Nope, nothing is wrong with it. It’s the lowest priority ability I use and there is plenty of time to use it. My guess is you aren’t hitting your rotation and using abilities on cd/fast enough because you’d have to be pretty slow to not take advantage of it.
welp, lets agree to disagree. since we cant really look at our testing. this is a sim robot matter, but i highly doubt cs aa will lose given the history of aa talents
As a returning WoW Ret Paladin player (been a few years since I’ve played), I’m seriously digging the conversation. I believe both of you are bringing up excellent points to your argument and from what I’m gathering, both choices seem to be good ones, just depends on the person’s play style. It appears I came back just at the right time because, unless they seriously nerf us, it looks to be an exciting time for us Ret Paladins.
Thank you gentlemen for BOTH your insights. It’s helping me out greatly.
The new talent is looking incredibly fun and promising but, as others already pointed out, spamming Crusader Strike is very inefficient as it is the weakest generator ability of Ret’s kit. You better off pressing Blade of Justice, Hammer of Wrath or Judgment on cooldown.
Another issue is that we will usually be drowning on holy power, making it hard to get maximum benefit of the holy power generation of Templar Strikes.
No, I’m not agreeing to disagree because you’re just wrong. I’m not trying to be a jerk, but if you aren’t able to effectively get in the 3rd hit .5 GCD on Templar Strikes without disrupting the rest of the rotation you ARE doing something wrong.
They’re completely right though [for PvE, no idea about PvP]. Unless you’re purposely, or accidentally, playing wrong by prioritizing CS/Templar over Judgment/BoJ, you shouldn’t be getting to and using the 3rd combo consistently, with using the 2nd being just be relatively rare as well.
1 Like
i mean you’ll eventually get the 3rd hit in. eventually. like in live CS is still your lowest priority button, ts is your lowest priority button in ptr. look at how little cs you press on a 5 min dummy test. not to be a jerk or anything. but if you find yourself consistently pressing CS on live and now in ptr then YOU are doing something wrong
As long as TS’s damage is similar to BoJ + CS, I don’t see people choosing to cast BoJ first, since the amount of HoPo generated in a small amount of time is the same.
but ts dam isnt close to boj+ cs
2 Likes
It’s closer than we think I’d say, we’re also in the tuning phase which means this is the time where the damage will be normalized.
1 Like
First, You’ve brought this up multiple times now. Who said they are consistently pressing CS on live? Not me. You using it to bolster your own argument and attack mine is basically a strawman. CS is much more relevant on the PTR than live. I would agree with you on many of the points you are making about CS on live… It is definitely an issue if somebody is consistently pressing CS on live in basically ANY form of content.
Secondly, the issue wasn’t about pressing CS as the lowest priority button or any other of that other nonsense you keep bringing up that I’m not using as an argument. It was about working in a .5 second CS global into a rotation. Which you seemingly just admitted you can do now. VoJ may be the issue, which is something I did not consider until now.
I definitely would like to see Templar Strikes to be the priority button we use in melee combat - weaving in BoJ for the dot damage and Judgment for empowering our spenders. Hoping to see some really good tuning on this ability.
I think Templar Strikes is a great idea, but needs more iteration.
1 Like
its really not. i hate to break it to you but cs or ts is still your lowest priority button. even with its .5 gcd on the LAST click of the combo. voj is the issue, this new downtime problem comes directly from voj. templar is a bandage fix to it, and it doesnt even do it good. because again cs aa adds alot of damage and makes all your cs passive, so you dont feel bad ignoring it.
do you know how strong is a 5 hopo ds with empyr power? or how strong it will be when the bug is fixed? do you know how powerful it will be because it can proc divine purpose. do you know how trivial physical pressence becomes when your passively generating a stack every aa?
ts just improves fluidity at the cost of tons of damage. because it inherited every issue cs has on live
So you say CS is not more relevant in PTR than live, then you go on to basically say it is needed for a VoJ build because of “downtime” and then label it a “problem”. Even if it is the lowest priority ability (which doesn’t matter), you JUST agreed with me it is relevant in certain setups dude. lol
If you don’t like it, that’s fine. Literally all your other issues can be answered with tuning - it’s the PTR.
your not getting it, ts like cs. provides on demand hopo generation. its still lowest priority filler. but with who CS AA works. you wont even take TS with voj. because its a huge loss of damage and potential damage.
i never said ts was needed for voj, just that it makes the rotation more fluid. which isnt enough to make it wanted. if the dps difference is like 1-2% then sure ts would be a viable option. but its not. everything adds up to cs aa’s favor
tuning cant fix it without gutting empyr power and divine purpose for everything else. tuning can make physical pressence not apply with cs aa, but then cs aa still wins out due to the other talents. tuning is more than just a turning knob effecting damage. when you tune one ability, you have to keep in mind the other 5 talents connect to it.
the easiest option to tune would be voj. but not really, because if you make it do less damage than its cost. then its a dead talent. you remove voj then TS is more dead than it is now. cause it wont even do its “fluidity” benefit
Sorry bud, I’m finding myself rejecting almost everything you say on literally every sentence. I reject your assertion tuning can’t fix the TS issue, ESPECIALLY if it turns out it is a DPS loss over CS. Absolutely nothing wrong with turning up those damage numbers on TS or iterating on its current design further.
they would have to tune ts up by a metric ton for it to stand a chance with cs aa
Back in Legion Blizzard changed Divine Purpose to only reduce the cost of spenders by 3 HoPo, to stop people from using procs on Justicar’s Vengeance. Which earlier parts of Legion did a bit more damage than TV.
At some point the functionality of DP was reverted to making your next spender free, but Blizzard might go with a similar solution of reducing HoPo cost if VoJ proves to be too strong with EP/DP.
then dp becomes a dead talent for voj. which is very concerning