If it were just Horde they’d know where they are going. Why waste ships pursing something that you know where they are going and can immediately retaliate against especially when you have the sea superiority as far as you know? You wouldn’t. I wouldn’t. You’d just hit their base with retaliation.
Dude you make no sense I would absolutely pursue them.
The Alliance almost caught them too but then Talanji did her deus ex machina thing and got away.
That is a bit silly when its the Blood elves and Nightbourne that have been at war with trolls longer than the Alliance has exsisted. Besides the alliance has worked with the Zandalar before back in Vanilla and also assisted Vol’jin in massacring the trolls in Cata. Alliance may have trollbane but The horde have killed just as many trolls.
Maybe she refused to Talk? Maybe Zul told her not to? who knows but I doubt Anduin would have refused to speak with her if she had asked.
The Zandalar were already at war with the Alliance due to Zuls actions we never made peace with them afterwards. Secondly The Alliance doesn’t attack until they assist Horde start attacking Kultiras. So no she wasn’t careful about anything. They actively provoked the Alliance into attacking them and that is on her.
So…let me get this straight. You are saying that instead of reaching out to the Horde she should’ve gone to the Alliance. Instead of going to the faction that had Trolls in its very membership, go to the faction that had people named Trollbane in its leadership. Instead of going with the faction that would have a better understanding of Troll culture by virtue of their Troll membership, to go to the faction whose most numerous members have literally been fighting them since they appeared. That’s what you are saying? Really?
At least with the Horde she had a foot in the door through the Darkspear.
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Okay, hold up, putting on my Faction-Neutral Lore Referee hat, I don’t think that’s technically true. The Alliance has been in a state of war with trolls as a species, like, forever.
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She should have reached out to both groups as a Neutral party, She should have pushed to have Zul arrested for his actions in pandaria and during Cata. Then she probably would have been welcomed by the Alliance.
You do realize that the Darkspear and Vol’jin were the ones rallying both alliance and Horde against the Zandalar back in Cata, not to mention Vol’jin was also fighting them in Pandaria?
Claiming just because the Horde has trolls they are instantly more approachable is silly. Especially considering the Horde was being lead at the time by a Undead blood elf. I mean trolls hate Elves and elves hate them not to mention the Zandalar don’t like undead. Yet Anduin who is also a priest of the light and welcoming of all people apparently isn’t a good person to approach?
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im having a real hard time believing that Talanji/rastakhan knew exactly what Zul was up to in cata/mists. If they did, they would not have brought Zul along as an ambassador to the Horde. As you mention, Zul pissed off both the horde and alliance, so why bring him? He is the literal last person Zandalar should send.
When Rokhan saw Zul during the prison escape, he wanted nothing to do with either one of them.
Keep in mind Zandalar is an extremely isolated island nation. They did not exactly have the internet.
It is petty but truth. You would approach the group that members of your own race in it first before any group that has none of your race in it. It’s a simple fact of being a person.
Why would she do any of these things when her father, the guy that has all the actual power, didn’t do it? He doesn’t even listen when Talanji calls for him to act on the very clear threats in Zandalar. Also she went with Horde first for the above reason.
Because Zul was acting on his own. Without the king’s permission. Why would Talanji or the king care that Zul got his teeth kicked in and came limping home? Much less who did it. They just wanted their navy back.
Also this.
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Well again that is still on her for traveling with the guy, I mean we know they were aware of the actions of Zul on thunder isle as NPC’s discuss it in BFA.
Even if we presume they don’t know what Zul was up to it is still on them for being so completely clueless about it and for not asking any of their people or other troll tribes what happen. I mean its just stupid to blame the Alliance for any of their actions if they are such inept rulers they don’t know what they’re people are upto.
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I’m a bit sad that there weren’t more explanations for how much Rastakhan, Talanji, and the people still in Zandalar knew or approved of Zul’s plans.
In the intro sequence where the player runs with Talanji, there’s a lot of NPC comments about her and a bunch of excited little kids yelling and running after her. I wish they’d included something similar for Zul - either citizens asking for his latest vision to show how popular he is, or ones angrily yelling at him for what he’s done to show that they know about his actions.
This fuzzy unknown area -could- be an interesting plot, where the Alliance thinks the Zandalari are fully supportive of Zul’s ambitions for troll conquest while the Horde thinks/knows differently, but it’s never used this way. It’s just another lost opportunity for showing the factions’ non-idiotic reasons for fighting each other.
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I don’t think Sylvanas cares what Zul was upto prior to BFA, she just cares about winning the war and need’s their fleet to do so.
I mean at this point Sylvanas is likely an old god lackey as well considering the whole dagger fiasco/ Ashvane condrum. She could have been cahoots with Zul from the beginning.
Planning on aiding an enemy nation state is grounds for the Alliance to go to war with the Zandalari.
No, but it’d be useful to know the rest of the Horde’s opinions, and the Zandalari’s own view.
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That would require Blizzard to address the Elephant in the room so they are just ignoring it. Part of the reason why the writing is so terrible this expac.
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i don’t know, i kinda like her.
i like that her inexperience and being completely outsmarted by a more experienced leader (nazmir) is what lead to the death of her father.
and that she payed the consequences for her action, making the zandalari be friendly with the horde means that the alliance is your enemy.
a valid character flaw.
it would be nice if they didn’t make voljin randomly show up to say how cool she is but fine, whatever.
i don’t think that she is a hypocrite when she wasn’t really okay with derek being raised to kill jaina even she was the one who actually sacked her city and killed his father.
when zul actually did the same thing to her with rezan.
So she know what is like that they use the bodies of someone that you care against you.
What truly bothers me here is.
How and why exatly she got captured by the alliance?
how sylvanas knew about her existence?
why anduin didn’t tried to talk to her or something like that?
in the end i just think that blizzard did everything in their power to make the zandalari join the horde.
I’m not sure I’d call what happened in Nazmir “being completely outsmarted.”
Grand Ma’da Ateena’s success relied largely upon the cheap game mechanics tactic of drawing out conflict by becoming spontaneously invulnerable at low health and running away. About five times throughout the zone’s story.
It honestly cheapened the whole arc there for me and made her come across like a hollow and pathetic villain being falsely propped up by the narrative to seem more intimidating and “clever” than she really was. There’s nothing clever about the lame and overused “ENOUGH!” (Becomes invulnerable somehow at 1-10% health despite never doing so during the actual fight) “Ha ha ha! I’ll finish you off later! See ya!” trope at this point. Especially when the story finally ends with the baddie suddenly and inexplicably not being able to do that same thing during the final encounter. It’s just sloppy and feels like artificial and unnecessary drama.
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Imprisoning Zul is fine. But Talanji has never raised a hand against the Alliance. We learned in Pandaria that Zul was acting on his own so the Alliance have no excuse to hold a member of the royal family.
Also how would the Alliance know Zul was on board or what he even looked like? For all they know hes just random troll 28831 hell chances are they never realized he was Zul while he was in prison.
They attacked and imprisoned them because they were Trolls thats it.
How would they know Talanji was a member of the royal family if that is your point? If they Knew who Talanji is they know who Zul is and if they are traveling together to seek an allegiance with the Horde of course they are asking to be locked up.
They were literally captured en route to Orgrimar after the Whole War of thorns. They basically decided “Hey the Horde just instigated a world war against the Alliance, lets go ally with them and not expect the Alliance to do anything to us!” I mean how stupid does she need to be to think this? How can she not see that she brought this fate down on her people?
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well… i was actually talking about the alliance attack prior to dazarlazor.
we know that it was a move so the main fleet could attack from another direction.
i honestly don’t know much about the horde story in zuldazar but i saw the war campaign.
and do you have any kind of proof or is just some headcannon?.
We learned the opposite in Pandaria.
Lorewalker Cho explains in The Zandalari Prophecy that Zul had assembled the Golden Fleet with Rastakhan’s blessing, for the express purpose of finding a new home for their people if the foreseen Cataclysm struck.
The only thing we know Zul did without Rastakhan’s blessings was resurrect Lei Shen, because Rastakhan had expressly forbidden him from doing that specific thing. The overall deal with the mogu however, fit directly into the purpose behind Rastakhan giving him the Golden Fleet; the land promised to the Zandalari by the mogu could potentially serve as a new home for their people if they had to evacuate Zandalar.
They attacked and imprisoned Zul and Talanji because at that time, the Alliance and Horde both had every reason to treat Zandalar as a hostile nation, and so they intercepted and captured a ship from that hostile nation. The writers just decided they just had to have Horde-playable Zandalari, so suddenly the Horde forgot about everything they knew up to that point about the Zandalari and assumed an empire whose agents had been instigating assaults upon their lands and soldiers throughout Cataclysm and Mists of Pandaria was really just a neutral party waiting to be recruited.
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