They claim that pre-made teams aren't stacked

Sure but we already saw Blizzard did all sorts of stuff to AV queues 2 years ago in classic to mitigate premades.

That’s more of a guide than a 2007 blue post.

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But they have never made a comment on que syncing.

They have removed add-ons that allow it. I think that’s a clear sign they don’t want you to do it. Just like the original heal bot that use to auto select heals for you.

Yeah but they don’t comment on things like that; if anything they’ll add something like scrambled queuing instead of people just being in a straight line when they queue, and we’ll never hear about it.

As far as AV premades go, I don’t think Blizzard is going to take significant action if the other 3 BGs are working, but I guess we’ll just have to wait and see.

Blizzard didn’t do anything when we were winning 99% of the games, so I don’t think they really care.

AV is just always going to be a mess; it’s been a mess since the day it came out. WSG/AB/EOTS at least you can expect good games due to those being mostly mirror-ish maps.

AV has literally been unbalanced no matter which strategy either side chooses the past 2 years.

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There is no queue syncing, it’s just “join 1st available”, game starts, discord link is dropped, people join comms, play bg. So it’s the same as using the in game voice comms. The fact that a bunch of alliance queue knowing that there are other like minded players that want to communicate and win shouldn’t be an issue.

We used to win AV so much back in 2007 thst the Horde premades didn’t matter. We’d still win those sometimes.

As far as 99 AV marks, just take a few and destroy them. We did.

It does make sense for the team that’s winning 99% of the games to destroy marks if it’s more efficient to play AV constantly than the other BGs.

But for the side that’s losing, it probably makes more sense to just do the turn in quest one of each mark for 314 honor; especially with instant WSG/AB/EOTS queues on both sides this week.

AV marks are a quasi-bottleneck for the losing side.

Unless you already bought all the honor gear you want for phase 1 and have 75k stored.

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I had the stupid ram, and any gear I ever wanted from them back in the day.

These days, it’s kinda hard to accumulate AV. My overall win rate might be around 10%. The bulk if my AVs came from over a year ago, though.

Dec. 31, 2007, 8:29 p.m.
strong text


i never like fraz he was again hybrid class getting anything more than healing.


Change of policy July 22, 2021 9:13 a.m.


You’re correct, there were no posts regarding that specifically at that time.

However, adjustments to attempt to break our ability to make pre-made teams were made on Jan 23. 2020 at 2:00pm and the recent blue post from July 19, 2021 made at 2:01pm which indicates they’re acknowledging the complaints.

Add this to what’s going on in-game now, it’s pretty clear that Horde are giving the Alliance more rope, and the Alliance are going to the store to buy their own. It’s a matter of time.

You seem so confident. What exactly do you propose they do? They have not been able to stop them in retail for 15 years, but they have the magic fix in tbcc? There are literally videos of premades farming pugs on retail in the cave and mind controlling them out of the portal and Blizzard’s only response was to remove the portal.

Banning players is risky since they don’t know who is part of the premade and who happened into the group.

Some of you seem to think this is easy to fix, but if it were, retail would not have AV premades.

This is why what the alliance is doing is cheating and against the TOS. These are quotes taken directly from the Alliance AV discord.

  1. Mass queueing using 3rd party software to bypass the restriction of premade battlegrounds.

(C) Incendius-Shamfury Today at 9:51 AM @everyone whit the que being from 10min up to 30mins we will try a new strat this afternoon to get more people on each game, will do a mass que together each hour starting at 6pm east coast(edited)

  1. Requirements to even join the AV discord and abusing the listed AV numbers to join certain AV battlegrounds.

(C) Incendius-Shamfury — 05/03/2020 Welcome to AV x server premade please change your nickname whit this format “Server-Chararcter name-role(dps/heal)” then proceed to post a screanshot in #verification where we can see you have the stormpike insignia trinquet, a 100% speed mount and your char lvl 70 so we can verify you, after verification you will be able to see the rest of discord and join the premades, make sure to read #que-system to know how it works

Blizzard TOS - Cheating: Create, use, offer, promote, advertise, make available and/or distribute the following or assist therein:
cheats; i.e. methods not expressly authorized by Blizzard (whether accomplished using hardware, software, a combination thereof, or otherwise), influencing and/or facilitating gameplay, including exploits of any in-game bugs, and thereby granting you and/or any other user an advantage over other players not using such methods;

What should they do? Start with warnings then 3 day bans then longer and longer bans.

This is a quote taken directly from Blizzard:

It’s definitely not an exploit to enter the queue at the same time using Voice Chat or another communication method.

I never said it’s an easy fix.

The fact if the matter is that folks are doing this to secure easy/reliable wins. The behavior is excessive.

The game devs respond to how the game is played. This will lead to a change. As to what that change is, that remains to be seen.

premading is nigh impossible for AV. You cannot control who gets into AV with you other than your 5 man group. You cant garauntee healers or any class will make it into the same av. Its a gamble and is never reliable unless there is only 40 alliance total queing for av(which does happen late night).

Alliance have built a community with a common goal of learning to play av properly and not afking. Horde can do the exact same thing if they get a critical mass of people to join a community.

The big difference is the alliance pvp community is small yet easier to organize because its so small.

The great zug war machine is tough to organize since there are waaaaay too many of them. But it is still possible if zugs get motivated.


Failure right out the gate. No one is bypassing the restriction of premade battlegrounds, as this would mean they’re literally queuing up within the game with more than 5 people and the game is (through an exploited bug or other unintended behavior) allowing them to queue as a cohesive whole. People are just hitting the queue button together and hoping they join the same BG, nothing more.

Requirements to join a group are not against the EULA, I don’t know why you and others bring this up constantly but it has absolutely no bearing on any of this.

Selecting specific BG numbers from the list of available BGs is a basic function that has existed since BGs were first introduced 15 years ago. The intention of such a feature is to specifically allow players to join in-progress BGs with friends who are already playing. This is often mooted by the fact that BGs are so fast now, but in longer BGs like AV and WSG Blizzard is specifically allowing you to communicate with friends to try joining the BG you’re already in so you can play together. This isn’t abuse, it is simple authorized use.

This is the key term of that clause. You have to establish what method(s) people are using that are not expressly authorized by Blizzard. So far you’ve only pointed out:

  • People hitting the queue button (expressly authorized)
  • People hitting the queue button while targeting a specific BG number (expressly authorized)
  • People prioritizing people to play with based upon level, gear, etc (expressly authorized)
  • Use of VOIP (expressly authorized)

When you find something that isn’t expressly authorized, let me know, until then:

It’s definitely not an exploit to enter the queue at the same time using Voice Chat or another communication method.

Maybe they will, but it will be a little hypocritical to have ignored much worse behavior in retail and then do something for tbcc. These premades are not intentionally dragging games out. They are not avoiding objectives. They are getting max hph and ending the game. They promote community and learning how alliance can effectively play the map.

They’ll eventually end again, just like last time, but alliance will have learned new and better ways to play the map and probably made a few new friends.

If the behavior in this video didn’t get changes - other than a portal removed - I’m not sure why you think classic crybabies deserve special treatment. So much entitlement in classic tbc.

I can’t speak to retail, as I haven’t queued up for an AV since somewhere between MoP and WoD. I’m also not in the position to watch a video at the moment. Will do later.

I feel that the “learning to play” and “community” arguments are superficial, at best. While there might be some of that going on, the primary reason why folks are doing this is because it has an advantage, as you pointed out (max HpH.)

Some of these groups may be playing for objectives and ending the game. Others are using these to camp the cave. There is plenty of evidence here on the forums of this, and of repeated landslide victories. Again, people are doing this because it provides them with a significant advantage over those who are not.

This isn’t vanilla where it’s same server bgs. Horde have been starved for honor. I don’t see h vs h teams rolling over for easy caps and getting no honor from that game.

If they do might as well go back to the old system.