Ask blizzard that, I am not the ones saying that, it was blizzard. The whole thing is to view the chronicles as suspect now.
They have as much sentience as a highly advanced roomba. IE, none. Free will is what is needed and they don’t have any until now, with the earthen.
And the curse of flesh doesn’t instill postive emotions. It gives free will. Now that being good or bad, that depends on the person. The titans saw it as bad. The void lords view it as good because it gives them an easier way to seduce them into the void.
Also it 100% supports the claim that now even every wow site says the same thing. Earthen in Khaz’alar are earthen affected by the curse of flesh but in mind only.
But I am done with you, I know now you are just being a contrarian just for arguments sake.
i mean i’m not the one making stuff up wholecloth because i have an outdated view of the lore, but it’s whatever, this conversation wasn’t very productive anyway.
also just for the record i’d love it if you could provide even one example, but i don’t think you can because this is nonsense.
Arthas and Anduin lost their ability to use the Light because they lost the certainty what they were doing was just. Arthas was filled with self doubt striking down civilian’s in Stratholme, and Anduin because of his time spent under the control of the Jailer and that some part of him enjoyed it.
There’s a really important distinction that I’m not sure everyone here understands, it’s the Light users perception of themself and their faith in themself that determines if they can use the Light. It’s entirely based on their own self image. If someone was misguided or deluded enough to believe what they were doing was just and had unwavering faith in themself, good or evil wouldn’t play into it at all. It’s why the Scarlet Crusade and the AU Draenei were able to keep using the Light.
The funny thing is, I bet quite a few villains would be pretty adept with the Light if they ever learned to use it, because they really think what they’re doing is right.
Why are the Scarlet Crusade being an outlier exempting them from your argument? If anything the Scarlet Crusade are one of the most consistent examples of how the Light works.
In a certain point of view you would be 100% correct. They can use the light because they view what they are doing as just and right and it fills them with positive emotions
Why I am saying that they are an outlier is because this goes against what the light instills into people. The type of evil the scarlet crusade does goes against the compassion, loyalty and justice that the light gives you.
It’s an outlier because the dreadlord took the prejudice of certain silver hand members, twisted them so cleanly and thoroughly that their bigoted and psychopathic tendencies, which the light usually pushed out of people, are the reason they can use the light.
It perverted not the light, but the people’s mind to the point it turned righteous peoples intentions into something so corrupted that it gave them the emotions of the light for them to wield it.
Most villains do not have the willpower or conviction or the right “outlook” to use the light. Hence why the ones who lost the light, like the forsaken, usually went to the shadows or fel.
Vastly easier to use for almost the same effects. The blood elves used to drain a naa’ru before the sunwell came back online.
Basically, it’s the green lantern rule. Synestro went from willpower of the green spectrum and went the easier route with yellow out of fear and despair. Easier to use for a bigger payoff than the green spectrum.
bro you do know /ignore exists, right? i don’t think you’re the sort to want your opinions changed as much as to foist your own upon others, but we can at least do the thread the mutual courtesy of DNI lmfao
Does it though? Compassion, loyalty, and justice are subjective. For a Crusader, isn’t the most compassionate thing they can do for the undead is putting them to rest and ending their undying torment? Loyalty to Lordaeron and pushing back against the undead still prowling it. Justice when they smite who they believe to be wicked.
The problem I have is I don’t think the Scarlet Crusade are, or at least should be, an outlier. The critical component to wielding the Light is belief, not in the Light, but in yourself. A conviction that the wielder is just. If a paladin can convince themself that an enemy is evil and needs to be struck down at all costs, how far could they go before their ability to wield the Light was affected?
It’s a belief system that feeds into itself and is only deterred by an individuals sense of morals. Compound that with cosmic forces of evil beyond comprehension, and somebody paving their way to hell with good intentions like Arthas should be one of the most consistent outcomes of any experienced light wielder.
You’re right, they don’t. What I’m saying is those villains who are convinced that they’re in the right, and following some just cause, should be able to use the Light if they were to try. The Jailer for instance, he didn’t seem to have any remorse, any doubt in his whole “plan”. Not a certainty that what he’s doing “must be done”, but a twisted faith that he was doing the right thing for the universe.
you don’t understand, unless the definition of ‘compassion’ and ‘loyalty’ and so forth are all incredibly narrow, it’s Not True to the Lore. the narrowness is key.
Which almost happens with Turalylon and his mentor who is a forsaken. He wanted to kill him to put him out of his misery but once he saw that he was still him, wielder of the light and compassionate still, he stilled his blade and accepted him.
That is what the light stands for, understanding. What you are saying is full on scarlet crusade thinking.
Yes, and that is literally what fractured the silver hand into two camps. The zealotry, that was flamed by a dreadlord, called the scarlet crusade, and the agent crusade who stated to accept forsaken, goblins, gnomes, trolls and dwarves in their ranks.
That is why it is an outlier. Because the light is more based on positive emotions, people who are more understanding and accepting and ones who listen than the zealots. The light draws in compassionate people and understanding people, hence why light wielders are more like Anduin than not.
Them striking down everything they think is evil is not being open minded, it is close minded and filled with fear. But how can a fearful person use the light? BY twisting them so much that the person themselves with these paranoid feelings AS POSITIVELY feature.
That is what the dreadlord did.
The first person Arthas killed with the light filled him with so much negative emotions and doubt, because he felt it was bad, he started to feel weaker. The hammer in his hand that was light as a feather started to become heavy as stone. Arthas novel.
When he started to become paranoid, fearful and more of a zealot, he lost his power because he was still him. He wasn’t fully turned like the scarlet crusade because he knew, deep down, what he was doing was wrong
No, this agree 100%. But the fact is this is supposed to be so rare that isn’t doesn’t happen much. That is why the scarlet crusade is still iconic because they took a power that is supposed to make you more open minded and used it when they were super closed minded and more akin to void users. It wasn’t the power that drove them, it was the dreadlord that literally twisted them so much that they viewed what they were doing was just. Which is impossible unless you are a very powerful dark lord
That or we can go the easy route and just make you light bound, which literally just turns you into a light being and wanting to spread love to much you conquer things out of love. Remember, AU yrel, which was such bad writing for the allied race, literally converted everyone but one segment of orcs. Majority of the orcs were light bound by then and were happy.
The writing for that was a$$ and not as interesting as the scarlet crusade.
The jailer also didn’t use light magic. He used domination magic. He’s a first one so he is more titan like and titans use tools to wield magic. Not faith or willpower
ay not for nothing but there is some really great irony about a conversation wherein zeal, insular thinking, and aggression are all treated as bad things yet half of the conversation’s participants are literally that while condemning it roundly.
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