The fact that tanks are entirely self sufficient is part of the problem and it’s because of their HPS. Mitigation like stagger, block, parry, dodge, etc… is great, but blizz gave them ability to also heal themselves indefinitely. That’s a large part of group healing that blizz removed from healers. To compensate for that blizz should increase healer dps so that the role remains as important as it was before tanks were immortal.
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“Tanks” aren’t entirely self-sufficient. SOME tanks are.
Put away that broad brush, please.
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Is not just prot paladin, off-healing was also buffed, if you see the teams completing 22-24 without healer they use 3 dps hybrids that can off heal.
But the problem you run into there is that the best way for a healer to increase their damage is to swap specs. If healing isn’t required, then why specialize in it?
For sure they should normalize healer damage outputs, because healer damage is important whether Blizzard admits it or not. But it’s got nothing to do with tank self-sustain.
I cannot fathom how blizz thought it was OK to give a tank the most stable DR in the game at nearly 20% IIRC all for just standing in their consecrate. Then they give them the healing of BDK, magic mitigation that is completely unparalleled, and utility that vastly exceeds every other tank by a large margin. What blizz was thinking giving PPal all the blessings, brez, and auras I cannot fathom. 
It’s not their self heal, it’s the self heal + insane mitigation + utility way beyond other tanks
That’s what makes them such a required pick.
LoL, try tanking a high key. I just love getting splatted when I do the first pull of freehold on a fortified week because I’m a 10th of a second away from getting Fel Dev off when meta drops off. Yeah immortal
Yeah… either you’re trying to troll or you’ve never actually tanked hard content. Tanks are 100% not self sufficient unless they are a PPal.
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Which honestly makes this whole conversation a bog-standard tuning discussion.
ahhh you meant to his argument okay
been like that forever. now that prots meta yall are complaining?
If you think its healthy for the game that 1 tank out of all the tank specs can 1 tap heal people from 20% to full all while most healers would take 3-5 casts to do the same amount of healing then there is probably no convincing you otherwise so just enjoy it while it lasts I guess.
I look forward to see your responses in the inevitable ‘Why are there no healers in queue anymore’ threads that will start in a few weeks.
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The trade-off was always that Prot Paladins had unparalleled party utility, but were not necessarily the toughest tanks around.
With the latest buffs, Blizzard broke the trade-off, by pumping up the toughness while leaving the utility completely intact.
If Prot Paladins wanted to be sturdier, fine. I understand that desire. Remove Avenger’s Shield and nerf Word of Glory to compensate, however.
You can’t be the best at everything. Unless you’re a Prot Paladin in 10.1, it seems.
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Don’t forget the multiple interrupts including an AoE interrupt on a short cd.
At this rate I’d say the is impacted by a few things:
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Prot plds are skewing the upper meta. Tanks always have done this to some extent, but they’ve never been able to simultaneously fulfill so many niches at once. Blood dk in SL S4 wasn’t throwing out dispels, heals and blessings like plds are right now. They were strong, but they brought damage and mitigation to the table. The group still had to fulfill mechanic and heal checks.
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Hybrids are borked right now if they funnel any volume of resources into utility or heals while somehow maintaining competitive dps.
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We still have a massive reliance on lust and brez in the m+ world, still.
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Healer damage should probably be adjusted up to tank damage to close the gap on how impactful a 4th dps can be. If you think about it this way, a 2.5mm go mob has tank (50k), 3 dps (100k each) and a heal (20k) focusing it. That mob goes down in roughly 8 globals. If you replace that heal with another dps of comparable damage, that mob goes down in 5.5 seconds. That is critical to timing a dungeon and cutting off high damage abilities in FF targets like the iron tides in freehold. They aren’t popping off a shattering bellow that early usually. Everything else in that first 3 pack pull can be largely dodged or stunned. It adds up over a run.
Honestly they kinda dropped the ball. Paladins need something like Holy Ring, basically just RoP. But since it’s Paladin it should be on a 4 second CD.
SL Prot had MORE utility with shorter CD Divine Toll (due to Mikanikos) and way more Holy Power to throw around (tier set throwing Judgments willy nilly and Avenger’s Shield giving HP) and no one cared. Why? Because Prot Paladin was made of tissue paper and did middle of the pack damage.
It turns out when you give Prot Paladin not only ANOTHER defensive, but the defensive in question is the best one in the game (besides their Bubble Taunt) AND they do more damage, the spec is absolutely broken because their utility was left relatively untouched.
Sentinel reminds me of TCG custom cards where if someone were to pitch the idea it would get laughed off as “no one would ever print something like that it’s too insane”.
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All of those buffs were just nudges for no reason. Without them, Paladin was still the best tank since day 1.
The reason why people were a little slower to catch on was because prot pall is historically underplayed at higher levels (IIRC) and its the hardest tank to play (people wont admit this though )
So most tank players hope that prot pal is never meta because it exposes TF out of them.
Avengers shield is not gonna get removed lmaooo chill. They will get reined in soon.
No way you unironically say this as one of the most forgiving tanks (perma 15% DR in Consecration and has absurd Block chance for passive DR) when we came off SL S3 and S4 with BDK being the defacto best tank and is genuinely one of the hardest tanks (only second to BrM).
Yeah, idk I call false on this one lol.
Got any citations to show this is fact?
*edit: I say this because I have a prot pally, and although I don’t do keys with him, he’s damn near invincible already anyway…and it’s not hard to hit like 5 spells to do so. imo anyway I guess?
You really think blood in SL S4 with 70% parry was harder to play than Prot pal.
Yeah if youre not doing content you can actually die in every tank is invincible. I’m not taking a shot at you btw.
We saw this in Shadowlands S4. Prot paladin was the most played tank UNTIL you went past 25 keys. At 26 and above, prot took a nose dive. It was still playable but there was no point because blood was better and infinitely easier.
There are 26 specs in the game which still need a healer to do high keys, don’t worry.
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