You can push mythic keys without having to raid. I don’t know why people can’t understand this.
The shard effect is completely insignificant without the domination bonus being active and guess what? It’s not active in mythic+ so there is literally no advantage to getting domination gear for players that only do mythic+, it’s not necessary in the slightest.
Except PVP and PVE are completely different animals so it makes sense to keep them separate and that’s only a recent thing since the Blizz devs wanted progression to be content agnostic.
I think we need less walls between players and we don’t need WOW to become a giant gaming mall. It’s already questionable to call WOW an MMO-RPG anymore. It’s at risk of becoming a Lobby game that you log into for an hour here and there.
A) lol
B) lol
C) People already wear 239 vein rippers, 246 jaythis, 239 defense matrix, 239 dom gear, Sylvanas Hunter Bow etc. Hell, people still use 226 Cheat Death because there’s still no good alternative from M+. Heroic gear is already insanely good for being able to get 4 pieces in one night while hammered.
LMAO.
You act like those same players aren’t hammered or high doing their 15’s each week which they can fail but still get rewards. And they can do it any time of the day or night with no lockouts.
With Valor upgrades, no loot lockouts and the Vault Mythic Plus is far more lucrative than getting one chance a week at a Heroic Raid piece. Get real.
I’m sorry but you’re wrong. Since BFA it’s been M+ or you can’t raid. The past few guilds I’ve joined massively out gear the raids by the time we clear them because of m+ Gear inflation.
I think the best solution for both sides is to make the gear acquired in each unusable in the other.
I.E raid tiers sets have their ilvl reduced in keystones
Keystone gear has its ilvl reduced in raiding environment.
Personally, I don’t care for keystones much anymore. I loved them during legion but now that they have designed dungeons around them I find the dungeons very unsatisfying and I burn out fast running the same content over and over again with slightly adjusted numbers (imagine having to do the leveling story again once you hit cap on “heroic questing” then “mythic questing.)
Lol, %%%% off. We’re talking about the best possible M+ gear, the type of gear that drops at the end of your M22 or your M24, being on par with (or worse than) Heroic Terragrue loot. Don’t tell me to get real, you get real, lol. M+ gear is a joke. It’s been a joke for a while. Imagine actually thinking M+ gear is OP. Actual kekw. You gave me a good laugh.
Ease up there broseph. This is the new rated “E” WOW. Who’s this “we” btw? You mean you and you alone.
Why are you even talking about something that doesn’t exist? This thread is talking about the CURRENT state of the game not your wish list about rewarding beyond 15’s.
Can you upgrade Heroic Raid gear with Valor?
Does doing a full clear of the Raid on Heroic give you a 252 piece at the end of the week in the Vault? And reward that whether you time a key or not?
Can players run the Raid and get drops over and over each week?
For the average player Mythic Plus is the obvious choice for gearing. The only thing Raid gear has going for it right now is Dom Sockets and even Raiders hate that system.
236 gear. That’s the best gear you can farm from keys. M22 drops 236 gear. What are YOU talking about?
Do you know how M+ even works?
Valor upgrades Dungeon pieces to 246 genius.
Do you know how Mythic Plus even works?
I know you know you can upgrade m+ gear to 246
And just like how Mythic raid gear is time-gated by lock-out, Valor upgrades are time-gated by an actual time-gated currency. “Infinite farm no lockout” is a dead/tired meme.
At this point it’s just beating a dead horse, the same exact bad takes being posted for the last three months. Nobody cares if you’re salty that your raid leader told you to farm Phial. Nobody actually cares. What actually matters to this game is whether people can have fun playing M+, considering M+ is one of the largest communities in this game at this point.
It’s that simple. If people aren’t having fun with M+, raiders can’t “argue” M+ers into having fun. They’ll just quit, the game will suffer, and then Blizzard will nerf your raid gear to bring M+ers back just as they did in 9.0.
you’re picking hairs. m+ gear is for all intents and purposes easily farmable 246 gear.
Sure, the upgrades are gated, but unless someone is stupid and upgrading pieces they shouldn’t, it’s a non-issue because over time you’ll have a full set of 246 gear for what is, let’s be honest, quite trivial content.
I can farm m+15 the first week the season is open, the only thing throttling me are forces otuside the game, yet, I could only do heroic SoD once.
I do both. I run m+ extensively, and mythic raid. I’m not advocating, necessarily, for m+ gear to be nerfed or changed. But I don’t think m+ gear is in a bad spot, and I do think there’s some pretty significant benefits to the farmability of m+ over raid gear.
Dom sockets are like that meme about asking your mother for something.
Mom we want sets back
We have sets at home
Sets at home:
Speaking for myself the domination gems are not as great as I thought they would be and I am certain they aren’t as great as you think they are.
Keep in mind that gem bonuses work everywhere but the Set Bonus doesn’t – it only works in Maw zones (like the raid). Also, you can get M+ gear at 252 from the vault, but unless you’re a Mythic raider you’re not getting that gear. I myself only have heroic and norm raid pieces.
So the actual difference that domination gems make in M+
If you raid, they make a difference outside of the raid but you’re at best slightly better than someone at the same ilvl in M+
Source:
https://www.raidbots.com/simbot/report/tDqfsczjhRnNn9FFkhd8cf
I can farm m+15 the first week the season is open
Neat. You can farm M15s as much as you like and the game is never going to drop 246 gear. You only get 246 gear when the game decides to open up the time-gate. It’s no different than raid loot being time-gated by lockouts.
You can do Heroic SOD once a week and get gear that exceeds 252 ilvl loot in power as well as a Vault option, and M+ can once a week get a shot at 252 Vault option as well as the time-gated 246 gear.
The DPS gems aren’t the best gems. Kyr is. Kyr has literally been nerfed by 75% in PvP because it is so good top-level players were sticking it into their template rather than using PvP gear, even though the current paradigm for PvP is intended to be “PvP gear is BIS”.
It’s nuts. One gem giving you anywhere from 12-15% extra HP depending on your ilvl is actually insane. Going off the top of my head but I think last time I looked it was basically like having a gem that gave you +400 stamina and +50 leech. Every single player would socket that gem if they could… and they can if they have dom sockets, because Kyr exists and that’s roughly what it does for you.
Side-note: All top 100 players on RIO use Kyr. So… yeah.
For M+, this won’t even really stop you from completing 20s, and a lot of players pushed high without them, or full slots.
Probably not. But it will certainly kill your motivation to push further knowing that you’re leaving a lot of the table, as compared to say 9.0 where only a very small sliver of exclusive power came from Mythic Raiding (just the weapons, trinket, and maybe one other piece if it was itemized well). That 9.0 balance was really 
Most players will never get the top SoD socketed gear, but they will have access to 252s from the Great Vault, so it’s not a good comparison. I’m 10/10M and still running 226 shoulders. I have my BiS heroic Jaithys, but a 252 is what most run anyway since it’s so comparable.
A better complaint would be how covenant and buff restrictions vastly limit group compositions, since the Dom socket argument–though technically valid–is a drop in the bucket by contrast to the problems M+ has.
lol
Covenant restrictions? This is already being lifted in 9.1.5. Like, it’s actually crazy how obsessed some people are with deflecting criticism of the raid or die elements.
As far as buffs, every single tank is currently competitive for top-tier content. Every class has competitive DPS specs. Healing is the only role that has any sort of major problem. And obviously this has been raised as an issue. But you know how easy it is to fix? You just reroll. This isn’t a barrier in the same way that something like raiding is.
Stop deflecting. It’s kind of cringe at this point, not going to lie.
See, I’m not against the idea of fun or equity in content. What I am against though is having to have multiple sets of gear cluttering up my bags in order to participate in different types of content.
This whole dumb system is going away after this raid, and not soon enough in my honest opinion.
Unpopular opinion time though: most mythic raiders are pretty much required to run at least one (if not multiple) +15s in order to participate in the content they want to focus on. I don’t have a lot of empathy for higher end m+ players that get miffed that they need to do the same. I’m not saying that it’s fair or anything, just that I’m not very sympathetic.
I wish we could all run the content that we want and not have to worry about stuff we don’t enjoy, but here we are anyway.