no replacement. I used to be able to indulge only the pieces I wanted to. Now they’ve shifted away from that. I don’t care what you think of that opinion or the fact that it used to be the way I stated.
Yeah, the NGE killed it, if you played it you know how awful it was. They removed classes that people loved, removed the skill tree system similar to what WoW did, and added Jedi as these over powered anyone can play class. It was awful. The original was incredible and I would play it again in a heartbeat if they re-released it. Taking the complexity out of the game, removing player choice, and making everyone equal no matter the effort they put in doomed that game.
This is why I quit. Fantastic line. Take note Bornack.
Scratch that, the whole post is spot on and perfect. It is how I feel about the game.
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So because gear may be invalidated by a future expansion or raid tier 3-6 months down the track you are saying it’s ok for it to be irrelevant instantly also?
Really? So are just going to go out and say if you don’t like WF/TF you have a mental condition ![:clap:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/clap.png?v=6" ":clap:")
Just because you fail to understand an effect of something does not mean it is no applicable.
I’m fairly confident Blizzard knows that they can use it as a treadmill to encourage people to play more and more (you know, unhealthily) since there is always the potential for upgrades even doing the same content. So perhaps it’s for the Activision business model that it’s been around for 3 years (Legion was 2016 and upgraded items were capped at 6 ilvls until then)
So, the fact that I can get a 25 ilvl titanforge which makes all drops for that item slot irrelevant for not only the current content I’m doing but also the next few steps in my progression isn’t a drawback? Got it.
I’m not even going to go into it any further, because countless points have been made on this thread and you I can’t change the fact that you refuse to accept any opinion other than you own.
Also you say might have a tiny affect on world first? You mean like a guild clearing out multiple servers for 420+ BoEs from Heroic to claim world first? One of Method’s players was at 415 average ilvl when they first downed Jaina, that’s equal to the base drop from the raid.
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The game was hemorrhaging subs prior to NGE. NGE was a response to sub loss, it wasn’t what caused it. Followed by the week deadline to cancel and get a refund many people never bothered to give it a try. (Edit: not that I don’t understand this part, they made some drastic changes to the game to try to save it and pissed off the people who liked what they had). You do know that the game was alive and kicking, albeit with a smaller audience, until the release of SWTOR where the companies involved agreed to only have one SW mmo active. The NGE in particular revamped game systems to make it more like other games, which is what people were leaving Galaxies for in the first place. There’s nothing that indicates the game would have survived in a better state if NGE didn’t happen. But hey, nice rose tinted glasses lookback
well you feel wrong
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Hmmmm…Something doesn’t make sense.
My main has 60 WF/TF ilvls, my Druid (season 1 main) has 85 WF/TF ilvls, and even my Mage who I played for the first couple of weeks before raids/M+ release has 30 WF/TF ilvls currently equipped.
Not sure what’s confusing about those two statements. Mythic is 415. I have no gear from content less difficult than Mythic that forged to 415 or higher. When I looked at my character with the largest total increase across all gear he’s using, the forging totaled +50 ilvl across all his forged gear. What that means is that I have 0 pieces of baseline 400 ilvl gear that forged +15 ilvl to 415. I also have 0 pieces of gear that are 385 baseline that increased +30 ilvl to 415. I do have at least one piece of gear across all my toons that forged +25 ilvl, but that was a 370 to a 395 which, again, is not mythic level.
What exactly doesn’t make sense, besides your inability to do basic math?
But congrats, you have a character that the total impact is slightly more than a 5 ilvl increase due to forging. The inflation is staggering! /s
Edit: Are you intentionally pretending the sentence ended after the part you bolded even though the sentence actually ends with “to mythic levels”? Need a crowbar to get your foot out of your mouth?
It was losing subs, but not at the same rate it did when the NGE dropped out of the blue. The amount of people that quit and cancelled their sub exponentially increased weeks after the NGE dropped, compared to the months after the first CU dropped.
After about 3 or 4 years from that, it was basically on life support, so the point where the devs where just adding everything to the game that they said they wouldn’t ever add.
The contract for the Star Wars IP was supposed to last until 2013, but ended early because why prolong it, and also LA thought SWTOR was going to fix everything SWG failed on.
And it…didn’t. They tried to copy WoW with the NGE, then with swtor LA thought “Maybe we had a FAKE WoW copy, maybe a REAL WoW clone will do the trick…” and it didn’t. Many devs have since stated on public forums that they regret the NGE, but honestly, it was something that wasn’t 100% SOE’s doing, LA was pressuring SOE to do SOMETHING to fix the game, and when the NGE was proposed, LA said " Do it…". And pushed for it aggressively, so the point where employees got fired the day the NGE due to them expressing their opinions on the forums about how effed up it was to the players.
I don’t think you can simultaneously argue that titanforges are an important reward that provides progression for casual players, and that titanforges are inconsequential and barely impact character power in the end anyway.
Good thing that’s not my argument then, eh? You’re conflating different arguments I’ve made though it’s easy to do since the conversation isn’t just about forging.
Regarding casual progression, I’m talking about things that people have complained about like emissary rewards at 385, world bosses and warfronts at 400, etc. My point about forging is that it’s nowhere near as impactful at inflating ilvls as people claim. Those positions aren’t in conflict with one another.
Not sure what your point is. It was losing subscribers. NGE was an attempt to fix that. It didn’t work. The game lived until SWTOR. The end. Thanks for the longwinded repeat of exactly what I just said I guess?
The rate at which subs were declining was at a mostly steady rate. Then the NGE dropped, and the rate exponentially tanked. To say that there is not enough data available to count the NGE as a major contributor to the decline of SWG starting earlier than initially projected, is a stretch. I mean, the sub numbers were posted on the forums, and in other forums, it was pretty clear that the NGE caused the most sub drops within a short period of time throughout the entire existence of SWG up to that point.
to everyone claiming this is good for the game, its not. i.e wotlk cata tbc mop you pick. wow is at an all time low and the only reason its still making profit is the tokens. they literally making all the money the gold farmers used to make which made it worth all those bot accouts dying in sw spelling out their websites. cause and effect. tf has done nothing good for the game if I had to count the heads playing it. if wow was a Korean mmo, which is what its turning into… good luck with that. we can be the next wildstar… imagine with me for a second of your time. uldir is dead already why didn’t the entire raid titan forge to still hold some relevance. I can find legion raid but uldir is officially dead. and that’s bfa. mindboggling decisions and systems that just aren’t wow. what ever this game is turning into they need to turn around 180 style and turn it back into wow a north American mmo. im crushing down azurite cause the il isn’t high enough to make the poopy traits any good to me. that’s bfa. gambling addiction facilitators. that’s bfa. raiding almost has no purpose depending on the toon im playing cause all the azurite is horrid leaving me missing that tier set. a decent vendor, anything resembling wow and not this hybrid abomination of a Korean mmo.
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You’re right. They’re supposed to relay this information to the game developers. They work together. Good day. I SAID GOOD DAY, SIR!
I didn’t say that the NGE didn’t cause a decline in subs. I said and I quote, “There’s nothing that indicates the game would have survived in a better state if NGE didn’t happen.” And that statement is true. Nice strawman though. Feel free to swing back when you want to debate me on things I said and not things you make up to argue with.
Define “better state”…would more subs make the state of SWG better?
Ah I guess I mixed you up with another poster(s), my bad. That said, I mean, if TF isn’t an important part of rewards/progression then why would removing it be a big deal? At the least, people perceive it as significant.
My other issue with the idea that TF is inconsequential to character power (unrelated to your argument specifically) is that it does have a cap. Mythic raiders can’t get a lucky +20 forge on a mythic item. If Blizzard truly felt that TF had a negligible impact on character power, and/or were rare enough to not matter at all, then a lucky 430 piece wouldn’t be gamebreaking. But they do cap it, which says to me that they do feel that Mythic raids dropping lucky 430 pieces at the same rate Heroic raids drop 415’s would hurt the game.
It’s not that TF doesn’t impact character power, it’s that “potential to approach infinite power” is unacceptable but “potential to approach Mythic-level power” is acceptable. So the “remove/change titanforging” opinion is that the latter isn’t actually acceptable, either.
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Yeah, what was your dps before and now? You have some links to warcraftlogs to prove it?
Old Gear: 16k
http s://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/simulator/report/be3cc9a9055b4d239753e8c4139d3060
New Gear: 20k
http s://www.askmrrobot.com/wow/simulator/report/339c237f773b4ad0b67f93dbc4d1ad01
Difference of ~20 ilvls and ~5k dps. 5k / 20 = 250 dps / ilvl. 250 * the supposed unimportant 5 ilvl = 1250dps. 1250 dps / 20k = 6.25%. That is a TON of power and easily within the realm of a difference between pushing a blue parser into purple territory.
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