It is absolutely the case that we plan on having crafted gear be able to compete with top end gear from other sources, and in some cases even be best in slot. One of the most important goals to the work order system is enabling crafted gear to be much more relevant to the game - across all activities. Just remember, in order to have that powerful gear crafted for yourself, you’ll need to go out and earn special (soulbound) reagents to provide to the crafter in order to have that item you’ve had your eye on crafted!
Is it possible to speak a little about the anticipated “grindiness” of this?
I don’t want to go into a lot of detail on the planned system for Dragonflight yet, but the intent is that this is not generally grindy when aiming to earn gear appropriate to your activity.
That is, if you are a normal raider for instance, your normal raid provides enough reagents to allow you to to craft a limited amount of ~normal raid item level gear without needing to go do a bunch of other stuff. But if say, you wanted to craft heroic raid tier gear as a normal raider, you could choose to go do other activities such as m+, pvp, or challenging outdoor activities to supplement the reagents required and get better gear sooner.
In general we’d like crafted gear to feel like something you are earning at a satisfying rate along side your other gear sources. Say you had bad luck and got no drops while raiding, you’ll still be making progress towards some high end crafted gear…and say you just can’t get legs to drop for you, you may choose to have legs crafted to fill in that particular slot with a larger upgrade.
For some crafted gear, you might also need to seek out a special rare drop off a certain mob in the world, a dungeon, or a raid as well. Earning crafted gear should feel like a bonus, an adventure, and a social experience.
This is excellent! Thank you for the reply.
Thanks for chiming in to the conversation.
The big question I have is in relation to small servers. To your point, some of this gear may be Best in Slot. Is there any consideration being given to these items being legitimately harder to obtain on small servers because not everything gets created by a character? I think the work order system sounds great but given what I’ve experienced with Legendaries in Shadowlands, this is a major concern for myself and many others.
Yes, this is definitely a valid concern and one we are discussing how to address!
Glad to hear it’s being looked at! Thanks for your consideration and I look forward to hearing your thoughts on the matter.
Not sure what options are on the table for you, but a few that have come to mind for me would be to extend work orders beyond traditional realm barriers (thinking of things like the old Battlegroups)
Another option I’ve thought of would be to allow the game to scan work orders from large realms and duplicate them on small servers, where those same items are not available - the commission would go to the void but at least the option would be there for us to seek out those items.
This is great to hear, that was definitely a concern.
However, could you address the other concern related to improving recipes, in that it essentially will make the Work Order not used often at all?
Why would you risk putting a work order up and having it answered by someone without a decent skill at crafting a recipe, when you could just post in trade chat and have them craft it if they have it high?
This is a big improvement over the Shadowlands legendaries for sure, but I’m still a little hesitant. I guess it depends a lot on what sort of activities one has to do, I think it would be unfortunate if it’s going to be “defeat X boss in mythic” or something like that (not that I think it’s going to be that), but if it’s something more creative, I’m looking forward to it!
This also makes me feel pretty hopeful! I only dabble in crafting fairly casually, mostly to make some catchup gear for alts that I don’t play in endgame content or collecting craftable transmogs/toys/mounts, but work orders is making me consider upping my game a bit and provide more for the community if it works out well :>
I would assume you decide what the result of the work order is, and that no one can give you the inferior product to that which you would like. Otherwise the work order system is going to break pretty quickly. I assume that if you want an ilevel 300 helm, no one can come around and give you an ilevel 250 helm in its place. Though it’d be nice with some confirmation and more details on how the system works. I’d also defer to my other question about work orders:
Anything you can reveal towards profession items and WorldPvP? Id like more than just glider and nitro boots Mk 3
We definitely have world PvP in mind with our crafting plans, both with interesting recipes, and with regards to gathering reagents, but nothing we are ready to talk about in detail yet!
One thing I want to talk about that we haven’t mentioned yet is the concept of recrafting. It’s still in the works so is likely to change some, but the basic idea is as follows:
Recrafting will allow you to take any piece of Dragonflight crafted gear and bring it back into the crafting screen as a crafter. You can then spend a special reagent, plus a small subset of the original reagents from the recipe to “recraft the item”.
During this process, you can completely change out optional reagents if you want. The new quality of the item will be determined based on the new setup of reagents, plus your current skill. This means you can have an item crafted at a low quality, then later recraft it when you are higher skill to a higher quality.
For non-crafters, we are planning to support recrafting orders as well. In this case, you can send you item to get recrafted to have its optional reagents changed out, or to potentially have its quality increased.
All of this should help players feel comfortable having a high end item crafted early, when it might not be at max quality, secure in the knowledge that they can always have it recrafted to be better later.
Couple questions for you here:
- Will the missive system - or something similar to it - be coming back in Dragonflight, and if so can the recrafted items have their stats changed from the originial craft?
- Is a system like reforging likely to make a return in relation to crafted gear (or any gear for that matter)? Maybe an item to reforge stats could be given to a profession?
- Just for clarification, (Making up random numbers for context), if an ilvl 325 item costs 50 dragonscales to make, and a 350 costs 75 dragonscales, you would only need 25 dragonscales to upgrade your 325 to a 350? Instead of needing to craft an all new item? (Similar to how upgrading shadowlands legendaries works for Soul Ash/Cinders)
Any plans for older crafted items like engineering bombs and alchemy potions to be usable again by removing level restriction? I miss using skystep potions and old stun bombs
Not specifically right now, but we think you’ll be excited to see some of the new stuff we have in store for you.
A few answers Letholas, thanks for asking!
We definitely think it is valuable to be able to adjust stats on some crafted gear - customization is one of the coolest aspects of crafting!
As far as recrafting changing those stats, the intent would be something like this would continue to be done through optional reagents, so in a case like that, yes, you could use recrafting to swap out those optional reagents and thus change the secondary stats.
The recrafting system described is very specific to crafted gear only.
The recrafting system shouldn’t be thought of as an upgrade system. It is just a way to take something that has been crafted in the past and recraft it with changed optional reagents and possibly a different quality. So to give a more concrete example using your numbers:
A crafted recipe might make a helm at between item level 325 and 335 depending on quality. It could require 100 dragonscales as it’s main reagent.
A skilled crafted might be able to make it straight up at quality 5, item level 335, while a new crafter might only make it at quality 1, or item level 325. In both cases, the reagent cost is the same.
Now, say you got your piece crafted by that unskilled crafter at quality 1 / item level 325. Maybe he’s a friend and says, hey Letholas, I’ve been working on my blacksmithing and I can now make that piece at quality 5! Send it to me via a recrafting order to me and I’ll hook you up. You do so.
Your friend then recrafts your helm using the old helm, 20 dragon scales, and one of a special reagent he earned, to recraft it. The result is it is now quality 5 and item level 335.
Hopefully that helps clarify.
Interesting, so the base cost is the same, but there is a cost to re-create the item as more powerful?
From a thematic point of view I’ve gotta say that’s a great sounding system. In hindsight, it’s not something that made sense in crafting the Shadowlands Legendaries - the higher ilvl costs 25% more (or whatever the increase is) materials to make even though there’s no “new armor” per say. Now, you’re effectively breaking down parts of the item and replacing it at a higher quality so you need new materials to do so! I like it!
Has it been clarified yet how one will become more adept at crafting? Something about a quest line or other activity is ringing a bell, apologies if this has already been answered.
Excellent question! This is something we will definitely be heavily testing for feel, but here some of the ways we imagine you can grow adept at crafting.
“Permanent” forms of improvement / progression
Improving your overall profession skill. If you’ve maxed out your blacksmithing skill for instance, you will craft everything better than if you are only halfway leveled through your profession. (Leveling / skilling up in your profession will mechanically work the same as it always has).
Getting better gear for your profession - through higher skill and/or other profession stats on the gear.
Specialization in your profession - This is the largest source of improvement. The more you specialize in ways that help a given recipe, the larger bonus skill you will get towards that recipe, and thus the higher quality you will be able to make it at. (There is a lot to this system that we’ll discuss later!) There are lots of ways to earn specialization points, and doing so will be necessary to excel in your profession. Some of these sources can only be done once, while others will be repeatable.
- Some one-time sources for specialization points are likely to be: making recipes for the first time, certain discoveries in the world (an old book on a bookshelf about alchemy, an old buried tablet, a hermit scribe in a cave, etc.), special quests, completing certain profession achievements such as crafting your first max quality item
- Some repeatable sources for specialization points are likely to be: helping various factions and NPC’s in the world (through quests), finding treasures out in the world, fulfilling crafting orders for others.
Ways to become more adept and have a better outcome each time you craft
Using higher quality reagents in your recipe.
Using a new type of consumable reagent that we are calling Finishing Reagents. These reagents give you bonuses while crafting the recipe, and some of them can directly improve your skill, and thus quality, when used. An example might be a blacksmith using a special quenching oil, or a jewelcrafter using a special polishing cloth while cutting gems.
Some crafting stats can improve the resulting quality crafted. One of these is Inspiration. The more inspiration you have, the better chance to be Inspired while crafting, gaining some bonus skill to be applied to the outcome. Basically a crafting “crit”. While we want the system to be largely about long term progression and opt in bonuses, inspiration provides a form of opt-in randomness. If you choose to specialize or gear towards Inspiration, you may be able to craft something at a higher quality than your current level of progression would otherwise allow (when you become inspired). The idea is this adds some additional excitement to the crafting process through variable outcomes, but that it is never required to be able to craft things at the highest level of quality.
Optional reagents - Using most optional reagents will actually increase the difficulty of the recipe, and thus require a higher skill to craft it at a high quality. Conversely, if you choose to use an optional reagent that, for instance, lowers the item level of the item you are crafting, it will actually lower the difficulty of the recipe and make it easier to craft at a high quality.
Hopefully that answers your question!
This seems a little vague, could you elaborate on this at all?
Is there a deterministic way to gain inspiration or is it RNG based when crafting?
What is the benefit to crafting a lower ilvl item at a higher quality? Are there going to be times where this would be a better system than just crafting a higher ilvl item? Or is this intended to use the higher quality craft to gain more proficiency?
What kind of sources can we expect for profession gear? Do they drop from the same kind of sources as you would otherwise improve your profession, can you craft them, do they drop from dungeons, raids, pvp, et cetera?
So you also gain these stats passively alongside your gear, then? I thought it was only going to be part of your gear, much like how things like crit and haste work, but you’re able to upgrade these stats through specialisation?