At least glyphs were player made and everyone could get their hands on the ones they wanted when they wanted them. The rest of the stuff was all random drops and such with later items dropping with the wrong stats and was just a shard. But I see the logic in your thoughts.
Glyphs were cool, but they were borrowed power. Its just how borrowed power should have been implemented. Never heard a bad thing about glyphs because they werent RNG - well scribes obtaining them was but that’s not the point. Being able to add changes and additional power to abilities is super fun. Making the choices on those additions RNG is not fun. I like talent trees because I decide what I get - though there really is a very few choices on the matter. Legion weapons were talent trees with no choices, so they were not fun. MoPs interation of the current talent tree was fun because Blizzard balanced each of the 3 choices. It became stale in shadowlands because you no longer got to decide what to go with because the other 2 options sucked.
TLDR; While the earliest iterations of systems did lead to the crap in retail, the removal of choice is what also removed the fun.
People quit in cata because the content was hard and casuals couldn’t clear the content therefore they quit. Also lack of content.
Mop could have been the greatest expansion ever If it wasnt about pandas, that’s why that expansion is looked down upon
I think this is the most fair and logical opinion of them all. Well put
Honestly, I think the biggest problem WoW has is addons. I know it’s popular to blame Blizzard for everything (for which they are definitely culpable) but the players themselves are at fault as well. One of the first changes was achievements. I pugged a lot in TBC, I made some friends in various guilds who would bring me along for T6 raids if they were short a DPS. I took a break and came back a couple of months into Wrath, got to 80, and found that I couldn’t pug any raids without the achievement. Joining a guild became almost mandatory.
Now, you can blame Blizzard if you want. But the community took this tool and decided to use it for gatekeeping purposes. Suddenly the game wasn’t about people having fun, but about people being optimal. In TBC, people would join a random Kara just to do something with random people, help out some undergeared 70s to get some tier pieces. In Wrath, at least on my server, people found a guild or they didn’t raid.
With the implementation of heroic modes, people went for extreme min-maxing. You had to be the right class, the right spec when it simply wasn’t that big of a deal before. We all had guildies or friends we carried through Naxx and Ulduar, and that was fine. Then the community decided that if you weren’t the right spec, you weren’t useful enough. So your choices were to conform or be left behind. Looking back, I think many of us can agree it probably didn’t need to be that way.
As the game went on, each balance patch sees some DPS or healer become subpar to the others, so no one will take them on their raids or their Mythic+ runs. People have dozens of add-ons that help them in ways we couldn’t even imagine back in Wrath. Add-ons to pick your gear, make groups for quests, and then we bring all of those add-ons and elitist gatekeeping attitudes right into Classic.
The biggest enemy of the WoW community is the WoW community.
The remaining items greyed out before I could finish.
I truly wasn’t selecting every single item, there are a few that I didn’t see a problem with, but most of them I did.
But I won’t be able to submit my response because things like “Simplified Talent System” are clearly among the worst offenders yet I run out of selections before I even make it to that point in the list, and I’m not going to try to figure out which are the 17 things that I care about the most.
BTW I can think of one very important one that you missed: previous raid tiers are no longer relevant in retail because ilvl is mostly the only thing that matters. Whereas in classic you have items like DST that are BiS for some classes for an entire expansion, so those old raids are always relevant and the most dedicated guilds will continue running them to kit out their players.
Ooh, I totally forgot about Glyphs, good call out. I’ll see if I can add that as an option without erasing all of the votes so far.
Totally agree with you on that. Glyphs were basically like “side-specs”, they played almost the same role as spending talent points, but it was driven by a profession and therefore felt a little bit like an extra piece of personal “progression” that wasn’t just baked into your kit by virtue of hitting max level. And the simple fact that they created cosmetic-only glyphs was also very fun, I think.
Honestly, I really loved the original state of Cataclysm 5-man heroics. The difficulty was high enough that it slightly tickled the part of my brain that lights up when I’m raiding. I was very disappointed when they nerfed them.
Sorry, the intent wasn’t to make choosing your options puzzle-like, I just didn’t want anyone auto-selecting all of the options, especially since the point of the poll was to find out which of the changes were the most important to people. I figured allowing people to choose about half of all the options would be good enough to see some trends emerge. And interestingly enough, many people actually didn’t even use half of the votes available.
Ah, good point.
heroics weren’t hard…
doing them with dumb random bots that got used to aoe spam entire dungeons because wrath dungeon design and LFD … that is why cata heroics were seen as hard
if you did them with friends or something it was farily easy
All that your survey design accomplishes here is discarding the responses of people who may think that many/most/all of these things are a significant problem.
You shouldn’t try to correct for what you perceive to be inaccurate responses, that’s not how polls work.
I’d say they were fairly hard. And yes, it was because it’s difficult to coordinate multi-phase fights with actual mechanics with people who you don’t know and can’t talk to in voice chat. 
If I ask for which option is most significant and people are able to choose literally every option, the inaccuracy isn’t just perceived. I could’ve done a “pick your top 3” but instead it’s “pick your top half”. Same concept, much less strict.
Who is going to try to check every single option though? It looks like your survey has around a hundred responses or more by now. Do you really think all of the people who took the time to fill it out are just going to check every box without reading it?
You’re worried about a problem that doesn’t exist, and you’re creating a greater problem by under-weighting the less popular responses. There are people that have thoughtful reasons that they’d like to vote for these, but they can’t because your survey doesn’t allow them to.
I mean. I can say for sure nobody is, because I removed the ability to do that.
I’m worried about absolutely nothing.
That’s kind of the point. I wanted to see which individual responses emerged as being the most commonly chosen ones among the voters. I’m not trying to find out which one was the LEAST significant (that would require me to add literally every single change made to WoW from TBC to MoP anyway).
For me, the biggest pull to Classic is realm community. Retail broke realm communities over time including:
- LFD/LFR
- Cross-realm zones
- Phasing
- Group finder
- War mode (this killed my retail realm)
This is primarily the reason I am sticking with Classic. Really happy to see that they are not going to implement LFD.
3 Likes
For me it was 100 percent RDF and LFR i remmember the world changing to ppl just standing in dalaraan queing as opposed to being out in the world doing stuff.
2 Likes
tbf rdf would be fine
but without the teleport and xrealm crap
At that point, it would be useless for most of the people who are demanding it. And I still wouldn’t want a feature to automatically build groups anyway. So pretty much nobody wins if that happens.
oh look another megapop player that doesn’t want crossrealm RDF. just because your server is bloated with players doesn’t mean the other 30+ servers are.
1 Like
people who demand it are a bunch of rogues
that think they will get insta dungeons but dont realize they will be staring at the Q for 45 minutes or more…
I really wish they didnt abandon the glyph system. It has so much potential and there is still so much potential for cosmetic additions. If classic+ happens I really hope glyphs are an auto include because I miss quite a few things that were removed and never brought back in any borrowed power iteration. faerie fire being a ranged interrupt for bear was something I had a very hard time letting go.
retail poster