You are literally defending a system that pushes the normalization of people as disposables.
You act like you are the better man after trying to twist the words of others trying to frame them as hypocrites, when they are not (trying to equate hobbies to hedonism).
You double down on trying to frame others as hypocrites because “they didnt respect you” after you claimed BS over others (You lost any respect there buddy)
So yes, you are a manchild, you are despicable, you are wrong, and I wouldn’t want to be friends with someone so dishonest and egotistic (bs claims over others and pushing for egotistical tools).
I barely said anything, you did all the revealing of who you are.
You should try being more respectful so you don’t fall into your own definition.
Then people will want to play WoW with you.
“I barely said anything” → Said the one that claimed others were being hypocrites as a way to defend his point after losing the argument. The one that came to the forum to claim his silver plate isnt bad, probably because others catch on his lies.
Listen dude, you are not the better man, not here, not before, not after, and never will. So keep praying there is an endless supply of people to fool, because it wont work on me or any decent human being.
RDF is a bad tool for a game where the content is intended to be worked on social groups. ;).
I’ve no doubt that some people are having a better game experience. The question to statements like that is how many are having a better game experience and how many are having a worse game experience. You separating people into more social and anti-social is a false dichotomy. I have no social anxiety and have plenty of friends both in game and out. I have more than enough significant social interactions that I don’t find the base and trivial social interactions of looking for a group to be meaningful. For me it’s just a boring waste of time. Just as I don’t find the trivial social interaction of the Walmart greeter saying, “Welcome to Walmarts” as a meaningful social interaction.
Actually no. There constant complaints about the difficulty finding dungeon groups and requests for a better tool to find groups. Blizzard didn’t create the rdf because 96% of the players were fine finding groups. They did it to correct a problem.
I think this is true. This is one of those things that falls into the clash between modern player expectations and old school design. These games probably function best when it’s a community of no more than about 4k players on a faction. However, most people don’t want that because that leads to needing to schedule your life around the game. Which people seem to be trying to avoid. For good reason I might add.
I don’t know if it’s this black and white. I honestly think the most socially awkward and/or anti social people playing this game tend to be the better players because their lack of IRL social skills leads to them having a lot of time to focus on the game. I mean, have you seen some of the streamers and content creators for this game?
No, I think time is the biggest factor. Time spent in game is what allows those bonds to form naturally, and people aren’t trying to spend five hours a day in game anymore.
Didn’t you say you play on a fresh server? You don’t think that maybe your server has a higher percentage of players who are, you know, fresh? They haven’t been here for the past three years, so they don’t have six alts or whatever. Hell, the fact that there are fresh servers could be why the other servers are so deserted at low levels.
I guess. But if you’re going to tell me that I need to do the WoW equivalent of cold calling people to get a group for SFK, then we’re just going to have to agree to disagree on that. That’s a horrible system.
Well, we’ve already established that you can’t really compare WoW to other games since it’s a mix of PvP and PvE, right?
I didn’t say everybody is playing that way, but it does seem to be the majority. YMMV
But this:
Is a retail mindset. That the guild is the only community that matters. This reinforces my point. It wasn’t like that back in 2007. Back then, people were just better to each other in general. At least on the server I played on. One of the things that I’ve heard mentioned as an issue with retail is how everybody has basically retreated to their guild communities and essentially ignores everybody else. That’s not what this game was about.
Most groups I get in 2 people hit a flightpath and semi afk until they land and go to the stone to summon the 3 other lazy bums. Nothing much social there.
Would be really nice if they would release RDF next phase and make players use LFG tool for heroic+. Now your anti RDF players can have their precious social experience while the other 90% of players can actually enjoy running dungeons again.
Of course it isn’t B&W, I even used “may” and not “will”. Humans are more complex than what both, anti-RDF and pro-RDF are presenting. And that’s the thing, I disagree with OP’s premise because we would have to take into consideration I don’t know how many factors to prove that. I can’t prove the contrary for sure, but at this point, we all are sharing opinions. For example, what defines a ‘better player’? And more importantly, why should it matter?
Personally, there are days in which I can play for 2 hours at most, if I have time to log at all. Time is a factor, but we can’t easily determine whether it is the biggest factor or not. People’s willingness, preferences and personalities could be bigger, but there isn’t enough space in the forums to talk about each and one of them.
I do play on a fresh server. Estimations suggest that 60% are level 80, 20% are from 70-79, and 20% are leveling old content. On a bigger scale, there aren’t that many people leveling, but adding a system that encourages leveling based on extrinsic values may not be the biggest solution if your premise is based on the social aspect.
Would having RDF make more people level alts? Without a doubt. Would that make people socialize more? I can’t find a scenario where that would be the case. Putting people together without incentives does not equate into socialization.
And in case you bring the “not doing x is detrimental to your game experience” here (which could be applied), well, try finding a job without doing job interviews, or go to a party, don’t talk to anyone and see how much fun you can get that way. Group activities should require socialization to a certian degree. That could be another interesting discussion to have.
If we think about people finding leveling tedious because they don’t want to do the same quests over an over again, why would running the same dungeons over and over again be less tedious at some point? Those extrinsic values have made people feel less motivated, some people have said it many times: “I just want to get things done” without expressing the enjoyment in doing so. “I just want to get to 80 so the fun can begin” is kinda contradictory because questing is faster, according to the majority of people that have talked about it. I don’t know, at this point I feel the premise that “it would help others” has ulterior motives: it could be expressed in terms of many people wanting a “me” thing. The same can be said about forming groups “the old way” but at least you acknowledge other people’s participation and involment rather than watching people zerg through content.
Man, lots of projection, but LFD did ruin the game for me.
It wouldn’t necessarily be cold calling, I thing we all can assume what your intentions are (running a dungeon). Imagine hooking up with someone at a party, you just go and give it a try, and given the setting, it is not unreasonable to do so. I wouldn’t say the system is horrible.
Well, you did mention that socialization in gaming has declined in ALL games. I just provided at least one example in which that isn’t the case. I haven’t played all MMOs out there to establish the decline in ALL games.
So which is it, joining guilds is good or bad? It can’t be both. I never said that guilds are the only community that matters, my point was that people in my guild don’t think that time and current priorities make the game non-enjoyable, nor do those prevent them from enjoying specific content. I truly believe that people feel better when they are nice to others and viceversa. I think we have a better platform today and that you could see it when others compare guilds between retail and classic. I never implied or tried to say that guilds are the only community that matters. I believe people are making that comparison because the community feels better overall, and guilds are a reflection of that.
I’ve witnessed people helping others while they are questing with having zero benefits in return other than the satisfaction of helping others. LFG chat is another indicator of how many people want to do dungeons, and I use /who to see how successful those attempts have been. I’ve noticed there are different on-going narratives, because some people have shared their nice experiences, but when you introduce some social effects, then it all makes sense.
I have no idea what it’s like in older classic servers, but adding RDF for the reasons I’m hearing (leveling is boring, questing is tedious) would add another layer to those in the long run. If people would acknowledge the intrinsic value in the leveling process, they could become more motivated to do so. And I truly believe that no extrinsic value can overcome the lack of motivation.
It’s close to communism, forcing everyone to live in poverty instead of letting people make their own choices.
The anti-RDF crowd are a bunch of tyrants dead set on controlling the experience of other people by being against an optional feature that they themselves dont have to participate in.