Survival Hunter - The Commando Rework

Hello everyone!

I’ve been a Survival Hunter since day 3 of vanilla. I used to enjoy using Ravager from SM to spin like an idiot or dual wielding the BWL axes to offtank with Aspect of The Monkey.

Eventually, the class homogenized into a weird sniper class with exploit weakness, then a multistrike dot class, then eventually the melee class that we’ve known today. But lately, it seems like Survival has lost it’s identity and fantasy. Are we meant to be a primarily ranged class who’s only melee because mongoose bite and raptor strike need aspect of the eagle to go ranged?

I’ve always considered Survival to hold the fantasy of two primary inspirations:

The Predator and John Rambo

So what does that mean? I feel like it means that Survival Hunters should be able to obscure themselves from damage, heal themselves (and maybe others) with advanced first aid, the utilization of traps to disable or damage enemies, and the use of other non-conventional warfare.

I’m not exactly the best at organizing everything into a formal spec with trees and everything, so I’m just going to talk about some ideas for this concept.

Sawed Off/Stabilizing Stock (Talent) - Allow guns and crossbows to equipped as an offhand for x% of the weapon damage

This would allow for Survival Hunters to equip a 1h sword of knife with a sidearm for ranged abilities (like Arcane Shot that just sits in our spellbooks unused.)

Aspect of The Bear (Stance?/Ability) - Provide 5% stamina. Every 3rd melee strike, apply a bleed to enemy that heals the hunter for 1%

(I know the math is probably bad, but walk with me here.) Hunters have a massive issue with survivability. Aspect of The Monkey was more of an evasion tank ability in vanilla that was undercooked, but this could help be more effective in high damage melee situations.

Aspect of The Hawk (Stance?/Ability) - Provide 5% attack speed. Ranged auto-attacks increase in damage every 3 shots

While Bear provides more survivability in a more dangerous situation, Hawk focuses more on speed at range. Since ranged weapons have reduced damage for being offhand, the speed should balance out with the damage.

Field Dressing (Ability) - Channeled 10% health over 5sec. Can be cast on allies within 3yds. Must be standing still during channeling

An effective self heal at the expense of standing still. It’s not good enough to replace healers, but effective in emergency situations. Think of it as an alternate healing utility like healthstones.

Light Em Up (Talent) - Flare and Wildfire Bomb ignite Tar Trap, causing increased slow and a burning DoT

An expanded version of Soulforge Embers. It was a neat idea then if a little clunky. Wildfire Bomb igniting the trap would make it a bit less clunky.

Full Auto (Ability 3min CD) - Next ranged ability used fires 3-5 consecutive times automatically

A twist on the old multistrike idea.

Return of Bear Trap, Snake Trap, and Explosive Trap

More damage and crowd control through proper placement. Return of more fun traps.

Just some ideas I’m mulling around. Like I said, I’m not good enough to make a full blown spec, but have a general idea of what would be interesting. Thoughts?

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Is this an implication that SV started off distinct and became more similar to the other specs over time? Because that’s absolutely false.

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Wyvern Sting didn’t become a capstone talent until several patches later into vanilla.

Initially it was a melee spec. Here’s the original launch talent tree:

http://www.classicwowtalents.appspot.com/index.html?talent=1124125_3

Would you like to tell me how talents like Improved Wing Clip, Deterrence, Deflection, Counterattack, Melee Specialization, and Lacerate implies that Survival was never a melee spec?

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Don’t even begin to try to “educate” me about classic. I know very well about the initial tree.

We started with a ranged weapon, a fully capable ranged weapon toolkit, and agility giving double ranged attack power for every point of melee attack power. In comparison our melee toolkit was extremely limited in both scope and damage.

Here is the original manual page for our class:

Those Survival talents were for situational melee usage, not for a dedicated melee playstyle that abandoned the ranged weapon like in modern WoW. We had a minimum range on our abilities which meant in PvP people would try to close the gap; they figured it was helpful to have melee boosts for those situations. Survival was also equipped with several mechanics to help it escape back to ranged and it was the best-equipped of the three for kiting.

In Classic all three specs were the same basic identity and playstyle, with only passive differences between them. To describe the consistent and substantial divergence that occurred each expansion after as “homogenisation” is lunacy.

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My guy, I literally played from day 3. Not “classic,” the actual vanilla when it started.

You had to buy a ranged weapon. As a dwarf, I started with an axe. You didn’t even get to tame a pet until lvl 10.

I showed you the actual talent tree from the game.

I realize you have this weird obsession about going into every SV thread to go off about what you think SV was since the beginning, but I literally lived it. You’re objectively wrong here.

Take the L.

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You don’t even have the feat of strength for getting Private rank in Vanilla. You only have the BC launch event one. So I don’t really believe your supposed classic WoW experience. You’re most likely inventing it like every other self-described “vanilla melee Hunter”. Especially when you claim to have used it for offtanking.

I have seen that talent tree plenty of times. It did not give you the requirements to fulfil a melee playstyle. Because it wasn’t meant to. Even if it did, the fact that it didn’t even make it a year into classic should tell you something about the validity of melee Hunters.

You’re the one that should take the L for your bad class suggestions.

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You realize that not everyone wanted to play PvP right?

Worst troll in this subforum.

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Did you bring melee Hunter to PvE?

What part of “offtank” do you not understand?

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I’m aware of that claim. I consider it to be a lie because it’s ridiculous.

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Damn no ZG feat? Starting to figure out why you don’t know about the early days.

No Hand of A’dal either? You must have started in Wrath.

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I like you very much :slight_smile:

This made my night.

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I have feats from Vanilla. I did not do any serious raiding. L take.

You’re the one claiming SV was a melee spec. Remind me again what Agility did for the class?

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You might have some feats from Vanilla, but it sure as hell wasn’t from playing hunter.

To answer your question, increases AP, armor, and crit chance IIRC. It was 20 years ago so I’m rusty.

We also needed intellect for mana.

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sv hunters cant even make it to 70 now before they post their redesigns

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Richard Cranium RSV loyalists can’t even go 5 minutes before they derail another MSV post.

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Glad that you posted this. I been looking for some information about Hunter’s trees before 1.7.

I really wanted feedback on my commando idea too :frowning:

Apologies. I generally don’t participate in any of the rework or theory-crafting ideas in the forums. Some of your ideas here could be pretty cool, and I can appreciate the immersion factor you are trying to suggest. I myself play my Hunter as a Bounty Hunter of sorts; removing pests and troublesome beings from the land kind of thing. Lastly, I also don’t participate in these topics because you can absolutely count on certain individuals to arrive and ruin the conversation. As you can clearly see above and in other posts in the Hunter forum.

I hope you are enjoying MSV in its current iteration.