The AI followers in 10.2.5 ptr are pretty good so far. Though there's a few things i want

  1. First and foremost, the healer is pretty bad. Specifically the tauren druid, but others as well if there is others. I’ve seen so many times that the healer didn’t heal the party and even let some of the ai controlled characters die. And that is also when i’m not tanking. I would like the healer to be a bit more responsive in their heals.
  2. Shamans/Mage AI popping hero/lust, NOT at the last boss but, at every boss it seems. This shouldn’t need to happen except for the last boss.
  3. Really wish there’s more ways to control the AI other then simple “i’l lead/you lead” toggle. Like idk, make us go kind of half RTS here with a dedicated AI bar or something. As well controlling the speed.
  4. Only tested in Ruby Life Pools but… AI standing on the ledge sometimes. I think they shouldn’t do that. Not out of because it looks weird, but in the event if they get knocked off.
  5. No Voices for them saying “Get clear” or such alike.
  6. And minor, but, more reactions from emotes. Like if i slap them, they cry or /rude at me.

Otherwise, it’s pretty dang good for what the AI followers does. :slight_smile:

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These are some great notes!

Lets also have those followers be our other characters. #FreeTheWarband

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even just as a skin option this would be super cool and immersive. like they can be specced however the AI needs to be but doing a dungeon with characters modelled after my characters would be super cool

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So not a general AI, going forward every instance will now require additional development time to implement?

Well… i say that, but in my testing, i yet to see them be knocked off. So maybe Knockback is disabled on them.

More matter of factly, i was talking about in terms how would players do in that situation, given we don’t often stick on the edge of ledges for the reason of not being knocked back. That and immersion-wise it looks werid.

Also, can i ask what is wrong with more dev time?.. It leads for a more polished experience. And i think it’s not something we should handwave it away, pretending we know more about what Blizzard does then blizzard themselves. Blizzard can do this without so much a hitch to the normal ever developing content like PvE, PvP ,and so on if that’s your concern.

If it’s the case that every instance will need tailored AI tuning moving forward, then every instance will require tailored AI tuning moving forward.

I’m a little skeptical of this. What’s it’s purpose? What’s it trying to solve? Would having AI make doing world quests better? Torghast? Horific visions? Does it add any replay ability? Or in the end are they going to be really expensive NPCs running around behind you and you just end up with another solo experience that get’s old very very quickly?

Is it intended to be training as a stepping stone to doing group content, or is meant to replace it? Will it give worse loot than the group content, in which case it will just be another torghast, fun for a week, or will it give the same rewards as group content, in which case it turns the end game into torghast, fun for a week.

So it seems like it may be committing the devs to a lot of expensive long term developement with dubious ROI and possible game killing social changes.

Most bots in other games use waypoints to help them path complex areas. I have been running on the assumption the waypoints are either too close to the edge or there are not enough of them and so they try to go straight from one to another in a straight line.

I have seen them have more flexibility during boss fights. That said…, that needs more work. I have a strong suspicion that a lot of they AoEs do not affect them.

I am hopeful they will get better and get spread to old dungeons as well.

As I have said elsewhere though, taking them past normal difficulty would be a bad idea. At normal, there is no major advantage from just doing it that way. At say, mythic, that is getting free runs for easy rewards. Not a good thing.

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…I mean, should they not do any time on the new features and just release them buggy and werid looking then?..

I’m curious on why you think this sounds like something that will result in a worse game here given how you’ve said this and going about “Expensive”.

It’s just dungeon goer AI. Follower dungeons.

Basicly, it seems to be there as an either alternative to normal dungeons (Well i would use it on my healer personally) or as a practice mode, or just a way to complete dungeon quests.

I would imagine they will need hints for things like when to group for soak, when not to, when to attack CC’d team mates, when not to, when to run in as ranged for hopping mobs… And can they tank? So when to LoS pull, when to charge…

How are some of the players going to take this? I would assume there’s a portion with expectations that this is going to give them access to end game loot without doing the end game. If it does that will be a disaster for the game, it it doesn’t they’ll be upset.

Again with the “OMG, they’re getting endgame experience!” argument.

Why does it matter to people how other people see endgame? Good grief, play the game your way and let others play their way. It doesn’t affect you in the least.

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Idk, it’s just a guess. :man_shrugging:

That’s a completely different topic.

Were talking about AI follower improvements in the follower dungeons.

Because if it becomes the path of least resistance, that’s what everyone will do.

And if everyone is doing that, then the end game becomes that.

And then, instead of all the problems and benefits of co-op game play, we get a repetitive single player experience.

Instead of all the variation and unexpected situations you get and the “oh, never seen anyone do something that dumb,” or “Wow, that’s a much better way of doing it” we essentially get torghast with NPC helpers. Sounds great short term. Don’t need to bother with having to find a group. But after a couple weeks of running Torghast with NPC’s do you want to play the game anymore?

Now if it’s used as a learning tool or it’s kept entirely separate from end game loot progression, fine, no problem with it.

I would just say “Slippery Slope fallacy” here, but, giving it another read, it sounds like you want people to be forcefully grouped, regardless as you’ve implied if it’s a terrible experience by describing the choice here as “Path of least resistance that everybody will take”. As well going to to describe the use of AI NPCs here as if it’s a bad thing for the game overall (Oddly enough, no complaints for Comp Stomp or Island Expedition AI when they started showing up) and go on to ask " But after a couple weeks of running Torghast with NPC’s do you want to play the game anymore?", as if you’re expecting players to only dislike this… :roll_eyes:

The point of the follower dungeons is just to add as an alternative to normal dungeons and just that. It’s there to complete WQ’s, a safe environment for new players, or just to run though. And from my experience, it’s WAY slower then a normal dungeon group given how safe the NPC’s play here.

I highly doubt Blizzard would budge on this being used more then just normal dungeons. Or beyond LFR raids if they have too. And nowhere in my topic where i’ve said i want them beyond normal dungeons.

So i honestly don’t get whats with this sudden jump to conclusions here. It’s just making wacky guesses with no grounding in validity in reality or evidence that it will actually go that route. It’s the reason why i choose to wait and see what happens, like i’ve did with Trading Post. :man_facepalming:

Oh, and Slippery Slope fallacy.

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And that’s a player problem, not a game problem.

PUGs are horrific in the gaming world. That has absolutely nothing to do with game design.

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They should also add an autopilot option for rotation.

You toggle “on” the autopilot and it goes through your rotation for you while you control the movement.

Or maybe vice versa, have an autopilot control the movement while you worry about the rotation. Might save some people from dying to greeding.

I just tried to do a follower dungeon on the PTR server. The first mob in Ruby Life Pools, the rock guy, one-shot my tank and everyone else in the party. This is the normal version, which I’ve done many times.

Skill issue?

At this point, I am fairly sure that the update messed up quite a bit of stuff. Before the patch, when I did RLP, it was easy and no one got near dying. If they are dying easily now, bad patch.

when I ran Brakenhide the other day after work it seemed to be pretty decent. I kinda treated it like some others would. I went afk to see what would happen, one dps died and the whole party about wiped. But I think most of the Items you would like to see improved maybe set way because, I believe they are designed to be training dungeons. they give gear equal to normals, but very little xp. I ran as a DPS, I thought i might try and see how well it goes as a tank just to see
Maybe on the healing they have it simulating a new healer?

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