I’m making this post early (hopefully early enough?) to talk about more positive changes that can be done to MoP. This is one of my favorite expansions and I am absolutely hyped to play it again. That being said it obviously wasn’t perfect and one of the mistakes they made was thunderforging/warforging. If you have played WoW in the last decade im pretty sure i dont have to tell you just how loathed warforging (and later titanforging) was by the community. Please remove it from MoP, you dont even have to give us an alternative if yall dont have time to cook up something new. We could get some sort of earnable token in ToT or SoO if yall want to keep warforging around but either way I think it would just be a MASSIVE win for the classic team to get rid of random warforging.
Give this feedback around Phase 3.
As much as I hate all the clamoring for everyone’s individual wants for changes of a classic xpac, this is the one change I’d be all for. That system is the worst new feature that was ever implemented into the game in its history.
Personaly I think warforging has the benefit to keep players playing longer for gear which is one of the reason many like gdkps as they give them a reaso to keep raiding even when fully geared. They will also make it so you can keep getting upgrades if youre stuck on a boss.
And at least it’s not as broken as titanforging which can reward you with an item better than the next difficulty of content which for me breaks gear progression.
It’s not a perfect system but I dont think it’s all negatives.
Nah see blizzard hit us with that same exact excuse for literal years and the playerbase never stopped hating it. We told them its okay for us to hit BiS, for us to be able to reach our goal. Not being able to was frustrating and getting a piece (particularly weapon or trinket) and having it not warforge was more frustrating than anything. Im not accepting the old broken logic used to defend it that the stubborn blizzard eventually threw out when they finally admitted they were wrong.
Im divided because Id rather have rng than have deterministic grind as long deterministic as grinds like those are rarely more fun, I would probably be curious to see how players would react to warforging again when for me it still worked to keep people interested longer. I probably dislike the upgrade system personally more than warforging.
The reason they gave back in the days was to promote 25m.
Contrary to OG, people actually left 25m because 10m was just more “chill”. So they added thunderforging, which has a significantly higher drop rate in 25m (not only statistically, they said it has higher drop chance), to “save” 25m from dying.
However, that point doesnt exist anymore in Classic.
Im not agaisnt 25m having advantages over 10m, for me this is reasonable as long as 10m experience is still fun and that gearing in it is decent. Bonus rolls will make 10m a bit more equal to 25m so Im not agaisnt this if this was the goal.
I’m not against the idea itself, it just needs RNG protection. People who put in the time and effort should not be shunted by poor RNG
Maybe they could make some sort of new item for Valor that can be used to upgrade a piece of gear to whatever-forged. Serve double duty in making forged gear less RNG reliant and keeping VP relevant
Id personally rather the randomness be gone entirely but this would be a decent middle ground
No man it’s literally all negatives.
Artificially and at the expense of people that already have bad luck. It just feelsbadman like 99% of the time. There’s a reason the system is gonezo in retail.
Yea for another system which extend artificially game time as unless it simply drops then it’s mostly artificial.
Rng is something that has existed for long in rpgs and unless you’re trying to compete then it doesn’t really matter as much if it still respect the fact that each difficulty offer better rewards than the previous. We can argue how much rng is fine and how much is not, that’s fair but warforging is not the only culprit if we’re going that way as there has been many tier of raids in wow where I never got all my bis even after months of farm.
Less artificial. It’s just… drops and points to upgrade. With thunderforging, someone can just never get the best quality of their gear no matter how good they are or how much time they invest. Someone could get a drop one week, and then the next week the thunderforged version goes to a random new person in the guild who has a green in that slot. It’s absolutely the worst system to ever have been implemented. I honestly can’t understand how you’re defending it.
That’s more artificial as you need an upgrade system with currency etc. just to make it work. While warforging it simply drops and that’s it, there’s nothing more to add. It’s still the same loop as before.
So the problem is someone else getting that loot?
In a world where you could technically never get that loot it is still way less of a difference.
For me that’s like trying to say other people don’t deserve loot. Maybe don’t play with players you think don’t deserve loot? xd
Because I think there are positives side to it, the difference with a warforged item is still less than if you never got that item which is still something that can easily happen. I prefer this kind of system over an upgrade system which turns the game more into a grind rather than simply doing your raid each week.
No it’s literally not lmao. Why are you trying to gaslight? Having a set goal with points you get from bosses is not artificial. It’s a collect system. It might feel less “RP” but it’s not “more” artificial than a literal additional slot machine on top of the slot machine. Except the second one is intended to band aid a problem that doesn’t exist. So it just makes people frustrated.
If you read my comment with zero nuance and context… sure bud
This whole game is a grind. Literally everything is. Except with a point based system you have a goal you’re working toward. With Warforging you’re literally grinding potentially forever never getting to your goal potentially.
Warforging is not that big of a slot machine as the difference is still rather small at the end of day. If we’re talking about titanforging or even bonus sockets those had insane value later on. Moreover like I said there is already some level of rng so what makes this “too much” and more frustrated than usual? It’s normal to not always roll a 100 and the difference isn’t that high.
I don’t think there’s nuance when you say that people don’t deserve loot. A big reason why they got rid for a while of master loot and that you can only group loot nowadays is because of that kind of mindset. Being able to give the right players the gear to perform is one thing but being mad at other players getting gear isn’t the same mindset to me, one is selfish the other is about your group progression.
The whole game is a grind is simply a generalization. Definitely like rng there’s a point where we say it’s too much and for me upgrades systems are that as they keep making the grind way longer. I like being able to be mostly done after a month in term of what is deemed required outside of raiding and then simply be able to play how I want, it’s a reason why I dislike retail with the vault and its upgrade system.
Not what I said. They both deserve the drop. The same drop.
If you think an upgrade system is “just a grind” and warforging isn’t… there’s honestly something wrong. It’s a grind, just without any guarantee when it happens or if it will happen.
You can only raid once a week per character, which if you’re playing the game with a guild you are already doing and I don’t think extending the time you’d want to raid with your guild is a bad thing. For me this isn’t a grind if it’s something you are already doing moreover it’s already the way you are getting better gear so the loop of how you do content hasn’t changed hence it doesn’t add more grind.
You tried to diminish the other person by saying they’re fresh and green, that fresh and green person deserve the loot if it does the content.
And again what’s the difference with simply not getting loot if it drops once and never again? I’m trying to understand how much rng is too much for you because like I’ve said before it doesn’t seen like an insane amount. Better players will still perform better than people with warforged gear easily, the difference is not that high. The only big part can be melee weapons which maybe we just don’t make weapons thunderforge/warforge?
No I didn’t. It’s like you can’t stop putting words in my mouth. I’m saying the fresh shouldn’t just get a better upgrade for no reason. They both should have the same upgrade. It adds an additional rng to an already rng drop system where it sometimes already feels bad for drops.
Because it doesn’t matter how much skill or time you invest, you could potentially keep seeing the same worst version of your piece of gear drop. It’s not remotely fun. Literally 99% of people loathe this.
I feel we’re going in circle I’ve already talked about the rng and I’ve already addressed your point about fun and I cannot understand more your point as I can’t see it as something else than simply hating rng which at the end we will have even without warforging.
I don’t think you can speak for the 99% even with titanforging which was hated by many there were many people that liked it so it’s not as onesided as you would think.
If you don’t get a warforged item the first time then there will be another the same way that if you don’t get the item you want from a boss there will be another time. I think having a small rng factor is fun and I don’t see warforging as an overwhelming negative thing based on that and that realistically the difference isn’t as much and that it won’t change how players play the game much outside of adding a reason to keep doing raids for longer which is something most players do on classic.
As someone that like raiding I like this as it rewards players raiding for longer so it will help keeping groups together longer when one of the way to do this has been gdkps and I don’t like doing those.