4 Likes
I completely forgot the world soul was a thing.
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I feel like what is the biggest issue for me is the failure to see why people have fond memories for the first three expansion packs and why people wanted to return to Vanilla and have a WCIII reboot. People crave the feeling of being in the unknown again, of the vastness of travel and having to explore.
A lot of the quests were centered around lore and culture, with spells and new abilities being tied to special encoutners that give insight into some world building.
But the reason why these things were beautiful was because the internet was less friendly to looking up how to do quests, and everything you did was unknown. Now there is an obsession, with every game actually, to be obsessively good to the point of forgetting other people play this game and turning everything into an E-Sport. This isnāt a blizzard thing, this is an every studio thing were games are now just as mass produced as the factory made paintings at Hobby Lobby with the brush strokes to make it look āpaintedā.
It further creates this disconnect between creators and players, where the players are still in mindset of Chris Metzenās passion and the creators are not paying attention why people cling onto the old narratives. I bet Thrall being a big character all the time wasnāt so bad now after all was it?
Because now, the biggest insult of all has been done to the key thing that made people love the game. By showing us death far too intimately , by making it look like a carnival theme part robot heaven, it has removed the culture of the world. The fantasy of the world of why people play wow or dnd or skyrim or ect.
The point is being in the shoes of someone living in a world that is fantastical and where magic is known but not fully explained.
And the thing is, after seeing the trailer for the new patch Iāve come to realize that the story itself is not actually bad. As painful as it might be to hear that or come to terms with it, I can see what theyāre doing. And I can see why and I can see where they would feel this is a good direction. What it actually is, is inappropriate. Itās easy to forget the backlog of experience people have gone t hrough while playing and continue into a direction of the afterlife after dealing with it for so long.
However, in this setting it doesnāt belong. As a player walking through a world that has been here since before 2000 was in its double digits , seeing the very creation of the universe itself does not connect to me or anyone else in a meaningful way.
Outland was far more alien and other worldly than anything in the Shadowlands ever will be.
And it saddens me that now, all the races and cultures are now being invalidated in their beliefs. It doesnāt matter to me that their afterlife still may exist or that their religion and worship still give them powers. The very idea that these religions now give people fuel (espeically in RP) to tell them that their worship is going directly toward some other being or god is incredibly insulting, offensive and very wrong when you think about the reality of it all.
Too much of Warcraft have roots in real life inspiration, from animistic shamanism and real life cultures who already have their beliefs be told their fake, invalid, untrue and primitive.
In all my time of playing this game, for once, Iām not into acknowledging what Iām being shown here after I play it. I still hold firmly onto the idea that the after-life is only being translated into the minds of the mortals in an easily palatable way when its reality is far more chaotic and hard to understand unless you were a spirit.
And, after all this is done, I donāt care if it makes others upset. Iād like to see a cut scene that somehow invalidates the entire expansion pack to reveal that it wasnāt at all what we thought it was, and that this was just a front for the true mystery of something we shouldnāt know.
Just let the cultures of the universe retain their cultures
12 Likes
I hope the jailer doesnāt unmake reality! That would be bad.
ā¦would it, though?
If the remade universe is written by Danuser, then yeah.
8 Likes
I feel like the new world would be called Sylvazeroth and our levelling experience would consist mainly of kissing Sylvanas statues
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Combat basically consists of pillow fights with anime Sylvanas body pillows.
1 Like
Nailed it.
The difference is, Outland felt like a medieval fantasy version of a science fiction world. It was otherworldly to Azeroth itself, but not to the general ethos of Azerothās established cosmos.
Zereth Mortis, on the other hand, just feels like straight science fiction without an appeal to medieval fantasy. You could just as easily move it into a world like Star Wars or Destiny or even Mass Effect without missing a beat; by contrast, Outland would largely feel out of place anywhere BUT World of Warcraft.
This was a huge problem. I mean, if weāre going to Azerothās afterlife, why didnāt we actually go to AZEROTHāS afterlife? You know, the afterlives established in the existing Lore?
Why, for the love of the gods, did we meet Eluneās SISTER instead of ELUNE? How does that even make sense?
And where are the verdant meadows and expansive grasslands a la the Great Cosmic Barrens that would almost certainly comprise the vision of the afterlife held by the shamanic cultures of the Horde? Where are the elemental spirits and the ancestors?
And if you are going to do something like Maldraxxus, why is zero effort made in the lore of the zone to tie it into and build upon the existing lore of the Forsaken and the Death Knights?
If we had actually gone to Azerothās afterlife and met gods we had heard of, it wouldāve been so much better.
And again, itās not that the Shadowlands lore is bad in and of itself. It honestly feels like a decent foundation for the lore of a completely different sci-fi/fantasy world. It is just completely foreign to what we previously understood about Azerothās afterlife in a way that is almost completely inexplicable.
This. The big reason Shadowlands doesnāt work is that it invalidates much of what we previously knew and loved about Azeroth, without giving us anything of significant substance to replace it.
8 Likes
This is why I quit the game a few weeks before Shadowlands came out.
I had a lot of grievances with what BfA did to the settings and characters of the franchise (you can see my rrace/class combo and guess at what one major grievance was), but I was willing to sit through it and see what came next for this fictional world that Iād been following for years.
Not all subfactions/races can be in the spotlight all the time, after all, so Iām willing to sit some story chapters out and hope the next plot to roll around will be back on an area I really care about. I didnāt like the Burning, but if the story spent equal focus and effort and gameplay relevance on future night elf plots and development, I could think the story was worth it. And I was okay with waiting out the in-between time, when the story took a break from focusing on night elves because the other groups definitely need their own screentime to react and develop. (I do think that plot threads on hiatus do need to be referenced during their downtime, though, just so we players can tell what is on hiatus vs whatās been forgotten.)
But Shadowlands doesnāt seem to have a ānextā. Itās beautiful, but the threads tying it to Warcraft seem grudging, like someone after-the-fact trying to cram it into the existing Warcraft setting because they couldnāt publish it as a stand-alone setting, and stepping on the toes of so many afterlife hints and trivia bits that Warcraft already had. Azshara and Nāzoth, both contenders for full expansions, were rushed through in only a few patches in what appears like - whether intenionally or not - an attempt to get through all established stories so that the writers can say thereās nothing left to do but try out their new toy.
It feels like they donāt want to write this setting. I donāt feel any confidence that theyāll write any future story developments with the settingās past in mind - and at that point, itās basically a different setting anyway.
I still check the forums because I still hold out hope that the mood will change, that the writers will suddenly seem interested again in returning and working with the settingās existing story opportunities - because I still really, really want to see what happens with them. Thatās why I stuck with this game for so long.
But nowā¦ if I want to start over with a new setting, there are other options than this over-a-decade-old game that I donāt have as much time to play as I did years ago. (Though recently, I do have a lot of free time - and yet I still donāt feel any draw to return to WoW as it currently is.) And with all the allegations against Blizzard recently, itās certainly not company loyalty that would keep me paying them for the game.
8 Likes
I agree with your whole post, but I think youāre also touching on something pretty substantive in this formula, but that doesnāt get discussed - WoW racial loyalty and what keeps players playing.
I mostly play Gnomes and Dwarves. Iāve played other races but those are the ones I like and truthfully, those are what keep me playing. If one day I logged in and had to be something else? Iām almost 99% certain Iād leave. (I might play forsaken, but Iām not sure how much Iād be into it.) As well, as someone who plays Gnomes and Dwarves, I have gotten absolutely used to not getting much story attention. Itās fine. Just mention us once in a while.
However, the consistently most-played races in WoW? Blood Elves, Humans and Night Elves. (Orcs are a close 4th) Thereās a lot of statistical-based reports that continue to say those three races are what pulls the most numbers, when it comes to populations in-game.
As someone who has almost exclusively played Alliance since starting the game, I canāt speak for what Blood Elf players are up to these days. I can however, continue to say the same thing Iāve said on these forums for the entirety of Shadowblands - Night Elf players/roleplayers have always been some of the most loyal and consistent pillars of the blue-side community. The numbers show it. The contribution to RP/lore shows it. etc etc.
So what do they do? They burn down Teldrassil! What did they give the NE community back in return for that? A horrible story? A ridiculous plot line? Tyrande playing peacenik again? Sylvanas probably gets redemption? Are you kidding me with this? If I was a NE roleplayer, Iād be raging or Iād just be entirely apathetic and fade away.
Subjective of course, but most people playing are likely not loyal to Blizz. They are loyal to what they like in this game and A LOT of people like the Night Elves. Takingā¦and not giving back in return, seems like a massive kick to the groin with steel toes to a huge chunk of the player base.
I donāt understand when they do things like this.
14 Likes
This is basically me, at least in part.
2 Likes
On a more serious note than my last few posts, I just want them to get rid of Steve at this point and retcon Shadowlands and the more lore damaging parts of BFA from canon. His ideas and writing are too damaging to the overall health of the worldās lore and doesnāt make sense when you think about it.
Just take us back to Azeroth, try to rebuild the tensions between the Alliance and Horde without this BS third party bad guy force looming over and just roll with actually expanding and updating the old world zones like what I expected to happen in BFA instead of getting this cosmic crap towards the end of the expac and a āpeaceā council for the Horde. Also give the Night Elves and Forsaken a new home city. Thereās plenty of places on both continents for a new home for them like Hyjal for the Elves or the Death Knightsā starting zone that they can repurpose. If they want to do another faction civil war, then they should do it for both Factions instead of just the Horde, make both subfactions a gray enough reason for the players to actually think on which side they want instead of āIām picking Saurfang cause heās goodā and āIām picking Sylvanas cause I want to be Evil Bad!ā and make it a multi expansion C plot to really give us time to breath in the story and characters.
As for Blizzardās higher ups obsession with the āGreater Evil Threatā just give us one or two grounded Expacs before jumping into yet another world ending threat. Itās losing its weight after, a demonic invasion, a literal Old God being released (and did nothing really) and the sky being torn apart (twice looking back to Legion). I donāt want to fight gods anymore at this point. Iām just a simple sad and angry Tauren that wants fight humans and avenge my lost ones from Taurajoā¦ Is that so much to ask Blizzard? lol
4 Likes
Welp.
Spoilers I guess?
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āHe who tormented so many, who set in motion the plague of Undeath so long agoā¦ has finally been destroyedā
And nothing of value we got from Zovaal (dumb name by the way) was lost outside of undermining the weight of Arthas and Nerāzhulās role as the Lich King.
9 Likes
I was rooting for him to unmake the universe at this point.
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Anyone remember Argus?
The supposing Titan of Death?
Pepperidge Farm remembers.
Steve apparently forgot thoughā¦
Oh well. At least we have his Edgelord Thanos!
7 Likes
RIP in peace Zooval.
When we met you, we didnāt know what you were plotting. A year later, Iām still not totally clear. You may have been tired, you may have been tedious, you may have been a pointlessly bare-nipped wish dot com version of Sauron, you may have rendered the gravely serious subject of genocide as a trivial plot point, you may be the backdrop music to the litany of atrocities that the story continues to rack up, but at least youā¦youā¦uhā¦
Hm.
Well, you certainly had three vowels in your name. I think we can all agree on that.
12 Likes
So heās a Toni Braxton song?